The land of Israel, the land of God.

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Gen 12:7 The LORD appeared to Abram and said, "To your descendants I will give this land." So he built an altar there to the LORD who had appeared to him.

Gen 13:15 for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever.

(If God knows the future, why would he say "forever" if it wasn't true?)

Gen 17:7 "I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you.

Lev 25:23 'The land, moreover, shall not be sold permanently, for the land is Mine; for you are but aliens and sojourners with Me.

Lev 26:43 'For the land will be abandoned by them, and will make up for its sabbaths while it is made desolate without them. They, meanwhile, will be making amends for their iniquity, because they rejected My ordinances and their soul abhorred My statutes.

Lev 26:44 'Yet in spite of this, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not reject them, nor will I so abhor them as to destroy them, breaking My covenant with them; for I am the LORD their God.

Lev 26:45 'But I will remember for them the covenant with their ancestors, whom I brought out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the nations, that I might be their God. I am the LORD.'"

Eze 36:24 "For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands and bring you into your own land.

Joe 3:1 "For behold, in those days and at that time, When I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,

Joe 3:2 I will gather all the nations And bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat. Then I will enter into judgment with them there On behalf of My people and My inheritance, Israel,

"Whom they have scattered among the nations; And they have divided up My land."
 

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Concerning the future, it is written.

Zec 12:2 "Behold, I am about to make Jerusalem a cup of staggering to all the surrounding peoples. The siege of Jerusalem will also be against Judah.

Zec 12:3 On that day I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples. All who lift it will surely hurt themselves. And all the nations of the earth will gather against it.


Did Rome hurt themselves when they lifted Israel from the Jews?

Nope.

Have all the nations of the earth gathered against Israel?

Nope, this has never happened either.


Zec 12:8 On that day the LORD will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them.

Zec 12:9 And on that day I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Has God destroyed all the nations that come against Jerusalem?

Nope.

Zec 12:10 "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn.

When did the Jews mourn for the one they pieced? (Jesus Christ)

This is future, the Jews have yet to accept Christ.
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Rom 11:11 I say then, they did not stumble so as to fall, did they? May it never be! But by their transgression salvation has come to the Gentiles, to make them jealous.

Rom 11:12 Now if their transgression is riches for the world and their failure is riches for the Gentiles, how much more will their fulfillment be!

Rom 11:15 For if their rejection is the reconciliation of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?

Rom 11:16 If the dough offered as firstfruits is holy, so is the whole lump, and if the root is holy, so are the branches.

Rom 11:24 For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.

Rom 11:25 Lest you be wise in your own sight, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.

Rom 11:26 And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written, "The Deliverer will come from Zion, he will banish ungodliness from Jacob";
 
Upvote 0

parousia70

Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow
Supporter
Feb 24, 2002
15,533
4,826
57
Oregon
✟794,018.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Have all the nations of the earth gathered against Israel?

Nope, this has never happened either.

Lets test your interpretative consistency against scripture shall we?

"And there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation under heaven." (Acts 2:5)

Has that happened?
Were there Jews from "every nation under heaven" in Jerusalem at Pentecost?

Any Japanese Jews there? Any Russian Jews? Any Chinese Jews? Any Australian Jews there that day?
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
"And there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men, from every nation under heaven." (Acts 2:5)

Red herring.

The prophecy states that all nations will gather against Israel.

In a desperate bid to disprove me, (yet again) you've opted to throw scripture at me that has nothing to do with with my post.

Google isn't a replacement for knowing Gods word;)
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Concerning the future, it is written.

Zec 12:2 "Behold, I am about to make Jerusalem a cup of staggering to all the surrounding peoples. The siege of Jerusalem will also be against Judah.

Zec 12:3 On that day I will make Jerusalem a heavy stone for all the peoples. All who lift it will surely hurt themselves. And all the nations of the earth will gather against it.


Did Rome hurt themselves when they lifted Israel from the Jews?

Nope.

Have all the nations of the earth gathered against Israel?

Nope, this has never happened either.


Zec 12:8 On that day the LORD will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them.

Zec 12:9 And on that day I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

Has God destroyed all the nations that come against Jerusalem?

Nope.

Zec 12:10 "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on me, on him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over him, as one weeps over a firstborn.

When did the Jews mourn for the one they pieced? (Jesus Christ)

This is future, the Jews have yet to accept Christ.

Hallelujah! Someone knows the past from the future!

LAMAD
 
Upvote 0

ebedmelech

My dog Micah in the pic
Supporter
Jul 3, 2012
8,998
678
✟187,689.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Gen 12:7 The LORD appeared to Abram and said, "To your descendants I will give this land." So he built an altar there to the LORD who had appeared to him.

Gen 13:15 for all the land which you see, I will give it to you and to your descendants forever.

(If God knows the future, why would he say "forever" if it wasn't true?)

Gen 17:7 "I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you.

Lev 25:23 'The land, moreover, shall not be sold permanently, for the land is Mine; for you are but aliens and sojourners with Me.

Lev 26:43 'For the land will be abandoned by them, and will make up for its sabbaths while it is made desolate without them. They, meanwhile, will be making amends for their iniquity, because they rejected My ordinances and their soul abhorred My statutes.

Lev 26:44 'Yet in spite of this, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not reject them, nor will I so abhor them as to destroy them, breaking My covenant with them; for I am the LORD their God.

Lev 26:45 'But I will remember for them the covenant with their ancestors, whom I brought out of the land of Egypt in the sight of the nations, that I might be their God. I am the LORD.'"

Eze 36:24 "For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands and bring you into your own land.

Joe 3:1 "For behold, in those days and at that time, When I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem,

Joe 3:2 I will gather all the nations And bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat. Then I will enter into judgment with them there On behalf of My people and My inheritance, Israel,

"Whom they have scattered among the nations; And they have divided up My land."
The first thing you have to realize is that God sets the terms, He gave them the land as part of the Old Covenant as Israel came out of Egypt. It starts when the Lord give them the Passover law and He says in Exodus 12:25:
12 When you enter the land which the Lord will give you, as He has promised, you shall observe this rite.

With those quotes you have, read them in light of these passages:

*Leviticus 26:14-46

*Deuteronomy 28

*Deuteronomy 31:14-18

The Lord gave Israel the land as part of the covenant, and they broke the covenant. God even said they would do so Himself.

This is what isn't understood about the land in the Old Covenant, it is a type of heaven.

They Jews as God's chosen people, had they obeyed Him, would have had great blessing above all nations, but they kept turning from God.

The Old Covenant is no longer!

The Israel God is speaking of is the church, and the ONLY Promised Land God is concerned with is heaven.

As Paul wrote "the Jerusalem above is free, she is our mother."

Also as Hebrews states of the land Abraham had in mind it says in Hebrews 11:9, 10:
9 By faith he lived as an alien in the land of promise, as in a foreign land, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, fellow heirs of the same promise; 10 for he was looking for the city which has foundations, whose architect and builder is God.

God is not concerned with the land we call Israel. The Israel God is concerned with is the church, made up of ALL peoples!
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The first thing you have to realize is that God sets the terms, He gave them the land as part of the Old Covenant as Israel came out of Egypt. It starts when the Lord give them the Passover law and He says in Exodus 12:25:
12 When you enter the land which the Lord will give you, as He has promised, you shall observe this rite.

With those quotes you have, read them in light of these passages:

*Leviticus 26:14-46

*Deuteronomy 28

*Deuteronomy 31:14-18

The Lord gave Israel the land as part of the covenant, and they broke the covenant. God even said they would do so Himself.

This is what isn't understood about the land in the Old Covenant, it is a type of heaven.

They Jews as God's chosen people, had they obeyed Him, would have had great blessing above all nations, but they kept turning from God.

The Old Covenant is no longer!

The Israel God is speaking of is the church, and the ONLY Promised Land God is concerned with is heaven.

As Paul wrote "the Jerusalem above is free, she is our mother."

Also as Hebrews states of the land Abraham had in mind it says in Hebrews 11:9, 10:
9 By faith he lived as an alien in the land of promise, as in a foreign land, dwelling in tents with Isaac and Jacob, fellow heirs of the same promise; 10 for he was looking for the city which has foundations, whose architect and builder is God.

God is not concerned with the land we call Israel. The Israel God is concerned with is the church, made up of ALL peoples!

Is God a liar Ebed?

Gen_13:15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

If God knew the covenant and the land of Israel wasn't forever, he would have never said it.

Sorry, but you are reaching...
 
Upvote 0

ebedmelech

My dog Micah in the pic
Supporter
Jul 3, 2012
8,998
678
✟187,689.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Is God a liar Ebed?

Gen_13:15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

If God knew the covenant and the land of Israel wasn't forever, he would have never said it.

Sorry, but you are reaching...
Now...go to Galatians 3:15-18...and understand who the "seed" is.

So no...God is not a liar...and neither are you for that matter, you just don't realize who "THE SEED" is.
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Now...go to Galatians 3:15-18...and understand who the "seed" is.

So no...God is not a liar...and neither are you for that matter, you just don't realize who "THE SEED" is.

Answer the question, its a yes or no.

Is God a liar Ebed?

Gen_13:15 For all the land which thou seest, to thee will I give it, and to thy seed for ever.

If God knew the covenant and the land of Israel wasn't forever, he would have never said it.

Sorry, but you are reaching...
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

dfw69

Pre-Tribulation Pre- False Messianic Age
Nov 16, 2011
8,273
826
Dallas/Ft Worth
✟78,753.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The first thing you have to realize is that

God is not concerned with the land we call Israel. The Israel God is concerned with is the church, made up of ALL peoples!

Not true ..god is concern for the land of Israel as well as all the earth thus the reason to one day put down all governments of the world and uplift a kingdom on earth where truth and righteousness reigns under Christ

Anyone who denies Christ coming kingdom on earth is simply mistaking
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Not true ..god is concern for the land of Israel as well as all the earth thus the reason to one day put down all governments of the world and uplift a kingdom on earth where truth and righteousness reigns under Christ

Anyone who denies Christ coming kingdom on earth is simply mistaking

:amen:
 
Upvote 0
O

Old Timer

Guest
Anyone who denies Christ coming kingdom on earth is simply mistaking

The scriptures teach us that it often goes beyond being simply mistaken.. but rather than men willfully deny his coming and will even scoff at it..

It's to be expected from those who want men to believe anything but the simple truth of the word of God.
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
The scriptures teach us that it often goes beyond being simply mistaken.. but rather than men willfully deny his coming and will even scoff at it..

It's to be expected from those who want men to believe anything but the simple truth of the word of God.

As it is written.

2Pe 3:3 Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts,

2Pe 3:4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation."
 
Upvote 0
O

Old Timer

Guest
As it is written.

2Pe 3:3 Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts,

2Pe 3:4 and saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation."

Thank you Shocker.. I was having a Sword cramp trying to remember where that was..

The ol Sword of the Spirit needs some sharpening I see..
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Thank you Shocker.. I was having a Sword cramp trying to remember where that was..

The ol Sword of the Spirit needs some sharpening I see..

They cant accept what is coming because the truth is not in them..

They have head knowledge, but no heart knowledge..
 
Upvote 0

dfw69

Pre-Tribulation Pre- False Messianic Age
Nov 16, 2011
8,273
826
Dallas/Ft Worth
✟78,753.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I try not to judge... if they are wrong then eventually they will see... If they are true enemies of Christ then they willfully make a stand against him knowing the consequences and refuse to repent ... True enemies of Christ hate Christ and all that that implies
 
Upvote 0

Shocker

Well-Known Member
Mar 10, 2014
3,175
34
✟3,534.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I try not to judge... if they are wrong then eventually they will see... If they are true enemies of Christ then they willfully make a stand against him knowing the consequences and refuse to repent ... True enemies of Christ hate Christ and all that that implies

Or, satan puts it in the minds of his followers, who in turn, post here.

Just another day at the office for them..
 
Upvote 0

ebedmelech

My dog Micah in the pic
Supporter
Jul 3, 2012
8,998
678
✟187,689.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Constitution
Not true ..god is concern for the land of Israel as well as all the earth thus the reason to one day put down all governments of the world and uplift a kingdom on earth where truth and righteousness reigns under Christ

Anyone who denies Christ coming kingdom on earth is simply mistaking
No one denies the Kingdom...just what you think it is.

Watch this...Revelation 21:2:
2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.

Now...what is Jerusalem the point of but Israel...only in this case...it's the Isreal of God...:thumbsup:
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

dfw69

Pre-Tribulation Pre- False Messianic Age
Nov 16, 2011
8,273
826
Dallas/Ft Worth
✟78,753.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
No one denies the Kingdom...just what you think it is.

Watch this...Revelation 21:2:
2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.

Now...what is Jerusalem the point of but Israel...only in this case...it's the Isreal of God...:thumbsup:

I agree to some degree

Only Christ kingdom is set up after 10 future kingdoms of false Israel are put down

Christ reigns a 1000 years on earth before the coming of the city you mentioned
 
Upvote 0