The loving and Inclusive deception

[Loudmouth]

Umm. That's Islam that executes gays.

I guess you haven't been paying attention to politics in Africa.

As for those "rights": I can't marry my sister or add a second wife, so the "right to marry whomever you love" is already a non-right.

What reason do you have to deny that secular right to a homosexual couple?

 

[BryanW92]

I see nothing in the opening post that restricts it to just church membership. As we can see in the US right now, there is a christian backlash against secular rights being given to homosexual couples. It has nothing to do with trying to join a church.

The Christians have lost that battle and are just trying to protect the church now. The UMC is the last mainline denomination to fall and the gays are working hard to cause that split. But, even though the battle is lost in the secular world, we don't have to endorse the sodomite lifestyle. We only have to accept that it exists. But, that's never enough is it? You won't rest until we are forced to endorse that lifestyle and include it in our churches.

 

[Loudmouth]

The Christians have lost that battle and are just trying to protect the church now.

Protect themselves from what? Members of churches are not being forced to do anything as it relates to church decisions.

The UMC is the last mainline denomination to fall and the gays are working hard to cause that split. But, even though the battle is lost in the secular world, we don't have to endorse the sodomite lifestyle. We only have to accept that it exists. But, that's never enough is it? You won't rest until we are forced to endorse that lifestyle and include it in our churches.

Do whatever you want in your churches. There are still christian churches that speak out against mixed race marriages. I fully support their right to determine their own theology and church membership. All that I ask is that they realize that our constitutional freedoms are not restricted by their beliefs.

 

[BryanW92]

I guess you haven't been paying attention to politics in Africa.



What reason do you have to deny that secular right to a homosexual couple?

Islam is killing a lot more gays in Africa than Christianity.

I gave the reason. The state has ruled that I cannot add a second wife, so marriage has a narrow definition. There is no valid biological reason for monogamy being the only acceptable type of marriage and polygamy is practiced throughout the world already and has been since the beginning of mankind, so the state has already conformed to the biblical definition of marriage.

 

[BryanW92]

Protect themselves from what? Members of churches are not being forced to do anything as it relates to church decisions.



Do whatever you want in your churches. There are still christian churches that speak out against mixed race marriages. I fully support their right to determine their own theology and church membership. All that I ask is that they realize that our constitutional freedoms are not restricted by their beliefs.

You don't have a constitutional right to join my church, be ordained, or to force me to accept your lifestyle. Go ahead and get married by the state. I don't care. But don't sue my church to force us to allow your "wedding" to happen in our sanctuary (as was done with the cake baker and photographer and the B&B owners recently).

 

[Loudmouth]

Islam is killing a lot more gays in Africa than Christianity.

So now it's a numbers argument?

I gave the reason. The state has ruled that I cannot add a second wife, so marriage has a narrow definition. There is no valid biological reason for monogamy being the only acceptable type of marriage and polygamy is practiced throughout the world already and has been since the beginning of mankind, so the state has already conformed to the biblical definition of marriage.

I could have sworn I was talking about same sex couples, not polygamy.

What reason do you have for not adding same sex couples to the narrow definition as part of our secular society?

 

[BryanW92]

So now it's a numbers argument?



I could have sworn I was talking about same sex couples, not polygamy.

What reason do you have for not adding same sex couples to the narrow definition as part of our secular society?

You are talking about changing the definition of marriage. I'm saying that our state has already restricted it down to only a man and a woman from the traditional (and biological) man and multiple women.

But, even with that in mind, go ahead and marry. I still don't care. Just keep it out of my church.

But its funny that you think of this as oppression and intolerance. This just popped up on my newsfeed: Pregnant woman is stoned to death by her own family | New York Post

That, my friend, is religious oppression!! What are you doing to protest against that?

 

[Loudmouth]

But, even with that in mind, go ahead and marry. I still don't care. Just keep it out of my church.

That is certainly something we can both agree too.

But its funny that you think of this as oppression and intolerance.

You mean the ban on gay marriages that was openly supported by many christian groups? Yes, that is oppression and intolerance. What of it?

This just popped up on my newsfeed: Pregnant woman is stoned to death by her own family | New York Post

That, my friend, is religious oppression!! What are you doing to protest against that?

If there were threads here on this forum that supported the stoning of pregnant women, I would speak out. As it is, I don't see any laws on the books within the US that call fo the stoning of pregnant women, so excuse me if it isn't a top priority.

 

[RBPerry]

You feel forced to allow non-christians the same freedoms you enjoy?

Let me put it in the simplest terms so you just might get it. If your read my entire post, then your manipulative question is one of the stupidest you have come up with.

 

[Loudmouth]

Let me put it in the simplest turns so you just might get it. If your read my entire post, then your manipulative question is one of the stupidest you have come up with.

You mentioned being forced to do something by law. That is why I asked. Usually, people don't use the word "forced to" as a description for something they would do anyway.

 

[Gunny]

God's Holy Word is truly amazing to this follower of Jesus Christ. Approx. one third of scripture is prophetical. If one chooses to search/study God's Holy Word including the prophetical passages all present day events are taking place exactly as God states in His Word.

Having known this for many years it has been of great comfort to know that God is in control and sovereign and everything is taking place as He states in His Holy Word.

"As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man".

Matthew 24:37
NIV

 

[Jesse2014]

God's Holy Word is truly amazing to this follower of Jesus Christ. Approx. one third of scripture is prophetical. If one chooses to search/study God's Holy Word including the prophetical passages all present day events are taking place exactly as God states in His Word.

Having known this for many years it has been of great comfort to know that God is in control and sovereign and everything is taking place as He states in His Holy Word.

"As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man".

Matthew 24:37
NIV

I hope I am ready. I struggle with sin; and I hope I don't fall from grace.

 

[seeingeyes]

We are supposed to love one another and we are even taught to love our enemies but that has ZERO to do with salvation.

Why do you say that?

 

[RBPerry]

I hope I am ready. I struggle with sin; and I hope I don't fall from grace.

The only way you fall from grace is by rejecting Christ. Sin is an issue that we as humans struggle with. The longer you are a Christian, and remain in the word and prayer the stronger you become at resisting temptation. Read 1 Cor 10:13, I'm not going to post it, please look it up and memorize it, it will help.

 

[retlaw]

Why do you say that?

Salvation cannot be earned. The absolute best day of your life where you think you're mind was pure and you didn't lust or experience greed or selfishness or lie to anybody you were really a dirty filthy stinking sinner. Jesus gave us the standard when he said even the impure thought of a woman was the same as fornicating with her. His point was that we are completely incapable of the standard. Grace is the gift of something we we not deserve; we have not and could not earn it.

 

[seeingeyes]

Salvation cannot be earned. The absolute best day of your life where you think you're mind was pure and you didn't lust or experience greed or selfishness or lie to anybody you were really a dirty filthy stinking sinner. Jesus gave us the standard when he said even the impure thought of a woman was the same as fornicating with her. His point was that we are completely incapable of the standard. Grace is the gift of something we we not deserve; we have not and could not earn it.

So God gives you grace despite your dirty filthy stinking sin, and then you turn around and condemn others for their dirty filthy stinking sin. How will God react? (Hint: At least one of the parables is about exactly this.)

 

[BryanW92]

So God gives you grace despite your dirty filthy stinking sin, and then you turn around and condemn others for their dirty filthy stinking sin. How will God react? (Hint: At least one of the parables is about exactly this.)

God gave them the same grace. The difference is in what happens next. One group of people accept the grace and change their hearts and spend the rest of their life trying to live up to that gift.

The other group takes the grace, spits on it, and returns to their life of sin. The hold parades to show their pride in their sin. The judge people by saying "don't judge me" and declaring God's people to be hypocrites for trying to be worthy of the gift of grace and falling short. They demand that others accept their sin because experts have declared it to be "natural" while denying that all sin is natural since sin is our nature.

 

[seeingeyes]

God gave them the same grace. The difference is in what happens next. One group of people accept the grace and change their hearts and spend the rest of their life trying to live up to that gift.

The other group takes the grace, spits on it, and returns to their life of sin. The hold parades to show their pride in their sin. The judge people by saying "don't judge me" and declaring God's people to be hypocrites for trying to be worthy of the gift of grace and falling short. They demand that others accept their sin because experts have declared it to be "natural" while denying that all sin is natural since sin is our nature.

So what is God's reaction to those who receive grace, yet don't show the same grace to others?

 

[BryanW92]

So what is God's reaction to those who receive grace, yet don't show the same grace to others?

Telling a person that their sin is OK and they should continue to do it because it feels natural to them is not grace. It is the opposite of grace.

 

[retlaw]

So what is God's reaction to those who receive grace, yet don't show the same grace to others?

That too is sin and thankfully he forgives that too. The fact that God gives those who accept him a total pass is the most amazing thing about it. That might sound unfair but you can't see for yourself the difference between me before and after I made him the authority of my life. I'll never reach sinless level but where I used to fume hatred I show love to people that most people couldn't.

but in answer to your earlier question, I do not condemn anyone. God does that.