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doofus125

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Rosa Mystica said:
Bill,

You keep switching your icon from atheist to Christian, and then back again. What are you, if you don't mind my asking?

You know, I have plenty of experience w/ being mad at God myself (if you only knew how often I screamed at Him ). I might be able to relate to that sentiment quite well. Why not talk to me? I'm always willing to share my insights w/ you.
I don't know what I am. At this point I am so stinking mad at God that I deny that he exists, yet I don't know who else to talk to.

kingzjewel said:
dude!
please take a minute and think before you hurt yourself like this. i understand the hurt and pain people can bring into your life, believe me. cutting yourself off just makes you more dead inside. we need each other that's why there are so many people in the world. seems to me you have enough people who arent hurting you to fill your time with... you dont have to cut off everyone...just the ones who hurt you. please please try and come to a better solution than this!

and just for the record. im STILL PRAYING FOR YOU.
Everyone hurts me constantly. I'm tired of constantly being blown off and lied to. I don't have anyone around me that isn't using me for whatever they want and then they are gone. The only solution is to walk away and forget everyone and everything.
Awake said:
You're not the only one who has thought this way or has tried this. Go ahead and try it if you wish but I must tell you that being totally isolated and alone is worse than getting hurt. All you wind up doing is dwelling on the bad things that have happened which makes you feel even more jaded, depressed, and bitter. Been there, tried that.
In all honesty, I hope it does bring me to that point and maybe even further if you know what I mean. I just don't care anymore.
 
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Rosa Mystica

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doofus125 said:
I don't know what I am. At this point I am so stinking mad at God that I deny that he exists, yet I don't know who else to talk to.

If this is the case, then you're not an atheist, but a Christian who is mad at God. If you were truly atheistic, you wouldn't believe in His existence. But in your case, it seems that you simply deny Him b/c you're upset w/ Him, not b/c you believe He's not real.
 
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Awake

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kingzjewel said:
dude!
please take a minute and think before you hurt yourself like this. i understand the hurt and pain people can bring into your life, believe me. cutting yourself off just makes you more dead inside. we need each other that's why there are so many people in the world. seems to me you have enough people who arent hurting you to fill your time with... you dont have to cut off everyone...just the ones who hurt you. please please try and come to a better solution than this!

and just for the record. im STILL PRAYING FOR YOU.
There's one thing that those of you not going through this need to understand. Even those who aren't trying to hurt you...even friends...wind up hurting you. Try to follow me here, I don't know how clearly I can explain this from my perspective.

I have quite a few friends that I care a lot about. They are great friends, totally cool and great fun to be around. Due to my bisexual past and the way it tends to warp my relationships with guys, things get complicated as friends become closer. The sense of closeness towards a friend of the same gender is hampered by the familiarization with previous levels of intimacy with guys. I can be spending time with some of my closer guy friends when it happens. Before I realize where my mind is taking me, my thoughts towards my friends turn to a place where I don't want to go. It could be as simple as thoughts of a kiss, or much worse. I know that the physical attraction towards a friend can be somewhat written off as a sin in the same sense as me lusting after the cute girl next door. However, those who use this argument are missing the point.
I don't want these thoughts, nor do I want to act on them. The simple fact that my mind took me there makes me feel bad enough. Knowing these feelings are towards a friend that I care deeply about makes the pain absolutely horrendous. Some time ago, I was in an auto accident which left me several broken bones protuding from the skin. The pain of that accident combined with the healing & reahbilitation are absolutely nothing compared to the pain I feel when my thoughts towards a friend turn to ways of my past. I would gladly trade the pain of that auto accident for this pain. That is part of the motivation to cut people off, to not want to be around people. As they become closer, even friends can become a source of great inner pain and turmoil.

Does this make any sense to anyone besides Bill and myself?
 
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Yes Awake that makes perfect sense to me. I have never had a homosexual experience b/c I KNOW that once I do that it will make what you describe even harder to deal and cope with. I still have a hard time being friends with guys. I actually am very physically active and do aggresive sports which allows me to hang out with guys without my mind wondering/tormenting me as much b/c of the Intensity factor which keeps me focused on not getting hurt. But outside of training I almost never hang out with guys by myself. It sucks but that's the hand I was dealt.

Bill, man to be honest with you brother you sound so winey. You need to TAKE ACTION and NOT negative action like cutting people off or killing yourself. Look life is very hard for you, especially right now, but you are not going to help yourself or anybody else around you by threating to kill yourself. GO FIND A CHRISTIAN THERAPIST NOW!!! ALSO go to a doctor that can prescribe you meds b/c man you need some anti-depressant meds and for the time being I'd say some anti-anxiety meds too. That is just what I would do if I were you. Most Christians in most churches are not going to really understand your pain so don't be surprised when people "let you down". People are going to let you down again my friend which is why you need emotional support systems in place ALL THE TIME! A Christian therapist, a christian mens groups (helpful if they were either part of Exodus ministries or Living Waters ministry), a pastor who will stand in the gap for and with you and you also need to try and find some sort of Christian mentor who will help show you what a father is SUPPOSSED to be like. I image you didn't and don't have a good relationship with your father. These are things YOU CAN DO but you have to get off your butt and do them! I'm sorry you are hurting and believe me I understand where you are coming from (had a gun in my mouth 3 times in my life) but I made it and am still WORKING AT IT!

I will give you some orgnizations to look at that might help you along your journey to healing but the first thing I would do it get some meds b/c you are in the throws of depression and a lot of what's going on with that right now is chemical. ALSO YOU SHOULD CALL Focus on the family and ask to speak with a counselor if you are close to ending your life b/c they are trained to help people like us in those time of trouble...trust me! Also, I found my CHRISTIAN therapist through them. They have a great reference service for QUALIFIED Christian counselors. Just ask them for a MALE, PH.D who works with people who are depressed AND struggle with their sexual identity. Also check these places out on the web:
1) Focus on the family couseling: 719-531-3400 ext. 7700 or on the web at family.org
2) Narth at narth.com National Association of Research and Therapy for Homosexuals *man they have some GREAT articles and research to help you understand what you are going through
3) Exodus Ministries at exodus-international.org
4) Desert Streams at desertstream.org *I've heard really good things about this one

There are many other routes you can take to get help but I know what has worked for me in the past so there you have it. I pray you won't do anything as selfish and as horrible as killing yourself. And remember my brother YOU and only YOU can start to take back control of your life! Telling yourself and other people how much life sucks isn't going to do you any good unless it is in a theraputic environment, ei. couselor, men's group, or pastor.

God bless you my friend and please respond to our posts and let us know how you are doing more often b/c WE DO CARE about you and want you to stay here with us on this planet until God takes you home.
 
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doofus125 said:
You have no freakin idea what I'm going through and what I have been through. On that note I'm going to say goodbye.
Take Action brother! You are right I have no clue as too what you've been through but like I said life is hard and it's up to you as to how it will turn out. It sounds like people really really hurt you when you were young and continue to do so but you have to pick up the pieces and make the best out of your situation. It's hard! but that's where God will help. I have a very very hard time understand knowing or thinking that God even cares for me at all but I just have to continue to pray, read, and find fellowship that will help me see HIM. I am sorry if I hurt your feelings but I just don't see your attitude/approach taking you anywhere positive/peaceful.

I have and will continue to pray for you!
 
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justreading

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Bill I am in a season of pain and struggle myself and I have found a very good article that I think will help you as it has helped me. I am still praying for you. It's long so get ready to read! (but well worth it!)

[font=verdana,arial]"Well, That's Just the Way I Am"

[/font]by Alan P. Medinger



(Adapted by permission from an article which appeared in Regeneration News, May 1997)

Alan Medinger is one of the best-known names in ex-gay ministry; the Bulletin profiled his own story of growth out of homosexuality in the December 1996 issue. Here, he offers some wise advice which we believe is relevant to homosexual strugglers of most religious faiths (or no religious faith), even though it is addressed specifically to evangelical Christians.​
Mr. Medinger identifies many time-honored and universal principles of character development, personal responsibility and emotional growth.

When a certain friend of mine and I get into a discussion that touches on some negative or destructive behavior or a less than ideal attitude that she manifests, often the final card that she will play when all else has failed is, "Well, that's just the way I am." Unspoken, but clearly understood, are the corollaries, "And I can't do anything about it," and "If it bothers you, that's too bad." She uses this to bring closure to the discussion, and it usually does.

This statement, laid out bare as it is in the headline above, sounds like the angry outburst of a foot-stomping little child. But, its more than that. It is an attitude that creeps into the thinking of many mature adults.

I've heard it in my own inner thoughts: "I'm just not a people person." We hear it in people in our ministry all the time: "I'm extremely sensitive." "I am weak in this area." "I am a very emotional person." "I just can't relate to men." "I don't have much strength or endurance." "I'm not very spiritual." "I can't stand sports."

Of course, most of these statements reflect a degree of truth. To be truthful, I am more contented and comfortable writing this article than I am spending a long afternoon with a group of people. You may be more sensitive than most people. You may have an exceptional problem with endurance, or with men. Where the difficulty lies, however, and where the foot-stomping child comes in, is with the understanding that we cannot change, or with the belief that we must act according to this part of our nature, regardless of what it does to others.

Such an attitude is life-limiting, even destructive. That it is something to be resisted should be obvious. We can combat it if we start out by recognizing that, except for situations in which certain physical (including brain) limitations are present, the statement, "Well, that's just the way I am" is almost never a valid justification for how we live our lives. Two responses to this statement are always in order. First, we always can change--at least to some extent. Second, our behavior does not always have to reflect our natural inclinations.

I recently spent six days together with our staff on a retreat in North Carolina. Now, these are people I really love and admire, people who I find quite interesting, people with whom I am quite compatible. But, after the third or fourth day I started to become weary of being with them. Some people, like my wife, thrive on people. I tend to be worn out by them. This is who I am, and I accept this fact, but this is not always a neutral characteristic. Left to take its own course or carried to extremes, it can be quite harmful. Recognizing this, over the years I have tried to change. I have prayed that I would love and appreciate people more. I have made myself do things with groups of people in hopes that I would find pleasure in these things and would do them more enthusiastically. These efforts have paid off. I'll never be a party animal, but neither will I be as reclusive as I might have been.

Also, during the last three days of the retreat I did not retire to my room to read or write or play solitaire. Although I might have found this more relaxing and pleasurable, it would not have been appropriate. I stayed with the group, and hopefully they weren't fully aware of "the way I am." I know that I was blessed by being with them.

What are the areas in which you overtly or internally declare: "Well, that's just the way I am." Are you extremely sensitive or weak in some areas? Do you have trouble relating to men? Is the problem that you don't have much physical endurance? My answer to you is that you can change--to some degree, and your behavior does not have to be governed by these traits.

But you may respond, "Aren't we free to accept ourselves as we are? Psychologically, isn't accepting ourselves a sign of emotional well-being?"



But Is This "Just Who I Am"?



That may be so, but the real question is, when do we simply accept one of these characteristics, and when do we struggle to change and battle not to be governed by it? The answer is fairly simple: we try to change, or we try to not be totally controlled by it, when it produces negative results.

The most obvious negative result is that the trait leads to behavior that is part of a rationale for sinful behavior: "I am not strong like other people; I'll always give in to sexual feelings." Or it may be a justification for not doing what we should do: "I have to have nine or ten hours sleep, so there is no way that I can have a quiet time for reflection."

Second, we should not accept the characteristic without a battle if it leads to behavior that is not good for other people. "I don't have much endurance, so my wife has to do all of the work around the house." "I can't tolerate people like him, so I dropped out of the therapy group."

Third, it should be battled when it interferes with what we really want out of life. You want to have friends, or maybe to be married, but you are a shy person: Seek to change a little and don't let your shyness totally control your life. You are an emotionally needy person, but you want out of homosexuality: Seek to find the sources of your neediness and to find other, more legitimate ways of meeting your needs. Be willing to endure some degree of pain. The same principles apply in every aspect of our struggle to overcome homosexuality.

"Well, that's just who I am," is almost always an outward expression of wrong attitudes dwelling deep inside of us.

It can be a sign of a person who stubbornly refuses to try to change. It may be a sign of self-centeredness: "I am going to do things the way that feels right to me, and I don't care what it does to you."

Or, it can be a sign of a lack of faith in our own ability to grow and change. This doesn't mean that I will ever become a tremendously outgoing, gregarious person, but it does mean that I can grow and change at least a little. Everyone who is in Christ can expect to grow and change--if they want to.



The Gay Community Says "That's Just Who I Am"



The gay community has institutionalized the that's-just-the-way-I-am attitude. I was born gay; I can't change; I don't care what you think about it, I don't care what disease I'm spreading or what changes are necessary in public morality to accommodate who I am. Homosexuality is characterized by immaturity, and so we often see many foot-stomping little children in gay pride parades; we hear them in may gay pronouncements.

Each of us must find a balance between self-acceptance and our need to change. Many gays go far to the extreme of self-acceptance with a total denial of their need to change. This approach, that feels so wonderful at first, too often leads to wasted and destroyed lives.

Many others have gone to the other extreme, rejecting so much about themselves that they border on self-hatred. They are so battered by self-rejection that they have little strength to change, or to not act out on their feelings.

Let me suggest three steps for achieving balance in this area.

First, identify those characteristics that have a significant negative impact: they lead to behavior that is morally offensive, they are not good for other people, or they are stifling what you want to happen in your life. It is important to sort them out and identify and work on only those that have the most significant negative consequences. Select just one; avoid the tendency to try and correct everything at once.

Second, recognizing that you will never change completely in this area, decide what is an acceptable behavior for you now. You may be led to grow much more in this area in the future, but for now, just look towards manageable change, and more importantly, identify specific behaviors that you are called to change despite this natural characteristic.

Finally, celebrate your differences where they have a good quality, and celebrate your unique combination of attributes.

We have a loving Father who accepts us just as we are, but one who at the same time calls us to further growth and maturity. We are not free men and women when we hide behind "who I am." We are called to a freedom that can only come as we are willing to grow and change.
 
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kingzjewel

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Awake said:
There's one thing that those of you not going through this need to understand. Even those who aren't trying to hurt you...even friends...wind up hurting you. Try to follow me here, I don't know how clearly I can explain this from my perspective.

I have quite a few friends that I care a lot about. They are great friends, totally cool and great fun to be around. Due to my bisexual past and the way it tends to warp my relationships with guys, things get complicated as friends become closer. The sense of closeness towards a friend of the same gender is hampered by the familiarization with previous levels of intimacy with guys. I can be spending time with some of my closer guy friends when it happens. Before I realize where my mind is taking me, my thoughts towards my friends turn to a place where I don't want to go. It could be as simple as thoughts of a kiss, or much worse. I know that the physical attraction towards a friend can be somewhat written off as a sin in the same sense as me lusting after the cute girl next door. However, those who use this argument are missing the point.
I don't want these thoughts, nor do I want to act on them. The simple fact that my mind took me there makes me feel bad enough. Knowing these feelings are towards a friend that I care deeply about makes the pain absolutely horrendous. Some time ago, I was in an auto accident which left me several broken bones protuding from the skin. The pain of that accident combined with the healing & reahbilitation are absolutely nothing compared to the pain I feel when my thoughts towards a friend turn to ways of my past. I would gladly trade the pain of that auto accident for this pain. That is part of the motivation to cut people off, to not want to be around people. As they become closer, even friends can become a source of great inner pain and turmoil.

Does this make any sense to anyone besides Bill and myself?
awake and doofus:

believe me i know where you are coming from. its very hard. i have a bisexual past, too, so i get you on more levels than you think, awake. as a matter of fact, im dealing with those struggles every day right now. it hurts. its hard, but we have to keep goin on. we have to continue to be open, but cautious. we are supposed to guard our hearts, not cut off the world. it has taken me a long time to realize that getting rid of the world isnt the answer...been there, done that. i know it looks like there's no hope. i remember the suffering i went through before i got here, and the suffering im dealing with now. if anything...i recommend taking a "hiatus" from the world to get yourself together and then to cautiously reenter...not necessarily for you to disappear though. get what im saying? we all need breaks.
 
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doofus125

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I just wanted to share the e-mail I just sent to my best friend who is away at school. He called me last week and after talking to him for a couple of minutes he says to me "I don't know why, but I feel like God is putting you on my heart and that I need to seriously pray for you".....I was so silent after he said this that he thought I hung up on him and all I could say was "you have reason to, but I can't go into it here".....

Maybe someone here is going through this or has gone through this and could just pray.

R,

What I'm going to write I need you to seriously read and pray. By now you have either figured out what is going on with me or you are still wondering. I don't know how else to say this because there are no other words except to say I'm tired. I've struggled for so long and just when I began to see a way out of it and hope, my world was turned upside down. When I first met Pastor Tim I was really at a low point and I don't know if you realize how low that was because if you knew you probably would have told someone because I was in serious trouble. Pastor Tim and being involved with the young adults has been the only thing that has gotten me through the last few months and now that Pastor Tim is gone and young adults is done I have no connection to the church. After Tim left I started meeting with Todd & Stacy, but that only lasted for about 3 weeks when they told me they were moving to Columbus. I thought I was at a point that I was going to be ok as long as I stayed in church and now that young adults is done I have no commitment to stay in church. Without beating to much around the bush I'm going to say what is really on my mind and in my heart. I'm very lonely. I have no one that I can connect to and just be open about what is on my mind. I don't know if I can talk to you, things are different between us and I am tired of dumping on you. The thing I'm getting at is that I am torn on a decision that I have to make and either way I don't know if I'm going to make it. I'm tired of being lonely and I've been placeing personal ad's looking for someone to just be with. Yes they are "gay" ad's....no I'm not looking for sex. The thing I've been searching for for a long time is just someone that I can connect with emotionally and not in a physical way. I want someone who wants to be with me and not because they feel like they have to, but because they want to. Someone who calls me up and asks me to do stuff with them. Someone who I can go to for a hug and I'm not talking about a sissy hug, I'm talking about a hug where I can stand there and not let go for a couple minutes and not be worried what the other guy is thinking because I haven't let go, but instead be able to concentrate on the calmness and comfort from a friend. If someone were to hug me at this point I would break down crying. I'm tired of calling people and being told how busy they are and being told no all the time or being told I'll call you later and they never do. I'm tired of revolving around others. Before when I was seeking someone it was for a sexuall relationship, this time I am searching for someone to just be with because there are alot more guys out there seeking the same. I know it may be a mistake, a sin, or that I may get hurt even more, but I just can't keep going the way I am. The depression is bad....worse than any time before. I've never been to a point of withdrawing and avoiding phone calls to this extent. I'm not happy with life at all. I've gotten to the point of the promises from God mean nothing to me. "I will not leave or Forsake you"......I just don't buy it anymore. I wish it were true, but for me it's not because after 5 years my heart is just as hard as it was before. If you felt like you were to pray for me then what God was speaking to you was right. I'm not ok at all, but I'm tired of trying to reach out for help because you knwo what, it doesn't matter, nothing matters.....I don't matter. yes, these are the thoughts going through my head and I can't drown them out anymore because I just don't have the energy left. I've lost hope and have given up.
 
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doofus125

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Tonight my life almost ended. As I sat here I finally reached the lowest point in my life. In my hands was my loaded gun and I was ready to go and then my phone rang. It was my friend Dave. I wasn't going to answer it, but for some reason I did. I ended up going to his house and without him knowing anything was wrong I blurted out that I was going to blow my head off. We talked for a while, I feel a little bit better. If I think about doing it again I'm to call him. I don't know if I can depend on him, but at this point he is the only person that I can talk to or turn to for help. I'm going to bed, I have to be up for work in 5 hours and I'm emotionally drained.
 
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Brother you need help! You can not do this on your own....you need professional help! God gives us professionals in this world to help us...hence medicine and therapy. Please for your sake and for our sake seek help now...the easiest thing you can do is go see a doctor or better yet a psychiatrist and get on anti-depressants and probably some anti-anxiety for a few weeks. Regardless of what you think I think about you I do care! and want you to make it through this horrbile season...I am praying for you!!! Now go get some help brother!

Keep us updated...We Care!!!
 
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doofus125

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justreading said:
Brother you need help! You can not do this on your own....you need professional help! God gives us professionals in this world to help us...hence medicine and therapy. Please for your sake and for our sake seek help now...the easiest thing you can do is go see a doctor or better yet a psychiatrist and get on anti-depressants and probably some anti-anxiety for a few weeks. Regardless of what you think I think about you I do care! and want you to make it through this horrbile season...I am praying for you!!! Now go get some help brother!

Keep us updated...We Care!!!
Been there, done that....several times.....nothing works......I'm sick of people and dr's.
 
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transforming

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I just read the email you posted above. My heart goes out to you brother. I know you're mad at Jesus, as though He is the cause of your pain, lonliness and sexual confusion. But I pray that the Lord will show you that it is in fact satan himself that has filled your mind and heart with such loathsome lies. He (satan) is the one who hates you and wants you to give up and end your life, and Jesus is the one who loves you and is helping you to keep going .... just one day at a time. I believe that deep down in your heart you know this... thats why you're on this and other christian forums. Theres a part of you that knows to reach out to the Body and to our Lord for help. As mad and disallusioned as you are right now, deep down in your heart you know that Jesus is the ONLY one who is able to help you. Whatever "friendship" you find through a gay personal ad will be nothing more than satan's cheap, foul, counterfeit answer to your God given longing for male friendship and brotherhood....and he knows that... and I believe that you know this too. You also know that anyone who responds to the ad WILL want to have a sexual relationship with you. You will eventually fall into this sin and the enemy will have "successfully" brought you to such a level of guilt and shame that will leave you totally paralized and feeling even less fullfilled. Thats satan's ultimate plan for you... to rob, kill and destroy you, and then fool you into thinking that it is our Jesus who's the blame. He (satan) wants to do this because he knows just how precious you are to our Lord, and he hates our Lord with every fiber of his fallen, corrupt being. Like all punk, rather than attack the "big brother" (our Lord), satan goes after us weaker, little brothers and sisters.

Probably one of the hardest things for you to do right now is to praise the Lord and tell Him how much you love Him and need Him. Satan knows that and wants to keep you from reaching out to the Lord... because "He inhabits the praises of His people." I believe that our Lord has something truely amazing in store for you and a story that only will be able to tell. The enemy is doing everything he can to make sure that you never experience your blessing and that your story of Jesus' love is never told. Doof, I am going to be praying that you will totally throw yourself into our Lord's arms. I'm going to be praying that you begin to praise and speak love to the Lord right now, while you are feeling at your lowest... right in the dark, middle of your pain. You will be amazed at how the Lord will be there.... trust me I know. Our Lord loves you and has not given up on you. Please give Him one more chance... don't give up on Him.

With much love and prayers
Trans
 
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doofus125

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I'm going on vacation for a few days, I need to get away. I'll be going to spend the time with my friend and his wife, both know my situation and I just need to spend some time with someone that I can talk to and someone who will sit there with me while I cry. A 500 mile trip like this by myself is not a good idea at all, but it's my last option. We'll get to spend Wed afternoon, thurs, fri, & saturday together before other friends come to stay the week and then I'll come home with them the following friday, so that's 9 days away.

Here's an update on my situation.....

I've become severely depressed, to the point of being suicidal. I've become numb, no emotion at all. I'm not angry, I'm just numb. I can't tell you the last time I've been to church, it's been a couple of months at least. I have no desire to go back either. I've literally lost any motivation to live and no matter what I do It doesn't change. I am attracted to men. No matter how much I have prayed and others have prayed, I just have no desire to change that. Like I said, I like men. Everywhere I go there is some hot guy and my heart starts raceing because I want him. So many opportunities to have someone and I always freak out and walk away. I freak out because I'm to embarassed to admit to the people around me (mostly my family) that I am gay. I'm to embarased to admit to my friends that I want to pursue other men even though they already know of my attractions because I'm afraid of rejection. If I could change my attractions I would, but there are things about a man that I desire that women could just never satisfy. I want to have kids so badly, but the chances of that are very slim. I love kids, not in a perverted way either....I say this because alot of people associate a gay guy as some kind of molester. I want to be able to raise a daughter that will be able to look at her daddy and see him as the strong man he is that would do anything to protect her. I want to be able to raise a son that I can do the things with that my father never did with me.....play catch, go fishing, to protect him from the things that I've been through, to teach him to be a strong man with a love for God, to just be there for him and love him no matter what. I'm so lonely....I just want to matter to someone.
 
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