The Wisdom of Pope St. Pius X

[LivingWordUnity]

"We wish to draw your attention, Venerable Brethren, to this distortion of the Gospel and to the sacred character of Our Lord Jesus Christ, God and man, prevailing within the Sillon and elsewhere. As soon as the social question is being approached, it is the fashion in some quarters to first put aside the divinity of Jesus Christ, and then to mention only His unlimited clemency, His compassion for all human miseries, and His pressing exhortations to the love of our neighbor and to the brotherhood of men. True, Jesus has loved us with an immense, infinite love, and He came on earth to suffer and die so that, gathered around Him in justice and love, motivated by the same sentiments of mutual charity, all men might live in peace and happiness. But for the realization of this temporal and eternal happiness, He has laid down with supreme authority the condition that we must belong to His Flock, that we must accept His doctrine, that we must practice virtue, and that we must accept the teaching and guidance of Peter and his successors. Further, whilst Jesus was kind to sinners and to those who went astray, He did not respect their false ideas, however sincere they might have appeared. He loved them all, but He instructed them in order to convert them and save them. Whilst He called to Himself in order to comfort them, those who toiled and suffered, it was not to preach to them the jealousy of a chimerical equality. Whilst He lifted up the lowly, it was not to instill in them the sentiment of a dignity independent from, and rebellious against, the duty of obedience. Whilst His heart overflowed with gentleness for the souls of good-will, He could also arm Himself with holy indignation against the profaners of the House of God, against the wretched men who scandalized the little ones, against the authorities who crush the people with the weight of heavy burdens without putting out a hand to lift them. He was as strong as he was gentle. He reproved, threatened, chastised, knowing, and teaching us that fear is the beginning of wisdom, and that it is sometimes proper for a man to cut off an offending limb to save his body. Finally, He did not announce for future society the reign of an ideal happiness from which suffering would be banished; but, by His lessons and by His example, He traced the path of the happiness which is possible on earth and of the perfect happiness in heaven: the royal way of the Cross. These are teachings that it would be wrong to apply only to one's personal life in order to win eternal salvation; these are eminently social teachings, and they show in Our Lord Jesus Christ something quite different from an inconsistent and impotent humanitarianism."

- Notre Charge Apostolique ("Our Apostolic Mandate")

 

[Fish and Bread]

Well, at least the thread isn't titled "The Wisdom of the Saint Pius X Society"....

 

[LivingWordUnity]

Well, at least the thread isn't titled "The Wisdom of the Saint Pius X Society"....

SSPX Catholics are wise to like Pope St. Pius X. But they are mistaken in their belief that the Popes that came after Pius XII were less than orthodox.

 

[ebia]

SSPX Catholics are wise to like Pope St. Pius X. But they are mistaken in their belief that the Popes that came after Pius XII were less than orthodox.

I guess their idea of what is orthodox is wrong.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

I guess their idea of what is orthodox is wrong.

I think they are judging the post-Vatican II Popes based on the widespread abuses that have been done in the name of Vatican II. But, as I have shown (here), the post-Vatican II Popes have lamented the abuses and have said that people have misinterpreted Vatican II.

 

[ebia]

I think they are judging the post-Vatican II Popes based on the widespread abuses that have been done in the name of Vatican II. But, as I have shown (here), the post-Vatican II Popes have lamented the abuses and have said that people have misinterpreted Vatican II.

From what I've read there's more than that they object to

 

[LivingWordUnity]

From what I've read there's more than that they object to

I think I covered basically all of what they object to (here).

 

[ebia]

I think I covered basically all of what they object to (here).

I don't think you have. I think you've posted what you think they ought to object to.

 

[Fish and Bread]

About 15 years ago, I did a little research on these folks. Many of the SSPX websites are, or at least were, scary. I am not sure if I can post links or not because they are not in communion with Rome and it might be considering promoting them, which, believe me, I in no way would want to do, they are my polar opposites theologically.

However, here is an excerpt straight from their official website, right now, I have bolded the portions where they accuse or imply that church councils (Mainly Vatican II), Popes, and the mainline church of being heretical in some way, and speak of the "new mass" (i.e. the one celebrated by 99% of Catholics) as being illegitimate, heretical, and possibly invalid:

The present evil... is nothing less than the logical continuation of the heresies and errors which have been undermining the Church in recent centuries, especially since the Liberalism of the [19th] century which has striven at all costs to reconcile the Church with the ideas that led to the French Revolution....

“We have lived to see the marriage of the Catholic Church with Liberal ideas. It would be to deny the evidence, to be willfully blind, not to state courageously that the Council has allowed those who profess the errors and tendencies condemned by the popes named above, legitimately to believe that their doctrines were approved and sanctioned....

“Thus, driven to this by the facts, we are forced to conclude that the Council has encouraged, in an inconceivable manner, the spreading of Liberal errors. Faith, morals, and ecclesiastical discipline are shaken to their foundations, fulfilling the predictions of all the popes. The destruction of the Church is advancing at a rapid pace.”

[...]The declaration Dignitatis humanae and the constitution Gaudium et spes give a definition of the relation between the Church and the modern State that is different from the one taught by Quanta cura and Quas primas. Instead of condemning, as Pius IX, Leo XIII and Pius XI had done, the principle of religious liberty and State indifferentism, Vatican II adopts it.

The constitution Lumen gentium, the decree Unitatis redintegratio and the declaration Nostra aetate give a different definition of the relation between the Christian Faith and other religions than the one taught by the Syllabus, Satis cognitum and Mortalium animos. Instead of condemning, as previous popes had done, the principle that non-Catholic religions had a certain salvific value, Vatican II adopts it.

[...]the Second Vatican Council adopted the same approach as modern thought and that this led it to produce a new concept of the relation of the Church both to civil societies and to other religions, a concept that is incompatible with the previous Magisterium. Since the Magisterium by definition is constant, the statements that prove to be incompatible with what it already proposed could not possible be vested with magisterial authority, properly speaking.

Consequently we deny that the teachings of Vatican II on religious liberty and ecumenism (as well as those concerning collegiality and the new ecclesiology)

[...]This serious shortcoming prevents us from regarding this new rite as legitimate and even allows us to doubt the validity of the celebrations in more than one instance. Masses celebrated in conformity with the Novus Ordo are not only less good than those celebrated according to the traditional Ordo of St. Pius V; they are bad

[...]
In the questionnaire dated January 11-12, 1979, to the question posed by the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith:

Do you maintain that a faithful Catholic can think and affirm that a sacramental rite, in particular the rite of the Mass, approved and promulgated by the Supreme Pontiff may be not in conformity with the Catholic Faith orfavens haeresim [promoting heresy]?”,

Archbishop Lefebvre answered:

In itself this rite does not profess the Catholic Faith as clearly as the old OrdoMissae did and consequently it may promote heresy. But I do not know to whom it should be attributed, nor whether the pope is responsible for it. What is astonishing is that an Ordo Missae smacking of Protestantism and thereforefavens haeresim could have been issued by the Roman Curia.”

[...]the New Mass of Paul VI could not be the object of a [liturgical] law; it is not only bad but also illegitimate, despite all the appearances of legality with which it has been and is still surrounded.

These are just random excerpt's from the SSPX's own official site I plucked off here to demonstrate this point. Believe me, I could find worse, especially on unofficial sites.

One of their four bishops is a Holocaust denier who was criminally charged in Europe, and anti-Semetism is rampant in the SSPX. And I don't mean like when people call me an anti-semite for not liking the policies of Netanyahu's administration in Israel, I mean really indisputable hatred of all things Jewish.

You get into some of the unofficial sites of their devotees and you'll start see really, really out there stuff. This is just the tip of the iceberg, the face they are officially displaying to the public.

I know someone who has the equivalent of a master degree from a Pontifical university in Rome and went to a very conservative Catholic school as an undergrad and is very conservative socially and politically. She says as an undergrad she knew people in the SSPX and felt they were way out there and scary. This is not someone who would say something like that likely or has an ax to grind with conservativism or traditional church teachings. She is a conservative.

This is a bad road to go down. I would strongly advise people not to get involved with this group in any way. If you want to see a mass in the old rite, which is a beautiful liturgy, go to a mass in full communion with Rome, not an SSPX mass.

 

[LivingWordUnity]

I don't think you have. I think you've posted what you think they ought to object to.

Can you tell me what you think I have not included?