Two Horn Lamb Like Beast is Active Today

[shturt678]

Yes you can dispense with the water if you know what the water means. Jesus spoke to Nicodemus about water only because that was Nicodemus' understanding of water baptism by John the Baptist which was that of repentance. Repentance precedes the new birth. In other words if you don't genuinely repent of your sins you won't be open to coming to Christ, but remain an unrepentant sinner. Pray on this as I pray for your understanding how John the Baptist set the way for Christ to save sinners. Praise the Lord!

Jn.3:5, "...born of water and the Spirit..." In this specific passage contextually and grammatically it's impossible to separate the two, ie, cannot dispense with the earthly medium that is joined with the Spirit.

Just ol' old Jack's opinion

 

[shturt678]

There is no requirement that physical water be literally imposed. Jesus is merely speaking to Nicodemus in terms he understands because he knew of John the Baptist's water baptism. Therefore, the water represents repentance, and that's how people are to come to Christ to repent and believe in Him to be regenerated. Have you not done so? There are no water idols.

Jn.3:5, grammatically and contextually the one preposition has as its one object, he concept "water and Spirit," which describes water Baptism, its earthly element and its divine agency. Cannot fault me for "its all Greek to me," as this is taught in very basic 1st year ancient Greek. btw not born from above as pervasively taught today, ie, "born anew" time wise.

Thank you again, just ol' old Jack that dislikes plaster of paris water idols, ie, they dissolve too quickly. Ie there is such a thing in Europe somewhere, my sometimers again, forget?

 

[Bible2]

crosssaves said in post 118:

Jesus does not return on the 1335th day.

He could. For Daniel 12:11-12 and Revelation 16:15 could mean that 1,335 literal days after the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31), Jesus' 2nd coming will occur, and blessed are those believers who wait and remain obedient until that day. If the literal 1,260 days of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-8, Revelation 12:6) will begin when the abomination of desolation is set up, and if the 7 vials of God's wrath will begin on the day after the 1,260 days of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 11:15,19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1), and if the first 6 vials will be poured out over 30 days, then the 6th vial could be poured out on the 1,290th day after the abomination of desolation is set up (Daniel 12:11).

It's on this 1,290th day that the blessing of Daniel 12:12 and Revelation 16:15 could be given, after the 6th vial has been poured out (Revelation 16:12), encouraging those in the church who will still be alive on the earth at that time to keep holding on just 45 more days until Jesus' 2nd coming on the 1,335th day. The 45 days could be taken up by the gathering together of the world's armies to Armageddon (Revelation 16:14,16) (Har Megiddo: Mount Megiddo in northern Israel) and then their moving south to pillage Jerusalem, right before Jesus' 2nd coming and their total defeat (Zechariah 14:2-21, Revelation 19:19-21).

crosssaves said in post 118:

Notice Rev. 7.9 are those "before the throne" in 3rd heaven which occurs before the Tribulation starts with its first trumpet in 8.7.

See the first section of post 115.

crosssaves said in post 118:

Those mentioned in 5th seal are given white robes corresponding to their first rapture before the Tribulation.

At the 5th seal (Revelation 6:9-11), during only the first stage of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, the giving of white robes to the souls of the dead martyrs in heaven won't be their rapture or resurrection, just as the soul of the dead Samuel wearing a robe in Hades (1 Samuel 28:14) wasn't his rapture or resurrection. For saved people won't be raptured or resurrected until Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6), which won't occur until immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6).

crosssaves said in post 118:

Those who are taken in Matt. 24.40-42 and those who are left both worship the Lord, hence, to be taken is to be taken before the Tribulation and to be left is to be raptured at the 7th trumpet.

See the 2nd section of post 115.

crosssaves said in post 118:

Christians are those who are born-again "they shall never perish" (John 10.28).

See the 4th section of post 114.

crosssaves said in post 118:

Anyone who thinks a saved person can lose salvation, obviously, is not saved, for they violate salvation is not by works lest anyone should boast.

See the first section of post 114, and see post 55.

 

[Time Watcher]

"Jesus does not return on the 1335th day"


No He will not

He will intervene here at the beginning of His hour of trial [Revelation 6:12-17]

This idea of "return" is absurd as well

The Lord is already present [always is], and He chooses the times of His interactions with humanity

He will intervene suddenly with no prior warning to bring His hour of trial that is coming upon the whole world .... and it is the Lord who will judge

Then He will appear in the open at the end of the trial

 

[Time Watcher]

"The Lord has not returned. He is in 3rd heaven at the right hand of the Father"


Do you think that He knows what you just said .... is He not present now?

Or do think that He is in some far far away place and unaware of what is going on?

It sounds to me like you have difficulty of knowing who He is .... you can overcome this condition if you will seek Him .... He is right before you and is watching you ... He is omnipresent

Keep this in mind .... when you get to your end and have nothing to show, it is going to all about who you know .... not what you think you know

The Lord is here now .... you just can't see Him .... He does not have to return from anywhere

He can appear and disappear at will in an instant

When His enemies bragged about being the descendants of Abraham, what did He say?

When His early followers asked Him to show them the "father", what did He tell them?

And what does this passage of scripture teach [John 1:1-14]

The Lord walks among us today and when He executes His next action to bring the day of the Lord [His day], He will not be seen in the open by mortals on the earth .... He will be seen at His willful appearing at the end of it

 

[Time Watcher]

He will "appear" as He chooses at the end of His hour of trial

And this One who is both God and human is here right now, observing, evaluating, and waiting for his next move

You seem to be missing His attributed by only paying attention to the way you have described

Add the attributes of His capabilities related to His moving in and out of the material world at will and His eternal presence, and you will have a much better understanding

 

[MithrandirOlorin888]

The Harlot isn't any specific False Religion, she is all false religion. She was born in Babylon, and has left there, but Zechariah 5 makes clear she will in the end return to her birthplace.

 

[Time Watcher]

"Since you can't find Jesus in person here on earth then He is not here. You are delusional"


I find Him every day

.... and He is watching you by the way

When you get to the end and have nothing to show it will be all about you know

Seek Him today and He will make Himself real to you

[Revelation 5:6]

Your view of this awesome God is very limited

 

[Time Watcher]

"Everything I have just said is 100% true, proven with multiple sources and data. Fight against any one of these points, you will miss what is happening before us today"


All that you say is speculative reformation theology .... and none of it can be found in scripture

All of the historical data that you present is not contained within the scope of the Bible prophets .... you are inserting these things into the visions

The prophets are focused upon the Middle East ..... not Rome, not Europe, not the Pope or any of this

It is true that the teaching of RCC theology is severely apostate like many other sects of professing Christianity, but this religion is not specifically defined in the visions of the Bible prophets as you say

 

[MithrandirOlorin888]

The word “Babylon” comes from “Babel”: It is recorded in Genesis 10 and 11 that Nimrod built the city of Babel in the land of Shinar. It was he who tried to protect himself by his own strength. The origin of the tower of Babel is found in Genesis 11.1-4. God confounded the language of the people and scattered them abroad upon the face of all the earth. Hence the city was called “Babel” (11.9). “Babel” or “Babylon” simply means “confusion”. Idol-worship began there, and it stood in opposition to God. The city grew larger and larger until it reached its golden age at the time of Nebuchadnezzar. Due to the unfaithfulness of the children of Israel, God delivered them into the hands of Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon.

In the days of Daniel, King Nebuchadnezzar dreamed of a huge image: and by interpretation he himself was the image’s head of gold, the most prosperous period in the history of Babylon; then Medo-Persia (the image’s arms of silver) destroyed Babylon, and the city became desolate. Later on, Greece (the image’s belly of brass) destroyed Medo-Persia; and Greece was in turn destroyed by Rome (the image’s legs of iron). Babylon was therefore the first kingdom, while Rome was the last kingdom. And these four kingdoms oppressed the Jews. Three kingdoms have already passed away, but Rome has continued on. The ten toes of the image have yet to appear.

Now just as Babylon had greatly worshiped idols and deeply hated the Jews, so has Rome. Rome was not only politically a city, it was also a center of religion. In the city of Rome were to be found many Christians, yet Rome hated Christians the most. Not until the fourth century after Christ did Constantine the Great accept Christianity and encourage his people to do the same. With the result that Christianity became the official religion of Rome.

At the same time, though, the center of politics shifted from Rome to Constantinople. Rome itself became subject to the rule of Constantinople and remained that way until the sixth century. At the time of Leo a general council was held at Constantinople wherein idol-worship was condemned as heretical and illegal. Rome opposed this, and she broke with Constantinople. Thus were formed the Eastern Roman Church (the Greek Orthodox Church) and the Western Roman Church (the Roman Catholic Church). The influence of the Eastern Roman Church began to wane, but that of the Western Roman Church increased steadily. A great number of Christians suffered death at the hands of the Roman Catholic Church. This is historical fact. There is no denying it, no escaping what happened.

According to Revelation 17 and 18 the Roman Catholic Church will experience tremendous growth in the future, far exceeding that of the past. Her influence will be enormous as it is today. But when Antichrist shall arise and set up his image as an object of worship, he with his ten subordinate kings shall destroy the Roman Church (hence, the Malachy prophecy in Rev. 17.16). Nevertheless, with the passing of Rome religious, Rome political (ch. 18) will still continue during the 7 year Tribulation period. She will make the Mediterranean Sea a center of her influence (European Union). Three and a half years later after the middle of the 7 year Tribulation is reached, God will destroy Rome political and Jesus returns then to judge the nations from the 1260th to the 1290th day.

Everything I have just said is 100% true, proven with multiple sources and data. Fight against any one of these points, you will miss what is happening before us today.

The asusmption that Nimrod build Babel I consider false. Nimrod was Enmerkar and the original Babel was Eridu, the Babylon we commonly know was originally built to be a New Babylon.

 

[Time Watcher]

"Truly, you're a bad guy!"



Well you might think I am a bad guy

He is watching you at this very minute and He does not need a telescope


Matthew
28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet, and worshipped him.

Luke
24:15 And it came to pass, that, while they communed together and reasoned, Jesus himself drew near, and went with them.

24:16 But their eyes were holden that they should not know him.

24:17 And he said unto them, What manner of communications are these that ye have one to another, as ye walk, and are sad?

John
20:19 Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you.

20:20 And when he had so said, he shewed unto them his hands and his side. Then were the disciples glad, when they saw the LORD.

Revelation
1:10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

1:11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.

1:12 And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;

1:13 And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.

1:14 His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;

1:15 And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.

1:16 And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.

1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

5:5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof.

5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

 

[Time Watcher]

I think you are unfamiliar with the scriptures and have no idea what you ae talking about .... to outright deny the scriptures I gave you makes you very suspect

If you don't believe that Jesus can appear and has appeared on the earth to others after His death on the cross this is your problem .... not mine

This He can do .... and He is watching you .... knows what you do and what you think

 

[Bible2]

crosssaves said in post 134:

False prophets are focused on the middle east. EU is the revived Roman Empire.

Note that there doesn't have to be any such dichotomy. For in Daniel 7, the first 3 beasts (Daniel 7:3-6) represent the ancient empires of Babylon (lion), Medo-Persia (bear), and Greece (leopard). And the 4th beast, or 4th "king"/"kingdom" (Daniel 7:17,23), represents the ancient Roman Empire. And the 10 horns/kings which come out of it (Daniel 7:7,24) could represent 10 major kingdoms/nations today which came out the former territory of the Roman Empire, which consisted not only of Western Europe, but also the Middle East and North Africa. These 10 nations could be Germany, the U.K., France, Italy, Spain, Turkey, Egypt, Iraq, Algeria, and Syria. The 10 part-iron/part-clay toes of Daniel 2:42 could represent the same thing as the 10 horns of Daniel 7:7. The Europeans could be the iron, and the Arabs and Turks could be the clay. In Daniel 2:43, the inability of the iron to mix with the clay could represent how, for example, there are many Turks living in Germany, but they remain separated in ghettoes within German cities. Similarly, there are many Algerians living in France, but they remain separated in ghettoes within French cities.

But despite this social separation, which could endure indefinitely, the people of Western Europe on the one hand, and the people of the Middle East and North Africa on the other, could still one day put aside their political separation and become united into one confederation. For Daniel 2:42 refers to the 10 as a singular "kingdom". The person who brings this about could be the Antichrist. The arising of the "little" horn (Daniel 7:8, Daniel 8:9), which is "diverse" from the 10 major nations (Daniel 7:24), could mean that the Antichrist will arise from a little country.

And the little horn arising from "among" the 10 major nations (Daniel 7:8) could mean that the Antichrist's country's territory used to be part of the Roman Empire. And before that, it was part of one of the 4 Diadochian Greek kingdoms which succeeded the Greek Empire of Alexander the Great (Daniel 8:8-9,21-25). The territory of these 4 kingdoms stretched from Greece over to Iran, and down into Egypt. So the Antichrist could come from the Middle East. He could be an Arab who will come from the little country of Lebanon, from the modern city of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4).

The Antichrist could start out by claiming to be a Baathist. After becoming the leader of Lebanon, he could peacefully gain control of a Baathist confederation of 3 of the 10 major nations (Daniel 7:24): Egypt, "toward the south" of Lebanon (Daniel 8:9), and Iraq and Syria, "toward the east" of Lebanon (Daniel 8:9). This confederation could also include the minor nation of a United Palestine, i.e. a defeated Israel, "the pleasant land" (Daniel 8:9).

This Baathist confederation could be put together in the future by an Iraqi Baathist General who could completely defeat and occupy Israel and Egypt with a huge Iraqi Army (Daniel 11:15-17; in verse 17 the original Hebrew word translated as "daughter" is "bath"), but who could then mysteriously disappear (Daniel 11:19) shortly before the Antichrist arises on the world stage (Daniel 11:21-45). Years later, when the Antichrist gains control of all 10 of the major nations, he could appoint kings over them (Revelation 17:12) who will defer to him (Revelation 17:13), like when Napoleon gained control of different nations, he appointed kings over them who would defer to him.

*******

crosssaves said in post 138:

Jesus will return just as He left physically (Zech. 14.4, Acts 1.11, Rev. 1.7).

Amen.

And Jesus' future, physical return doesn't contradict that he can also be with us now spiritually (Matthew 28:20b, Ephesians 3:17, Romans 8:9b).

 

[Douggg]

The 10 kings come from the revived Roman Empire, not the middle east. The middle east is far weaker than you realize. The 22 Islamic countries make up less than 1% of the world's GDP whereas the EU has a GDP of over 20 trillion far more than USA, Japan or China. Perhaps the 3 kings that are taken over by the Antichrist are 3 leaders of 3 countries that are in a massive debt trap like Italy, Greece and Portugal.

The only thing that is left is for the ten king (leader) ruling body to form to oversight the fiscal policies in the EU states. The Antichrist may have a financial background. I say that because ultimately that is how he is going to control the world, to force people to worship him.

The Antichrist, specifically, of course is Nero. Neron Kaisar = 666 in Aramaic so this is whom John was referring to in Rev. 13 and 17 and Paul who wrote about him 2 Thess. 2.4.

At the middle of the 7 year Tribulation Satan is given the key to the pit in Rev. 9.1 to release Nero and Judas. They are appointed once to die so they can't die again after being released. The forerunner makes a peace treaty for 7 years then the Antichrist breaks it midtrib using the body of the 7th.

I don't think Nero (as a unclean spirit) because he was not tied to the Babylon's beginnings. Nor Judas, because Judas was repentant over what he had done, and doesn't have the type of personality to be the Antichrist-beast tyrant. I think Nimrod.

The 666, as of present, imo, is still not figured out.


Doug

 

[Time Watcher]

"The 666, as of present, imo, is still not figured out"


True

There will be some of professing Christianity who will figure it out .... when they venture into the coming tribulation

It will be very obvious to them in the open .... then these must scramble an hide to escape Satan's beast who will hunt them

 

[Douggg]

The 10 kings could already represent the 10 nations that formed EU by the time of the birth of Prince William in 1982. What is needed are for 3 nations to be taken over by the Antichrist, the proliferation of the mark of the beast implant to buy and sell, a 7 year treaty, the Tetrad (Rev 6.12) 2014/15, and the 3rd Temple construction which begins before the Tribulation starts but is finished with 2300 days left into the Tribulation from Passover to Tisha B'Av.

I don't know which nations, but the final form is not yet materialize, because of what it say in Daniel 8 about in the latter time of their kingdom when the trangressors has come to a full - then the king of fierce contenance will stand up of it. Stand up is a term for meaning he is getting reading to go to war.

So we have the EU now, which has gone through some changes since it inception, about to go into the latter time of itself.

Daniel 8:23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

A person has to go all the back to verse 12 and 13 to find out who the transgressors are, and Revelation 17, then ten kings who align themself with the Antichrist-beast

Daniel 8:12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.
13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot?


So the transgressors are the ten kings of the EU final form who will align themselves with the Antichrist all the way through to when, he desecrates the temple and claims to be God.

The revived Roman empire is revived not Babylon and is centered on the 7 hilled city which of course is Rome. You know Nero resurrected is the Antichrist because at the time of John's writing only his name came to 666 in Aramaic, ie Neron Kaisar. Only he is one of the 5 fallen Caesars in Rev. 17, "was", "is not" at the time of John's writing 95 AD and is yet to come when he is resurrected.

When Mystery Babylon comes into play as a world power, it is for those
last 42 months. Although, the EU end times Roman Empire will be the dominant global sector, the Antichrist, possessed by the unclean spirit of Nimrod, imo, will lead the world in global rebellion against God. So that is how the end times Roman Empire and Mystery Babylon the great will coexist - with the same person in charge of both.

Whoever it is in the bottomless pit, he is not going to rematerialize in his own resurrected body... because the Antichrist goes through a progression of stages as the little horn politician, to the prince who shall come false king messiah to the Jews, to betraying them as the revealed man of sin, to his final stages as the Antichrist-beast.

I believe that Nero was the sixth ruling, not the fifth, because Nero was the last of the Julio-Claudian line of Caesars. The next dynasty was the Flavians. So in your scenario, you have 5 Caesars, and a Flavian.
And one yet to come. There is no connection in your scenario of the 7 kings.

Judas never repented that's why he committed suicide. A person who commits suicide is not repentant.

He was repentant of having taken part in the betrayal of Jesus, coming to his senses after the fact. He committed suicide because it troubled him so much. If he didn't care over what he had done, he would not have committed suicide.

There are two sons of perdition in the Bible mentioned: Nero and Judas.

Judas is the only one by name. Where are you getting that Nero was mentioned by name in the Bible as being son of perdition?


Doug

 

[Time Watcher]

I believe that some of your interpretations are flawed, but not all of them

And the one you are in conversation with above should be ignored

.... there is a rat in the wood pile

 

[Bible2]

Douggg said in post 143:

The 666, as of present, imo, is still not figured out.

The "666" in Revelation 13:17c-18 refers to the number six hundred and sixty-six, the "number of the name" of the individual "man" who is the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast). The number of a name (Revelation 13:17c-18, Revelation 15:2) is determined by employing the ancient method of gematria, by which numerical values are assigned to the letters of any alphabet as follows: the first nine letters are 1 through 9, the next nine letters are 10 through 90 (counting by tens), and the rest of the letters are 100, 200, 300, etc., to the end of the alphabet. In Revelation 13:18, the "counting", the adding up, of the gematrial number of the Antichrist's name should be done in the same way that the gematrial numerical values of the 3 Greek letters (Chi, Xi, and Stigma) at the end of Revelation 13:18 (in the original Greek Textus Receptus) are added up to arrive at the number six hundred and sixty-six.

The numerical values of the letters of the ancient Greek alphabet (including the 3 obsolete letters of Stigma, Qoppa, and Sampi) were as follows: Alpha = 1, Beta = 2, Gamma = 3, Delta = 4, Epsilon = 5, Stigma = 6, Zeta = 7, Eta = 8, Theta = 9, Iota = 10, Kappa = 20, Lambda = 30, Mu = 40, Nu = 50, Xi = 60, Omikron = 70, Pi = 80, Qoppa = 90, Rho = 100, Sigma = 200, Tau = 300, Upsilon = 400, Phi = 500, Chi = 600, Psi = 700, Omega = 800, Sampi = 900.

Just as the numerical values of Chi, Xi, and Stigma at the end of Revelation 13:18 (in the Textus Receptus) add up to 666, so the numerical values of the letters in the Antichrist's name will add up to 666 (Revelation 13:17c-18). John used the Greek alphabet because it was the most common one used by believers when the book of Revelation was written. Today, the English alphabet is the most common one used by believers, insofar as English is the current lingua franca of the world. So the Antichrist's name will most likely add up to 666 in the English alphabet. The purpose of Revelation 13:17c-18 is to facilitate for believers, not to make difficult for them, the identification of a certain man as possibly being the Antichrist. If the letters in his name had to be transliterated into the Greek alphabet, this would vitiate this purpose, for almost all believers today wouldn't know how to properly perform this transliteration, and so different believers would come up with different transliterations, and so would come up with different gematrial numbers for the name of the man in question.

If believers think that someone is the Antichrist, they need to check and make sure that his name adds up to 666 in gematria (Revelation 13:17c-18). If it doesn't, then he isn't the Antichrist. If it does, then he could be, and they need to be especially wary of him and not be taken in by any deceptive charisma, intelligence, or amazing deeds that he might display. But even if someone's name adds up to 666, this doesn't mean that he's definitely the Antichrist. For just by chance there could be more than one person in the world whose name adds up to 666. The Antichrist also has to come from a country the territory of which used to be part of one of the 4 Diadochian Greek kingdoms which succeeded Alexander the Great (Daniel 8:8-9,21-25). These kingdoms stretched from Greece over to Iran, and down into Egypt. So the Antichrist could come from the Middle East. He could be an Arab who will come from Lebanon, from the modern city of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4), and have a name like (for example) "Nabil Abdullah Falakal al-Hakim", which adds up to 666.

But if a man from the Middle East has a name which adds up to 666, even this doesn't assure that he's the Antichrist. For he also has to sit (at least one time) in a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem and proclaim himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:3-4, Daniel 11:31,36, Matthew 24:15, Revelation 11:1-2). Once he does that, there won't be any room for doubt over whether or not he's the Antichrist; his identity will have been definitely revealed (2 Thessalonians 2:3b-4).

The gematrial numerical values of the letters of the English alphabet are: A=1, B=2, C=3, D=4, E=5, F=6, G=7, H=8, I=9, J=10, K=20, L=30, M=40, N=50, O=60, P=70, Q=80, R=90, S=100, T=200, U=300, V=400, W=500, X=600, Y=700, Z=800. The way that the gematrial number of a name is "counted" (Revelation 13:17c-18), is added up, is simply by adding up the gematrial numerical values of all the letters in that name. So, for example, the number of the name "John Mark Smith" is 636, because: J=10, O=60, H=8, N=50, M=40, A=1, R=90, K=20, S=100, M=40, I=9, T=200, H=8. Total = 636. The Antichrist's name will add up to 666 (Revelation 13:17c-18).

 

[Bible2]

crosssaves said in post 145:

The revived Roman empire is revived not Babylon and is centered on the 7 hilled city which of course is Rome.

In Revelation 17:9, the 7 mountains (or hills) which support Revelation's symbolic "Babylon" can be the 7 hills of Rome. For at the time of John the apostle in the first century AD, the Roman Empire was the chief support for what Revelation's "Babylon" represents: all of mankind's corrupt political (Revelation 17:18), economic (Revelation 18:11), and religious (Revelation 18:24) systems throughout the earth (Revelation 18:3) and throughout history (Revelation 17:9-10). At the same time, in Revelation 17:9, the 7 mountains can also represent 7 empires (Revelation 17:10). For an empire can be referred to symbolically as a mountain (Jeremiah 51:24-25, Daniel 2:35,44), and what Revelation's "Babylon" represents has been supported by 7 empires: Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome, and (possibly) Islam.

The first 5 had fallen by the time of John the apostle in the first century AD: "five are fallen" (Revelation 17:10, Revelation 1:1b-2). The 6th (Rome) existed at the time of John: "one is" (Revelation 17:10). The 7th (possibly Islam) hadn't come by the time of John: "the other is not yet come" (Revelation 17:10). The empire of the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) will be a different, still-future, 8th head (Revelation 17:11), which will be a revival of one of the 5 empires that had fallen by the time of John (Revelation 17:8,10,11). It will be a revival of the empire of Babylon. The Antichrist will transform the present-day, rebuilt city of Babylon (in Iraq) into the capital of his world empire, only to see his city of Babylon ultimately destroyed at Jesus' 2nd coming (Isaiah 13).

Before the 2nd coming, when the world is brought into the worship of Lucifer (the dragon, Satan) and the Antichrist, during the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9), the Antichrist will build their main temple in the city of Babylon. For a temple to "wickedness" will be built in Shinar (Babylonia) (Zechariah 5:8,11), and the Antichrist is called "that Wicked" (2 Thessalonians 2:8). Also, the dragon has been the god worshipped in the city of Babylon since ancient times.

The Antichrist may claim to be Nebuchadnezzar returned, and so reinstitute the system that Nebuchadnezzar set up whereby everyone had to worship an image or be killed (Daniel 3, Revelation 13:15). The Antichrist may also claim to be, at the same time, the return of Nimrod (the founder of Babylon: Genesis 10:8-10), and Hammurabi, and Asoka, and other famous rulers of the past. For he may claim that he has had many different "past lives" as various "enlightened" rulers.

Besides building a main temple in Babylon, the Antichrist will also sit (at least one time) in a future, 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem, and declare himself God there (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36,31, Matthew 24:15, Revelation 11:1-2). The Antichrist could also sit (at least one time) in other religions' holiest shrines, and declare himself to be God there as well. For example, he could also sit in Islam's Kaaba in Mecca, in the Sikhs' Golden Temple in Amritsar, in Catholicism's St. Peter's Basilica in the Vatican, etc.

crosssaves said in post 145:

You know Nero resurrected is the Antichrist because at the time of John's writing only his name came to 666 in Aramaic, ie Neron Kaisar.

Can you show how "Neron Kaisar" equals 666 in the Aramaic alphabet? And why an "n" should be added after "Nero"?

-

It's usually claimed that Nero was the Antichrist based on the Hebrew alphabet. But any mistaken teaching which claims that the Antichrist has already come and gone could be employed in the future by the real Antichrist to fool some Christians into thinking that he isn't the Antichrist.

Nero didn't fulfill the detailed references to the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) in Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 16:2-16, Revelation 19:19-21, and Revelation 20:4. Also, Nero didn't fulfill other prophecies regarding the Antichrist (e.g. 2 Thessalonians 2:3-9, Daniel 11:31,36; cf. Matthew 24:15). And John the apostle didn't see the vision of Revelation until decades after the time of Nero. For Irenaeus (born c. 140 AD) said: "We will not, however, incur the risk of pronouncing positively as to the name of Antichrist; for if it were necessary that his name should be distinctly revealed in this present time, it would have been announced by him [John] who beheld the apocalyptic vision [Revelation]. For that was seen no very long time since, but almost in our day, towards the end of Domitian's reign" (Against Heresies 5:30:3c). The end of Domitian's reign was 96 AD. Nero's reign was 54-68 AD. The detailed prophecies regarding the Antichrist, just as the rest of the tribulation prophecies of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, have never been fulfilled.

-

Regarding the claim (made by some) that Nero's name in Hebrew added up to 666 (Revelation 13:17c-18), is there an ancient historical source which shows how "Nero Caesar" was usually transliterated into Hebrew at the time that Revelation was written, so we can confirm whether or not the usual Hebrew transliteration of "Nero Caesar" added up to 666 in Hebrew gematria, instead of an intentionally-altered Hebrew spelling? For example, why was an "n" added after "Nero", to make "Neron"; and why was the "ae" of "Caesar" skipped to make "Csar", when, for example, the "ae" in "Israel" gets at least an "aleph" in Hebrew? Could "Neron Csar" in fact be an intentionally-altered, never-actually-used spelling that adds up to 666, just as people today could intentionally mistransliterate into Hebrew the name of someone living today so that the mistransliterated name adds up to 666 in Hebrew gematria? Also, just by chance there could be more than one person in the world whose name adds up to 666. So even if it could be proven that the usual Hebrew spelling of "Nero Caesar" added up to 666, or that the usual spelling of the name of someone living today adds up to 666, this doesn't require that that person is the Antichrist.

Also, should we even assume that the Antichrist's name has to be transliterated into Hebrew for it to add up to 666? For Revelation was originally addressed to Greek-speaking Gentile churches in the Roman province of "Asia" (Revelation 1:11) (what's now western Turkey), not to Hebrew-speaking Jewish churches in Judaea. And John the apostle used 3 letters from the Greek alphabet to express the number 666 in Revelation 13:18 (in the original Greek Textus Receptus), not any letters from the Hebrew alphabet. (But this doesn't require that the Antichrist's name has to be transliterated into Greek in order for it to add up to 666, for John used the Greek alphabet only because it was the most common one used by the believers he was addressing at the time Revelation was written.) Also, even when "Nero Caesar" (instead of "Neron Csar") is transliterated into Hebrew, it doesn't have to result in the name adding up to 666:

N - Nun = 50 (cf. the "Ne" in "Nebo" in the Hebrew of Num. 32:3: Nun for the "N" and nothing for the "e")
E /
R - Reysh = 200
O - Vav = 6 (cf. the "o" in "Nebo" in the Hebrew of Num. 32:3 being the letter Vav)

C - Qowph = 100 (cf. "Kareah" in the Hebrew of Jer. 40:8, & "Caesar" being "Kaisar" in the Greek of Mt. 22:17)
A - Aleph = 1 (cf. the "ae" in "Israel" in the Hebrew of Gen. 32:28: Aleph for the "a" and nothing for the "e")
E /
S - Samek = 60 (cf. the "sar" in "Ellasar" in the Hebrew of Gen. 14:1: Samek for the "s" & nothing for the "a")
A /
R - Reysh = 200

Total = 617

crosssaves said in post 145:

Some say this could be Barack Obama because his name comes to 666 and there were many incidents of 666 related to his birth, election, etc.

Obama isn't the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast), for the gematrial "number of the name" of the Antichrist is 666 (Revelation 13:17c-18, Revelation 15:2), whereas the gematrial number of the name Barack Hussein Obama is 793:

B=2, A=1, R=90, A=1, C=3, K=20, H=8, U=300, S=100, S=100, E=5, I=9, N=50, O=60, B=2, A=1, M=40, A=1. Total = 793.

Also, the Antichrist will come from a country the territory of which used to be part of one of the 4 Diadochian Greek kingdoms which succeeded Alexander the Great (Daniel 8:8-9,21-25). These kingdoms stretched from Greece over to Iran, and down into Egypt. So the Antichrist could come from the Middle East.

 

[Time Watcher]

You guys are waisting your time trying to figure out who the "anti-christ" is with numerology

When this one arrives on the earth there will be no question about who his is .... not here now .... he is in the abyss

And when he comes out he will take possession of a man ... the human little horn in Daniel's visions

And if you are around you will know him by his actions as described in the Lord's prophetic word .... all there and spelled out in advance