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The Nephilim: Offspring of Angels and Humans?

Discussion in 'General Theology' started by footballfanatic, Feb 4, 2013.

  1. Jipsah

    Jipsah Blood Drinker

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    :doh: And at that point we left the envelope of controlled flight...
     
  2. yeshuasavedme

    yeshuasavedme Senior Veteran

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    Enoch chapter 10:
    4And again the Lord said to Raphael: "Bind Azazel hand and foot, and cast him into the darkness: and make an opening in the desert, which is in Dudael, and cast him therein. 5And place upon him rough and jagged rocks, and cover him with darkness, and let him abide there for ever, and cover his face that he may not see light. 6And on the day of the great judgement he shall be cast into the fire. 7And heal the earth which the angels have corrupted, and proclaim the healing of the earth, that they may heal the plague, and that all the children of men may not perish through all the secret things that the Watchers have disclosed and have taught their sons. 8And the whole earth has been corrupted through the works that were taught by Azazel: to him ascribe all sin." 9And to Gabriel said the Lord: "Proceed against the bastards and the reprobates, and against the children of fornication: and destroy the children of fornication and the children of the Watchers from amongst men: and cause them to go forth: send them one against the other that they may destroy each other in battle: for length of days shall they not have. 10And no request that they i.e. their fathers make of thee shall be granted unto their fathers on their behalf; for they hope to live an eternal life, and that each one of them will live five hundred years."


    seventy Generations from Methuselah to Jesus Christ
    11And the Lord said unto Michael: "Go, bind Semjaza and his associates who have united themselves with women so as to have defiled themselves with them in all their uncleanness. 12And when their sons have slain one another, and they have seen the destruction of their beloved ones, bind them fast for seventy generations in the valleys of the earth, till the day of their judgement and of their consummation, till the judgement that is for ever and ever is consummated. 13In those days they shall be led off to the abyss of fire: and to the torment and the prison in which they shall be confined for ever. 14And whosoever shall be condemned and destroyed will from thenceforth be bound together with them to the end of all generations. 15And destroy all the spirits of the reprobate and the children of the Watchers, because they have wronged mankind. 16Destroy all wrong from the face of the earth and let every evil work come to an end: and let the plant of righteousness and truth appear: and it shall prove a blessing; the works of righteousness and truth shall be planted in truth and joy for evermore.
     
  3. yeshuasavedme

    yeshuasavedme Senior Veteran

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    The spirit of the kind is the driving force which is under the command of God the Creator to multiply the kind, by the seed created within the kind.
    The spirit of the kind builds the flesh house for the kind, in the womb -or egg outside the womb- when a seed of the kind germinates by that same direction of the spirit/nature/force/being, of the kind.
    The created spirit of the kind directs the multiplication of the kind from the beginning of it to the completion of it, and sustains it in its kind, until the body housing the soul dies.

    All kinds are one created spirit, and each seed come to fruit in its kind has a share/a remnant of that spirit.

    Malachi 2:15 shows us that Adam was not only made one flesh, bone, and blood, but one spirit, because God sought godly seed =sons of God, before the fall.
     
  4. mmksparbud

    mmksparbud Well-Known Member

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    I wonder what would have happened if, instead of a tiger and a lion (still in the cat family)--they tried it with a tiger and a rhino??--
    Twins--how about triplets, how about the 8 with Octomom??!! They must have bred her to a St. Bernard as 8 is no longer giving birth to children, at that point, it's a litter!!
    How about the children of lesbians who have a turkey baster and good male friend? Is the father the turkey baster??--Inquiring minds want to know--which reminds me--I have to take out the garbage.
     
  5. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis De profundis clamavi et exaudisti me.

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    It's amazing isn't it, when you realize you've been trying to talk to someone who doesn't even live on the same planet as you do.

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  6. squint

    squint New Member

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    This short (17 min.) vid clip should bring anyone up to speed on the subject.

    Not a lot of woo woo spiritual stuff. Just interesting archeological facts.

    For some reason it has been deleted and re-posted a couple times on Youtube. It's also interesting that there isn't more common knowledge disseminated to the population on these matters. The Smithsonian has been a deposit of large skeletons over the years, but for some odd reason you just don't hear much about it or see them on display. When I was a kid most of the farmers in the area I grew up took this information as common knowledge as many mounds and skeletal remains had been recovered throughout the state.

    It's quite interesting.

    http://http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d_FSmvBgHUc

    s
     
  7. Rhamiel

    Rhamiel Member of the Round Table

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    I think that the plain reading of the text leads to the idea that angels and humans mated

    I believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God

    this is not a big deal for me, the Seth theory could be correct, it just does not seem very convincing to me
     
  8. Lion King

    Lion King Veni, vidi, vici

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    Angels can and sometimes, do take human form. For instance, the angels that visited Abraham and Sarah took human form and even ate food with them.

    Angels are referred to as the "sons of God" in the book of Job (Job 1:6; Job 38:7).

    Is the LORD responsible for the rebellion of satan, since He allowed it to happen? Is the LORD responsible for the fall of man, since He allowed the serpent to tempt Eve?

    As I understand it, the angels took human form and had children with mortal women, but they themselves, never became mortal. As punishment for their sins, the LORD has them in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day (Jude 1:6).

    I don't think that verse applies to this.

    And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight. Numbers 13:33

    Are angels taking on human form, even today? Yes!

    Are demons taking on human form even today? No! (that would be a bit difficult since they are under chains).

    In order to prove these so-called false teachers incorrect, all you gotta do is provide clear Scriptural evidence that refutes their doctrine. It's that simple.
     
  9. Rhamiel

    Rhamiel Member of the Round Table

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    when the bad angels fell from grace
    I believe they did not loose the natural abilities that were part of their nature
    so if the good angels can appear like men, I see no reason that the bad angels would not be able to as well

    unless we believe that the ability for angels to appear human is a special miracle done by God and is not an ability innate ability of the angels themself

    the Bible seems to be silent on this one way or the other
     
  10. squint

    squint New Member

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    As far as the 'serpent's seed' theories within Christiandom they were branded (rightfully so imho) as heresies by the early churches.

    So no, there are no 'human devils' as far as 'devils physical progeny' mixed with 'human physical progeny.'

    This does not mean any of us are exempt from demonic internal influences though. That is an entirely different matter/conversation.

    So if THIS is being discussed we are all 'inbred' to some extent, EVILly speaking.

    There are genetics. There are spiritual matters.

    Different matters.

    Paul advised us all that we are to know no man after the flesh, not even Jesus.

    s
     
  11. Lion King

    Lion King Veni, vidi, vici

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    I don't believe that verse implies angels are sexless (neither male or female), but simply that they neither marry nor are they given in marriage.
     
  12. granpa

    granpa Noahide/Rationalist

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    Gen 6:2, Gen 6:4, Job 1:6, Job 2:1, Job 38:7, John 1:12, Rom 8:14 Rom 8:19, Php 2:15, 1 Jn 3:1, 1 Jn 3:2 NIV - the sons of God saw that the daughters - Bible Gateway

    Genesis 6:2

    New International Version (NIV)

    2 the sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose.

    Genesis 6:4

    New International Version (NIV)

    4 The Nephilim were on the earth in those days—and also afterward—when the sons of God went to the daughters of humans and had children by them. They were the heroes of old, men of renown.



    Job 1:6

    New International Version (NIV)

    6 One day the angels[a] came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan[b] also came with them.
    Footnotes:


    1. Job 1:6 Hebrew the sons of God
    2. Job 1:6 Hebrew satan means adversary.




    Job 2:1

    New International Version (NIV)

    2 On another day the angels[a] came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan also came with them to present himself before him.
    Footnotes:


    1. Job 2:1 Hebrew the sons of God




    Job 38:7

    New International Version (NIV)

    7 while the morning stars sang together
    and all the angels[a] shouted for joy?

    Footnotes:


    1. Job 38:7 Hebrew the sons of God
    John 1:12

    New International Version (NIV)

    12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—




    John 1:12

    New International Version (NIV)

    12 Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—




    Philippians 2:15

    New International Version (NIV)

    15 so that you may become blameless and pure, “children of God without fault in a warped and crooked generation.”[a] Then you will shine among them like stars in the sky
    Footnotes:


    1. Philippians 2:15 Deut. 32:5
    1 John 3:1

    New International Version (NIV)

    3 See what great love the Father has lavished on us, that we should be called children of God! And that is what we are! The reason the world does not know us is that it did not know him.

    1 John 3:2

    New International Version (NIV)

    2 Dear friends, now we are children of God, and what we will be has not yet been made known. But we know that when Christ appears,[a] we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is.
    Footnotes:


    1. 1 John 3:2 Or when it is made known
     
  13. LaSpino3

    LaSpino3 Newbie

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    Lion king, thanks for taking the time to reply to my comments. But your responses are lacking any substance, no offence meant.

    I wrote, "Do I believe that demons can possess men? Yes! Through this possession, can they cause people to do evil against God and their fellow man? Yes! Now do I believe that demons can take on human form, and function as humans? No! This was a miracle accomplished only by Jesus Christ, "God manifest in the flesh."

    Lion king replied, "Angels can and sometimes, do take human form. For instance, the angels that visited Abraham and Sarah took human form and even ate food with them."

    Phil replies, "To your comment I am in full agreement: but your proposition has nothing to do with answering my proposition which was, "Can these fallen spiritits take on human form, AND function (procreate) meaning furtalize a woman, and reproduce as would a mortal man? There is not one shred of evidence in Scripture that would verify this.

    And by the way concerning the three that Abram saw. I agree that he saw, Gen.18:2, Abram saw three men, because Abram calls them men. But we also know that one of them was the Lord, because Abram calls him Lord, not upper case "L".

    But this human form that God took on to himself was not a one time event. Example, the Lord was seen in the burning furnace, "One like the Son of man." He was seen in heaven by Daniel, and John, "One like the Son of man." He wrestled with Jacob; seen by Manoah and his wife, and throughout both the old and N.T. But this was God who can do all things.

    But were the other two men, that Abram saw angels from heaven? First, they are called men in Scripture, for they ate, walked, talked, etc. They were also called angels, meaning messangers because this is what they did; they delivered a message.

    Only when they left for Sodom were they called angels, meaning messanges, because this is what the Lord had instructed them to do, deliver a message. In no way does it mean they were spirit creatures. In [FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Rev.1:20, the angels of the seven churches, were probably the bishops or pastors of these churches, who were the delegates, messengers, of the churches to God in the offering of prayer, etc. [/FONT]

    The two may have been men like Elisha, Elijah, Moses, or whoever, men who were given power by God to accomplish His will. Its not unusual for mere men to do miracles. Elisha made fire come down from heaven, Moses opened up the sea, etc. but these were mortal men doing God's will. We have no absolute evidence thee other two Abram saw were angels from heaven. Lot in Gen.19:2, calls the lords, not lower case "lord." What we are sure of, they were called both men and angels.

    Phil wrote, "Who are the sons of God?" And who were these evil people that God was about to destroy in the flood? Were they mere men, or were they some form of hybrid creatures. The first clue comes from Luke 3:38, it is simple in its wording, and very clear in its meaning.

    "Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God." Scripture calls Adam, "the son of God." So the Scriptures clearly represent the first man as, "the son of God," as did the line of Seth, the son of Adam up to the flood, including Noah."

    Lion king replied, "Angels are referred to as the "sons of God" in the book of Job (Job 1:6; Job 38:7)."

    Phil replies, "Again, I agree with your proposition, but it has nothig to do with my question. It has nothing to do with the sons of God that you believe are angels (spirit creatures,) who you claim turned themselves into mortal men and had children by mortal women.

    Now concerning the words "sons of God." It also means children, or sons of. If someone is called the "son of God," it is said they partake of the things of God, as in "Children of the kingdom, Children of the light, those subject to the privileges and blessings of God. Sons of peace, sons of consolation, etc.

    Then there are the sons of, or children of, (children is a synonym for son) the wicked one, meaning subjects, vassals of Satan, "Children (sons) of the devil." There are sons of this world; Children (sons) of disobedience, Son of perdition, etc. These partake in the things of the wicked one.

    Conclusion, in no way according to the Hebrewism of the Scriptures would fallen angels be called "Sons of God,"

    If I am incorrect please give me chapter and verse using the Hebrew word, "ben = son, sons, children."

    Phil LaSpino
     
  14. footballfanatic

    footballfanatic Only John Waye Left

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    Just wanted to point out a couple of things that were in the article but I think most folks here just saw the thread title and started debating.

    Angels were able to take on a physical, human-like form. The "men" who went to Sodom for example. They were thought to be men, good looking men at that because the people of Sodom demanded to be able to have sex with them. Turns out, they were angels.

    And then there's the passage about entertaining angels unaware. So they can take on a form that is at least close to human form. So the question is, in that human form (how human is unknown of course) could they "mate" with a human.

    Someone said that the Scriptures didn't say that God allowed that. But the Scriptures also don't say that God didn't allow it so we can't know. And a lot of things that dark angels and humans have done have been things NOT allowed by God. It's called sin.

    Another question ignored by those who argue that "sons of God" were descendants of Seth is the heroic and the near super-human states of the "Nephilim." Why would some be giants and they be called, "Men of renowned, heroes of old"?

    There's some good points to be made for "sons of God" being angels in physical form. In Job, "sons of God" means angels as well as in other places in the Bible. It sure seems like the stretching and assuming is happening on the ones who are quickly dismissing the Nephilim being half human, half angel.
     
  15. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy

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    What is very amazing to me is that People do not look at what is happening TODAY and see what is happening in the science world and compare it to scripture. It is just amazing to me! How can you say you believe that demons can inhabit humans, or pigs for that matter, but you don't believe that a clone of yourself can be demonically possessed! What is this? Do people really deny what scriptures has revealed? Jesus said that what is coming on the Earth will be so horrendous that people's hearts will fail in fear! Jesus is our Lord so we need not fear, but so many of us who name Jesus as Lord do not believe that the things the Bible says will happen again actually will happen. I guess this is what Noah was up against when he tried to warn the world of the coming flood.
     
  16. ViaCrucis

    ViaCrucis De profundis clamavi et exaudisti me.

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    Not so much Noah as the boy who cried wolf.

    There's a reason why we don't believe ligers, mules, and studying the human genome aren't fulfillment of ancient biblical prophecy: because the Bible doesn't say anything even remotely like that.

    It never mentions gene splicing, it doesn't mention things of that nature. No where, at all, in any of its sacred pages.

    It takes an inventive imagination to try and look at an apple and a basketball and say, "these are the same, they're both round...ish!"

    -CryptoLutheran
     
  17. Handmaid for Jesus

    Handmaid for Jesus You can't steal my joy

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    Originally posted by ViaCrusis
    Oh but it does and I posted the scripture. But, I will post it again.

    Dan. 2:43 And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay.(KJV emphasis mine)
     
  18. Lion King

    Lion King Veni, vidi, vici

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    I respectfully disagree. I believe that Genesis 6 speaks of angels (sons of God) mating with mortals and producing unnatural offsprings (giants/nephilims).

    Now it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose.

    And the Lord said, “My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.” There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. Genesis 6:1-4


    I understand what you are saying but the Genesis 18 and 19 passage proves without a doubt to me that the men that visited Lot were none other than heavenly angels of the LORD.

    You are correct, fallen angels can never be called the sons of God. Why can they never be called that? Because they chose to leave their place.

    The angels in Genesis 6 were rightly called the sons of God because they only became fallen after taking themselves the daughters of man. Before that, they belonged to the LORD.
     
  19. Nanopants

    Nanopants Guest

    I think it's kind of interesting that whenever the topic of angels comes up, the weirdness comes out of the closet. Maybe this could have something to do with it?

    Let no one cheat you of your reward, taking delight in [false] humility and worship of angels, intruding into those things which he has not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, and not holding fast to the Head, from whom all the body, nourished and knit together by joints and ligaments, grows with the increase [that is] from God. -Col 2:18,19

    Just a thought.
     
  20. yeshuasavedme

    yeshuasavedme Senior Veteran

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    Who is taking delight in "humility" and worship of angels on this forum?
    Please name names, and show your reason for such an accusation..
     
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