THE NUMBERS

[alex2165]

It was a while ago, during my study of the Bible I found certain dates which I can’t figure them out. So I hope may be someone here come up with the answer.


Period of Judes 450 years.

Apostle Paul mentioned period of the judges of Israel, and he came up with a number of their total period of 450 years, Acts 13.19 in NRSV, and Gideons; Acts 13.20 in KSB, GNB, and Russian.


Acts 13.19

19.And when He had destroyed seven nations in the land of Canaan, He distributed their land as an inheritance, all of which took about four hundred and fifty years (450).


The period of Judges starts right after Joshua, because he was not a judge but he replaced Moses and had a status as Moses, means he was the leader of Israel, and he finished the job that Moses did not finished, to take Israel into the land of Canaan.

The period of Judges may lasted approximately from 300 to 350 years, if we start to count it from Othniel to Samson. But the number of 450 mentioned by Paul also can be a valid number, if we include in this period of Judges all other times when the land rested from wars and in between.


Solomon began to build the Temple of the Lord in 480th years after exodus of Israel from Egypt.


1Kings 6.1

1.”Now it came about in the four hundred and eightieth year (480th year) after the sons of Israel came out of the land of Egypt, in fourth year of Solomon's reign over Israel, in the month of Ziv, which is the second month, that he began to build the House of the Lord.”


And the question is where the rest of history will fit in these 30 years gap, between period of Judges 450 years and building of the Temple 480 years after Exodus from Egypt?


1.Period of Travel of Israel in the desert after exodus from Egypt. 40 years.

2.Period of Conquest of Canaan by Joshua (unknown).


3.Period of Judges. 450 years according to Paul. Acts 13.19. From Othniel to Samsom, roughly 12 judges of Israel, more or less.


Period after Judges.


4.Period of Eli the priest. Judged Israel 40 years. 1Samuel 4.18

5.Period of Samuel the priest. (Unknown). Because priests started from 25 or 35 and served until 50, so it seems that Samuel may served about 25 years as priest, but he also was and a prophet, and perhaps served the Lord much longer.

6.Period of Saul the king. Reigned 2 years which indicated in most Bibles, only KSB specified 32 years.

7.Period of David. Reigned 40 years. 1Kings 2.10-11

8.Period of Solomon to the 4th year of his rule when he started to build the Temple. 1Kings 6.1.


So the periods between Judges and the building of the Temple, the periods of Eli, of Samuel, of Saul, and of David, do not fit between Judges and the construction of the Temple in the gap of 30 years.


If we assume that period of Judges may be was much less when indicated, then we have to look to the words of Jephthah.

In the Book of Judges, Jephthah said to the king of Ammonites that Israel already lived 300 years in the land of Giled since the conquest of the land by Ruben, Gad, and a half tribe of Manasseh during Joshua’s time. Judges 11.26.


Judges 11.26

26.While Israel lived in Heshbon and its villages, and in Aroer and its villages, and in all the cities that are on the banks of the Arnon, three hundred years (300), why did you not recover them within that time?


Deliverer Jephthah was somewhere in the middle in the sequence of the deliverers of Israel, and from him to the Samson, the last mentioned deliverer of Israel, it may took another 150 years, including all the time of rest and peace between wars. So again, the number 450 years of Judges of Israel seems to be the right number.


So the building of the Temple 480 years after Exodus from Egypt mentioned in 1Kings 6.1, this time period is perhaps too short to accommodate all other periods of times mentioned above, between period of Judges and construction of the Temple.


If anybody has any suggestions or comments, I certainly would like to here them.


Thank you in advance.


Alex

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

I think you're reading the text wrong. You take the 450 years to mean the period of the judges, but that's not how it seems to be written, at least in the ESV. This is how it's written in the ESV:

17 The God of this people Israel chose our fathers and made the people great during their stay in the land of Egypt, and with uplifted arm he led them out of it. 18 And for about forty years he put up with them in the wilderness. 19 And after destroying seven nations in the land of Canaan, he gave them their land as an inheritance. 20 All this took about 450 years. And after that he gave them judges until Samuel the prophet.

The key words are "after that." It took Israel 450 years to take possession of the land, and after that came the judges. Therefore, the judges are not part of the 450 years. If you look at the period of time before Israel enters the promised land, it would appear that 450 years is the approximate time between when God first promised the land to Abraham and when Israel actually took possession of it. The judges came after that.

 

[alex2165]

Hi Nonaero

Acts 13.19, is written very much the same way in all Bibles I have, NRSV, GNB, GNB, and Gideons, and in your Bible very much the same.

Whatever the 450 years indicate, the period of Judges or after Judges it is a subject to debate, and personally I believe that it actually period of Judges, because it is very improbable that it took 450 years for Israelites to conquer the land of Canaan, certainly it was much less than that.

And again, you have to take a look at words of Jepthah Judges 11.26 , who was somewhere in the middle of Judges, who indicated 300 years period from the conquest of Gilead and up to his time. So from him to the last judge Samson probably passed another 150 years which is seem right.

But the problem not with the period of Judges or after it, but with the total number from Exodus from Egypt and to the building of the Temple which is written as 480 years.

Look again at 1Kings 6.1

1.”Now it came about in the four hundred and eightieth year (480th year) after the sons of Israel came out of the land of Egypt, in fourth year of Solomon's reign over Israel, in the month of Ziv, which is the second month, that he began to build the House of the Lord.”

This passage clearly specifies that “in the four hundred and eightieth year (480th year) after the sons of Israel came out of the land of Egypt”

And even with you suggestion concerning period of Judges, there is no definite answer how 480 years from Exodus to the construction of the Temple can possibly include all those periods between these two great events.

So the problem here not with period of Judges, I give it here as a reference point, but with the 480 years, which is seems too small and could not possible leave any room for the periods of time between Exodus and the building of the Temple.

And if take to account you suggestion that this 450 years is the period after Judges, the problem getting even much worse than before.

Try to recalculate again, or find some other contradiction or proof concerning 480 years between Exodus and the beginning of the Temple.

Alex.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

And if take to account you suggestion that this 450 years is the period after Judges, the problem getting even much worse than before.

Try to recalculate again, or find some other contradiction or proof concerning 480 years between Exodus and the beginning of the Temple.

Wait! Hold on! Now you're reading my post wrong. I never said that the 450 years is the period after the judges. I said that the 450 years is the period before the judges. It's the period, very roughly, from Abraham to the time Israel takes the promised land. That was in the ballpark of 450 years, and that's the literal meaning of the text as I read it.

The 480 years that you mention starts from the exodus, and ends at the beginning of the building of the Temple. Those two time periods, the 480 years and the 450 years, overlap each other to some extent, but they are not entirely the same.

If you look at the timeline that I posted above, Abraham was around 1926 B.C., and Joshua entered Canaan around 1456 B.C. That's 470 years, which is in my estimation a good rough approximation of the 450 years.

If you look at that same timeline, you'll see that the exodus begins at around 1496 B.C. and the temple began construction around 1000 B.C., which is 496 years and rather close to the 480 year period that you mention.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Apostle Paul mentioned period of the judges of Israel, and he came up with a number of their total period of 450 years, Acts 13.19 in NRSV, and Gideons; Acts 13.20 in KSB, GNB, and Russian.

I just cross-referenced the NRSV, the GNB, and six different Russian translations (I have too much time on my hands). I don't happen to have a Gideon with me at the moment, and I don't know what KSB is (kid's study Bible?). All of them, except one, use syntax that clearly state that the period of the judges follows after the 450 years. Only the Russian Synodal Version might use wording that could be taken to mean that the 450 years is the period of the judges.

Therefore, this verse gives you no reason to assume that the period of the judges lasted 450 years.

 

[alex2165]

Hi guys


In Acts 13.19 of KSB, NRSV, ESV, and GNB Bibles, Paul wrote that the conquest and distribution of the land of Canaan after Exodus from Egypt took 450 years.


In Acts 13.20 of KJV, Gideons and Russian Bibles, it is written that the period of Judges was 450 years.


KJV-King James Version, KSB-Key Study Bible; Editor Zodhiates, NRSV-New Revised Standard Version, ESV-English Standard Version, GNB-Good News Bible.


But in any case, wherever the 450 years was before Judges, or the period of Judges the problem still persists.


480 years from the Exodus of Egypt and to the beginning of construction of the Temple looks too small if we include in it 450 years of Judges or as it written in other Bibles the conquest of Canaan.


Because the gap between 450 and 480 only 30 years, and from (after) the period of Judges and to beginning of construction of the Temple this 30 years leaves no room for the periods of time after Judges such as:


Time of Eli the priest, 40 years. 1Samuel 4.18

Time of Samuel, which is unknown (most likely 20 years or more).

Time of Saul's rule. 2 years. 1Samuel 14.1

Time of David's rule, 40 years. 1Kings 2.10-11

Time of Solomon who started building the Temple only in the 4th year of his reign. 1Kings.6.1)


I already contacted one Jewish man who knows the Hebrew and has Hebrew Bible, and I wait for reply from him in order to find out what kind of number is written in his Bible, 480 or a different one.