The land of Israel, the land of God.

[Shocker]

It's getting hot in here..(tip towing out the back door) peace

Holler..

 

[Notrash]

Was David's throne an earthly throne or heavenly throne ?

I'm pretty sure the throne in heaven belongs to the father and Jesus sits beside as co -ruler ...like a father son thing

But David's throne is earthly and Jesus will sit there as well one day when the temple throne room is built

How is it that Christ was said to be Davids 'son' yet he calls him "lord"?

The son of David was solomon.

Jesse/David/Solomon were also a forepicture of the trinity (Rev 22) Thus the 'fulfilled image of that picturing or "son" of that fore-picturing is Christ the Gods son.(image on earth).

The image fulfilled in the trinity picturing by Solomon is believers indwelt with the
law of freedom by ffaith, ordained, protected, and established by the father. Jacob/Israel is another fore-picturing of the Father/Son indwelling men/women who recieve the good doctrine, truths.

Thus the throne of David is the teachings, truths of God/Christ being embodied by humanity who believe, recieve. Israel or "solomites

He is the one head of Gen 49:10; hosea 1:10,11; 2:23; zech 12 or 14 and others.


..

 

[dfw69]

How is it that Christ was said to be Davids 'son' yet he calls him "lord"?

The son of David was solomon.

Jesse/David/Solomon were also a forepicture of the trinity (Rev 22) Thus the 'fulfilled image of that picturing or "son" of that fore-picturing is Christ the Gods son.(image on earth). The image fulfilled in the trinity picturing by Solomon is believers indwelt with the law of freedom by ffaith, ordained, and established by the father.

Christ is both .. Gods son and David's son through Mary

 

[Shocker]

How is it that Christ was said to be Davids 'son' yet he calls him "lord"?

The son of David was solomon.

Jesse/David/Solomon were also a forepicture of the trinity (Rev 22) Thus the 'fulfilled image of that picturing or "son" of that fore-picturing is Christ the Gods son.(image on earth). The image fulfilled in the trinity picturing by Solomon is believers indwelt with the law of freedom by ffaith, ordained, and established by the father.

Luk 18:38 And he cried, saying, Jesus, thou Son of David, have mercy on me.

 

[ebedmelech]

settle down, I feel your blood pressure from here..

You attacked a strawman, I called you on it.

It has nothing to do with whether or not you are right or wrong, or whether he is right or wrong.

Its a shady way of debating..

He said Christ will reign on earth.

You said Christ has authority over the earth.

You never addressed his issue, instead you attacked a strawman by supporting something other than what was initially stated.


I could care less which of you is right or wrong, I just think the way you debate is shady.

Now you're misconstruing what I said. How clear is Matthew 28:18 which says "in heaven and on earth".

You're pretty disingenuous at this point because I went to Acts 2 to make my point...but you're so busy trying to "catch me" one something do you even realize the passage says Jesus is bring about what was happening at that time? Where is it happening Shocker?...that's right...ON EARTH.

You understand? Since you come with a wrong motive in the first place, you make a wrong assertion OR you disengage the thought process.

Which is it?

 

[Shocker]

Now you're misconstruing what I said. How clear is Matthew 28:18 which says "in heaven and on earth".

You're pretty disingenuous at this point because I went to Acts 2 to make my point...but you're so busy trying to "catch me" one something do you even realize the passage says Jesus is bring about what was happening at that time? Where is it happening Shocker?...that's right...ON EARTH.

You understand? Since you come with a wrong motive in the first place, you make a wrong assertion OR you disengage the thought process.

Which is it?

You attacked a strawman by not addressing his contention, and instead, changed the context of his contention.

Thats a shady way of debating..

I don't care which of you is right, hash it out, but do it fairly...

 

[ebedmelech]

You attacked a strawman by not addressing his contention, and instead, changed the context of his contention.

Thats a shady way of debating..

I don't care which of you is right, hash it out, but do it fairly...

You Shocker, are pretty much the strawman in the whole thing, and I exposed your flawed thinking, and your pride won't let you admit your flaw.

What I provided gave not only a prime example, but in the passage Peter says Jesus brought about what was happening on Pentecost, and it's happening on earth by HIS authority.

If you can't process the information properly, that's your problem.

 

[Shocker]

You Shocker, are pretty much the strawman in the whole thing, and I exposed your flawed thinking, and your pride won't let you admit your flaw.

What I provided gave not only a prime example, but in the passage Peter says Jesus brought about what was happening on Pentecost, and it's happening on earth by HIS authority.

If you can't process the information properly, that's your problem.

Ebed I've read nearly all your posts from the time you started here.

You are the last person to admit you are wrong.

your reputation precedes you friend.. maybe I got a soft spot for ya.. never know.

 

[ebedmelech]

Ebed I've read nearly all your posts from the time you started here.

You are the last person to admit you are wrong.

your reputation precedes you friend.. maybe I got a soft spot for ya.. never know.

On that statement I already know you haven't read all my post (not even close to it), I'll say right here it's a lie or an exaggeration, or you wouldn't say that.

 

[Shocker]

On that statement I already know you haven't read all my post (not even close to it), I'll say right here it's a lie or an exaggeration, or you wouldn't say that.

Or ive been following your heretical doctrine for longer than you think..

 

[Bible2]

Shocker said in post 33:

Hes an amil, they don't believe that Christ is going to rule on earth, they spiritualize it and say he rules on earth from heaven.

Even though the Bible teaches that Christ is literally going to reign on earth, he is coming...

That's right.

Jesus will physically reign on the earth during the 1,000 years. For the 1,000 years will begin after his 2nd coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6), when he will physically land on the earth and rule it from Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:4-21). And because Jesus will reign physically on the earth during the 1,000 years, so will the physically resurrected church, for the physically resurrected church will reign with Jesus during the 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6). And so in Revelation 5:10, the reference to the church reigning in the future "on the earth" includes the 1,000 years. Also, in Revelation 2:26-29, the reigning of the church physically over the nations can refer to the 1,000 years. There's no reason to exclude the 1,000 years from Revelation 5:10 or Revelation 2:26-29, just as there's no reason to exclude the earth from Revelation 20:4-6.

Also, the church will reign forever on the new earth. For the church will reign forever in New Jerusalem (Revelation 22:5, Revelation 21:10 to 22:5), which will descend from heaven to a new earth (Revelation 21:1-3, Revelation 21:10) sometime after the future millennium and subsequent events (Revelation 20:7 to 21:3).

 

[Bible2]

ebedmelech said in post 40:

How about Colossians 1:16, 17?:
16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him.
17 He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.

As God the Word, Jesus was the Creator of everything in heaven and earth (Colossians 1:16-18, John 1:1,3). And in the 1st century AD he became a flesh and bones human being (John 1:14; 2 John 1:7) so he could die on the Cross for our sins and rise from the dead on the 3rd day (Hebrews 2:16-17; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and become our eternally-human high priest/mediator (Hebrews 7:24-26; 1 Timothy 2:5).

After his resurrection into immortality in his fully-human flesh and bones body (Luke 24:39), Jesus the man was given ultimate spiritual authority over heaven and earth (Matthew 28:18). He ascended bodily into heaven (Acts 1:9-10) and is now there ruling spiritually over everything (1 Peter 3:22, Ephesians 1:20-23, Colossians 2:10,15, Philippians 2:9).

But he won't take ultimate, de facto, physical authority over the earth until his 2nd coming, when, still as a flesh and bones human being (Zechariah 13:6, Zechariah 12:10-14), he will descend bodily from heaven (Revelation 19:11-21, Zechariah 14:3-4, Acts 1:11-12) to physically reign on the earth (Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:9-21) with a rod of iron with the bodily resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 2, Psalms 66:3-4, Micah 4:1-4, Luke 1:32, Isaiah 9:6-7).

After his 1,000-year reign and subsequent events are over (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39), Jesus will resurrect and judge everyone who wasn't resurrected at his 2nd coming (Revelation 20:11-15). Everyone who has ever lived will have to bow down before him and admit he's Lord of everything (Philippians 2:10-11, Acts 10:36).

 

[Bible2]

parousia70 said in post 45:

Futurists are the ones saying Christ delayed "what must shortly take place", not preterists.

In Revelation 1:1,3 and Revelation 22:6,10, "shortly" and "at hand" can be understood in the same manner as "Surely I come quickly" in Revelation 22:20, which refers to Jesus' still-unfulfilled 2nd coming. I.e., shortly/at hand/quickly in these verses can be understood from the viewpoint of God, not men (2 Peter 3:8-9).

Also, from the viewpoint of men, part of what Revelation chapters 2-3 foretold could have begun unfolding "shortly" (Revelation 1:1,3) after John saw his Revelation vision. For the letters to the 7 literal, 1st century AD local church congregations (Revelation chapters 2-3) in 7 cities in the Roman province of "Asia" (Revelation 1:11b) could have foretold a 1st century persecution (Revelation 2:10, Revelation 3:10) under the Roman Emperor Domitian which happened shortly after John saw his vision around 95 AD, near the end of Domitian's reign (Irenaeus, Against Heresies 5:30:3c). But even all the (to us) still-future events of the tribulation and subsequent 2nd coming of Revelation chapters 6 to 19 will unfold "shortly" (Revelation 1:1,3) or "quickly" (Revelation 22:20) after John saw his vision. For from the viewpoint of God, even the passing of some 2,000 years is like the passing of only 2 days (2 Peter 3:8). Christians should look at the future fulfillment of Revelation chapters 6 to 19 (and Matthew 24) from the viewpoint of God, not men, for whom the passing of some 2,000 years seems like a long delay for its fulfillment (2 Peter 3:9).

 

[Bible2]

Interplanner said in post 47:

If "Christ reigns" meant the land of Israel had to be involved, then Eph 1-3 is totally mistaken.

Actually, nothing in Ephesians chapters 1-3 contradicts that God still has regard for the land of Israel (Deuteronomy 32:43,49b), and Jerusalem especially (Isaiah 62:6-7, Psalms 122:6). Even during the future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign of the Antichrist (Revelation 13:5-18), Jerusalem will still be considered by God to be the holy city (Revelation 11:2, Luke 21:24), the holy mountain (Daniel 11:45, Daniel 9:16). And after the tribulation, at Jesus' 2nd coming, it will be to the Mount of Olives just east of the walled Old City of Jerusalem that Jesus will descend (Zechariah 14:4-21, Acts 1:11-12). And then Jesus will rule the whole earth from the earthly Jerusalem during the millennium (Micah 4:1-4, Zechariah 14:8-11,16-21, Revelation 20:4-6).

And if even those who are "strangers" in Israel can inherit the land of Israel (Ezekiel 47:21-23), then certainly believing Gentiles, who are "no more strangers" to Israel (Ephesians 2:12,19), will inherit the land of Israel during the future millennium of Revelation 20:4-6. And they will inherit the land and all the other promises given to Israel (Ephesians 2:12,19, Ephesians 3:6, Galatians 3:29, Genesis 12:7) along with all the elect Jews who have ever been saved in the past or who will get saved in our future, including at Jesus' 2nd coming (Zechariah 12:10-14, Romans 11:25-32).

Presently the kingdom of God is in heaven (2 Timothy 4:18, Hebrews 12:22-24) and is on the earth spiritually within Christians (Romans 14:17, Luke 17:21). But in the future the kingdom will come fully upon the earth as it is in heaven (Matthew 6:10). It will also be physically (Luke 22:30, Matthew 19:28) on the earth (Revelation 5:10), first during the future millennium (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 66:3-4, Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:3-21) and then on the new earth (Revelation 21:1-8).

Jesus' kingdom is Israel (John 1:49, John 12:13-15, John 19:19, Luke 22:30). That's why at his 2nd coming he will sit on the earthly throne of David (Luke 1:32-33, Isaiah 9:7) and restore the kingdom to Israel (Acts 1:6-7, Acts 3:20-21). Jesus is in his humanity the son of David (Matthew 1:1, Matthew 21:15-16, Romans 1:3), of the house of David (Luke 1:69). So at Jesus' 2nd coming he will restore the tabernacle, the house, of David (Isaiah 16:5, Amos 9:11) to its royal glory (2 Samuel 5:12) which it had lost (2 Kings 17:21a). And Jesus will fulfill the prophecy and prayer of 2 Samuel 7:16-29. And he will bring salvation to all the still-living unbelieving elect Jews of the house of David. For they (along with all other still-living unbelieving elect Jews) will come into faith in him when they see him at his 2nd coming (Zechariah 12:10-14, Zechariah 13:1,6, Romans 11:26-31). And so they will become part of the church at that time, for there are now no believers outside of the church (Ephesians 4:4-6).

After Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:7 to 20:3, Zechariah 14:3-5) will occur the millennium (Revelation 20:4-6, Zechariah 14:8-21), during which time the Gentile nations will come to seek the returned Jesus ruling the whole earth (Zechariah 8:22, Zechariah 14:9, Psalms 72:8-11) on the restored throne of David (Isaiah 9:7) in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 2:1-4, Zechariah 14:8-11,16-19). And the bodily resurrected church will reign on the earth with Jesus during the millennium (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). For the church is Israel (Romans 11:1,17,24, Ephesians 2:12,19, Galatians 3:29, Revelation 21:9,12; 1 Peter 2:9-10).

 

[ebedmelech]

Or ive been following your heretical doctrine for longer than you think..

This really have no reference to me as eschatology is not doctrine...another misnomer you operate from.

 

[Shocker]

This really have no reference to me as eschatology is not doctrine...another misnomer you operate from.

Im talking about what you espouse as truth, when in fact, you have yet to scratch the surface.


There isn't one post where you don't start an argument with people on this forum.

Defending your x = 1000 theory, then twisting scripture to conform to your understanding instead of letting God be true.

Your doctrine is all over the place, and recently you have gone flip mode on your own beliefs and now belief the abomination, which happens during Daniels 70th week, actually took place sometime between 30-40ad, as you say it ran consecutive..

I must have a soft spot for you, because Im one of the last few people here to debate with over your bible fantasies..

 

[ebedmelech]

As God the Word, Jesus was the Creator of everything in heaven and earth (Colossians 1:16-18, John 1:1,3). And in the 1st century AD he became a flesh and bones human being (John 1:14; 2 John 1:7) so he could die on the Cross for our sins and rise from the dead on the 3rd day (Hebrews 2:16-17; 1 Corinthians 15:1-4) and become our eternally-human high priest/mediator (Hebrews 7:24-26; 1 Timothy 2:5).

After his resurrection into immortality in his fully-human flesh and bones body (Luke 24:39), Jesus the man was given ultimate spiritual authority over heaven and earth (Matthew 28:18). He ascended bodily into heaven (Acts 1:9-10) and is now there ruling spiritually over everything (1 Peter 3:22, Ephesians 1:20-23, Colossians 2:10,15, Philippians 2:9).

But he won't take ultimate, de facto, physical authority over the earth until his 2nd coming, when, still as a flesh and bones human being (Zechariah 13:6, Zechariah 12:10-14), he will descend bodily from heaven (Revelation 19:11-21, Zechariah 14:3-4, Acts 1:11-12) to physically reign on the earth (Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:9-21) with a rod of iron with the bodily resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 2, Psalms 66:3-4, Micah 4:1-4, Luke 1:32, Isaiah 9:6-7).

After his 1,000-year reign and subsequent events are over (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39), Jesus will resurrect and judge everyone who wasn't resurrected at his 2nd coming (Revelation 20:11-15). Everyone who has ever lived will have to bow down before him and admit he's Lord of everything (Philippians 2:10-11, Acts 10:36).

Bible2, this is really all you can do...cut and paste the same answers. You never walk through the scriptures line upon line.

This whole dissertation is refuted in that Peter announced at Pentecost, that God made Jesus both LORD and CHRIST!!!

Have you even bothered to look those terms up?

"Lord" from Blue Letter Bible:
Greek Lexicon :: G2962 (NASB)

Is that sinking in? Stop trying to be "Bible Jeopardy" around here, and do some reading. We can all run around reading commentaries and cutting and pasting answers like you do.

Get into some searching things through the scriptures from first to last mention.

 

[Shocker]

Bible2, this is really all you can do...cut and paste the same answers. You never walk through the scriptures line upon line.

This whole dissertation is refuted in that Peter announced at Pentecost, that God made Jesus both LORD and CHRIST!!!

Have you even bothered to look those terms up?

"Lord" from Blue Letter Bible:
Greek Lexicon :: G2962 (NASB)

Is that sinking in? Stop trying to be "Bible Jeopardy" around here, and do some reading. We can all run around reading commentaries and cutting and pasting answers like you do.

Get into some searching things through the scriptures from first to last mention.

I haven't read one of his posts, ever..

Too lazy to read all that..

 

[ebedmelech]

Im talking about what you espouse as truth, when in fact, you have yet to scratch the surface.

Look in the mirror...you described yourself.

There isn't one post where you don't start an argument with people on this forum.

Where does it say everyone has to agree about everything in this forum? That's the first thing...the second is all this forum allows us to do as Christians is discuss how we view scripture. Like the proverb says "As iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another.

Defending your x = 1000 theory, then twisting scripture to conform to your understanding instead of letting God be true.

Actually this is the nonsense you try to espouse. My only contention is that the thousand year reign is not literal. Whether you agree or not is my concern. I responded from my viewpoint of reading scripture. That one can read of Jesus and all the miracles He performed, as well as rising from the dead, and think He does reign right now, is mind boggling

Your doctrine is all over the place, and recently you have gone flip mode on your own beliefs and now belief the abomination, which happens during Daniels 70th week, actually took place sometime between 30-40ad, as you say it ran consecutive..

What I believe is not "my doctrine" Shocker. What I do is read the scriptures and compare what they say. I don't lock in to anyone's theology on this matter. That you've done that is on you.

I must have a soft spot for you, because Im one of the last few people here to debate with over your bible fantasies..

Whatever you think. it doesn't offend me in the least because each PERSON has to stand before Jesus for how they served Him, how they studied and believed His word, and how they lived their lives before Him. So if you think you have it right...continue with that.

The Lord will return...and at that time each person will have their praise of God. The fire of Jesus examination of us, will reveal it.

 

[Shocker]

Look in the mirror...you described yourself.

Where does it say everyone has to agree about everything in this forum? That's the first thing...the second is all this forum allows us to do as Christians is discuss how we view scripture. Like the proverb says "As iron sharpens iron so one man sharpens another.

Actually this is the nonsense you try to espouse. My only contention is that the thousand year reign is not literal. Whether you agree or not is my concern. I responded from my viewpoint of reading scripture. That one can read of Jesus and all the miracles He performed, as well as rising from the dead, and think He does reign right now, is mind boggling

What I believe is not "my doctrine" Shocker. What I do is read the scriptures and compare what they say. I don't lock in to anyone's theology on this matter. That you've done that is on you.

Whatever you think. it doesn't offend me in the least because each PERSON has to stand before Jesus for how they served Him, how they studied and believed His word, and how they lived their lives before Him. So if you think you have it right...continue with that.

The Lord will return...and at that time each person will have their praise of God. The fire of Jesus examination of us, will reveal it.

Please.. Your doctrine existed long before you did..

You aren't original, your debates on here are backed by a doctrine that is so pathetically fallible, it caves on its own theories..


You are one of the few "Christians" Ive ever met who spin every known commonly understood at the baby level doctrine into something completely different, as long as it supports your beliefs.



Tell me, where in the Bible is a period of time given, and the fulfillment of that time was something other than what was stated.

You have no foundational support for your beliefs.


But then again, most Christians don't believe what your guiding "spirits" are so graciously filling your head with..

THANK GOD..