"The Calvary isn't coming"

[persontwo]

I read Dave Ramsey's total money makeover and he was railing against people being in denial- people who think that they don't have to save for retirement because everything is going to "work out".

This has been a hard concept for me to learn. We know that "God works all things for those who are saved" (Etc) but we obviously can't sit back and relax, we have to work our salvation. Ramsey uses the phrase "The calvaray isn't coming" and "things will not be okay" to illustarate this truth.

Does anyone know of any biblical parallels- like any bible verses that say the same thing?

 

[Goodbook]

Why not just retire now from slavery and work for the Lord instead.

 

[Mudinyeri]

I think the parable of the man who wanted to build more barns is a good one. He had plenty set aside. He didn't need more to continue living. Yet, he wanted to build more barns to store more grain. To what end? To never have to work again - even though it would appear that he was able to do so.

This being a/the Biblical principle giving us direction in saving for later in life ... the questions becomes, "How much will I need?" Secondarily, "How do I avoid 'building more barns'?"

There are any number of financial planners available to help answer the first question. Only you, in prayerful consideration with God, can answer the second.

I disagree with Goodbook that work is slavery, by the way. I very much enjoy what I do and plan to do something similar as long as I am physically and mentally able. In the event of my untimely death, I have life insurance to make sure my wife and son are able to live without significant financial worry. I also have succession and divestiture plans for my businesses.

 

[Goodbook]

Sorry for my flippant response but no, the bible says opposite.
What profit is there if you gain the whole world but lose your soul. Nobody knows exactly when their end is going to be.
We dont put our talent or money in a hole in the ground...but yes we can put it in the bank to earn interest, but Jesus also said we who are rich can sell everything to give to the poor and have treasure in heaven.

Cavalry..is what happened on the cross. Jesus came, thats a fact. He will always come if we ask.

I dont know who this david ramsay is but he may be quoting the bible out of context. Or not even be a christian.

 

[DawnStar]

Why not just retire now from slavery and work for the Lord instead.

Because some of us are grown mature adults and we have responsibilities. We also do not have the luxury of being able to still live with our parents and do only volunteer work. Some of us actually have to work full time just to make ends meet and not rely on mommy and daddy to feed us and house us. Some of us have children that need to be fed and working volunteer work does not put food in their mouths. Most of us realize that even though we may get stressed in our full time jobs (or multiple part time jobs) the good Lord will give us the strength to carry us through.

 

[Goodbook]

Also we arent to worry about what to eat and drink, what to wear..thats what the gentiles or heathens worry about. When we seek his righteousness and kingdom first, everything will be added unto us.

Yes its sensible to save if you working and you like your job. But not everyone is the same, so it cant be like that for everyone.

 

[W2L]

I think the parable of the man who wanted to build more barns is a good one. He had plenty set aside. He didn't need more to continue living. Yet, he wanted to build more barns to store more grain. To what end? To never have to work again - even though it would appear that he was able to do so.

This being a/the Biblical principle giving us direction in saving for later in life ... the questions becomes, "How much will I need?" Secondarily, "How do I avoid 'building more barns'?"

There are any number of financial planners available to help answer the first question. Only you, in prayerful consideration with God, can answer the second.

I disagree with Goodbook that work is slavery, by the way. I very much enjoy what I do and plan to do something similar as long as I am physically and mentally able. In the event of my untimely death, I have life insurance to make sure my wife and son are able to live without significant financial worry. I also have succession and divestiture plans for my businesses.

I believe that perhaps the man in the parable was not content with what he had, and he also boasted in his plans without ever considering that without God we can do nothing.

James 4:13 Now listen, you who say, “Today or tomorrow we will go to this or that city, spend a year there, carry on business and make money.” 14 Why, you do not even know what will happen tomorrow. What is your life? You are a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes. 15 Instead, you ought to say, “If it is the Lord’s will, we will live and do this or that.” 16 As it is, you boast in your arrogant schemes. All such boasting is evil. 17 If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is sin for them.

 

[Mudinyeri]

I believe that perhaps the man in the parable was not content with what he had, and he also boasted in his plans without ever considering that without God we can do nothing.

Agreed. There's also no record of him sharing of his firstfruits, tithing, giving ... whatever you believe to be appropriate.

 

[W2L]

Agreed. There's also no record of him sharing of his firstfruits, tithing, giving ... whatever you believe to be appropriate.

I don't believe in tithing laws or prosperity doctrine of reaping and sowing. I do however believe in reaping and sowing, and that's its better to give than receive. I believe sowing is about spirituality not finances.

 

[Mudinyeri]

I don't believe in tithing laws or prosperity doctrine of reaping and sowing. I do however believe in reaping and sowing, and that's its better to give than receive. I believe sowing is about spirituality not finances.

I am specifically NOT talking about prosperity doctrine. I'm talking about supporting local churches and God's work as a whole with financial gifts ... with no expectation of any financial reward in return. My personal conviction includes both tithing and giving but each individual must find his or her own personal conviction on the topic. However, it is clearly un-Biblical to leave the local church lacking while hoarding up earthly treasures for ourselves.

 

[DiscipleHeLovesToo]

I read Dave Ramsey's total money makeover and he was railing against people being in denial- people who think that they don't have to save for retirement because everything is going to "work out".

This has been a hard concept for me to learn. We know that "God works all things for those who are saved" (Etc) but we obviously can't sit back and relax, we have to work our salvation. Ramsey uses the phrase "The calvaray isn't coming" and "things will not be okay" to illustarate this truth.

Does anyone know of any biblical parallels- like any bible verses that say the same thing?

red letters say otherwise:

Mat 6:27-34 KJV
(27) Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature?
(28) And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin:
(29) And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these.
(30) Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith?
(31) Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?
(32) (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek ; for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
(33) But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
(34) Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Luk 6:38 KJV
(38) Give, and it shall be given unto you; good measure, pressed down, and shaken together, and running over, shall men give into your bosom. For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again.

Mar 10:23-31 KJV
(23) And Jesus looked round about, and saith unto his disciples, How hardly shall they that have riches enter into the kingdom of God!
(24) And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God!
(25) It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
(26) And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?
(27) And Jesus looking upon them saith, With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.
(28) Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
(29) And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
(30) But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
(31) But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

 

[shelley1952]

Because some of us are grown mature adults and we have responsibilities. We also do not have the luxury of being able to still live with our parents and do only volunteer work. Some of us actually have to work full time just to make ends meet and not rely on mommy and daddy to feed us and house us. Some of us have children that need to be fed and working volunteer work does not put food in their mouths. Most of us realize that even though we may get stressed in our full time jobs (or multiple part time jobs) the good Lord will give us the strength to carry us through.

Whoa there partner, be careful, you dont know the plans God has for someones elses life but only for yourself, I know several people who God told them not to work a secular job but to continue their studies and do what He needs them to do. And yes they had kids and yes those kids were in school, ya know what, God supernaturally provided their every need and still is and I am not talking government help of any kind and I am not talking selling any book or teachings, I am also not talking by prosperity teaching. They have obeyed God, was able to raise their children to adulthood and they have families now. The childrens plans from God is different but I am not talking about that but I am saying you dont know what God has told goodbook to do as long as she does. We each have to find out what God has for us, maybe you are not suppose to be working so hard and getting so stressed and working so many jobs to make ends meet. Did you ever take time to seek His face for your own plan ? Sometimes in todays society we think we have to keep up with the Jonses so we get into unnecessary debt but that's not someone elses fault. According to Proverbs 22:7, "The rich rule over the poor, and the borrower is slave of the lender" (NRSV) The Bible says if we are always borrowing money that you are in deed a slave, that makes most people slave to someone and thus having to work harder or more hours and get stressed because they have to make extra money just to give to their slave master.

 

[Kit Sigmon]

I read Dave Ramsey's total money makeover and he was railing against people being in denial- people who think that they don't have to save for retirement because everything is going to "work out".
persontwo: Biblically, there be no such thing as retirement, people worked they life time or until they were unable to do so. In my childhood after my mom was a widowed, we all move and lived on aunty's land and looked after aunty, who wasn't able to take care of herself any more as she advanced in years. Prior to her being sick, aunty made an sold homemade goods/foods. Her home had been that of her parents who left it to her, aunty was known for her homemade goods/foods an she made enough money to live on and when she got old enough to get social security, her other earnings she was in good shape. Aunty had a good garden and her brothers kept her in game, she bought very little from grocery stores, aunty wasn't about wasting money, she could easy walk a country mile and did so up until she was aged. Aunty was also tight with her money, she didn't part with it easily lol!

This has been a hard concept for me to learn. We know that "God works all things for those who are saved" (Etc) but we obviously can't sit back and relax, we have to work our salvation. Ramsey uses the phrase "The calvaray isn't coming" and "things will not be okay" to illustarate this truth.

Does anyone know of any biblical parallels- like any bible verses that say the same thing?

persontwo: "The calvary isn't coming" and" things will not be okay." The place I see these terms in action are in the bible in the story of the Prodigal Son...the younger son demanded his portion, the father gave it to him. As long as the money lasted the young man lived lavishly until he spent all his wealth on "wine, women and song". He ended up tending to pigs and sleeping with them...in short,"things weren't okay"...this young man became filthy, his clothes were in ruins, he was starving... nowhere in the story did the father send anyone to go find his son...no calvary came riding to his rescue. The young man got a cold dose of reality, and when "he came to himself", realized his pitiful state, (repented himself) an decided he'd go back to his father and be his servant, for he knew his father's servants were well taken care etc...you know the rest of the story.

 

[Sketcher]

Cavalry - the soldiers on horses, either literal or metaphorical. Sometimes they're not coming.

Calvary - the hill on which Christ was crucified. Also known as Golgotha.

Spelling is important. Carry on.

 

[Mudinyeri]

As @DiscipleHeLovesToo points out, there are many verses in the Bible that indicate that focusing on things of the world - particularly to the exclusion of or lower prioritization of your eternal future - may be detrimental to one's eternal well-being. Those verses do not, however, suggest that one should ignore one's future here on earth entirely. In most cases where God took special care of someone in the Bible, they were working hard on God's plan. Of course, God's plan is different for each of us. I cannot find an example in the Bible, however, of God's plan including relying on Social Security or someone else's money or good will to take provide in later years. Quite the opposite, parents are instructed to leave an inheritance for their children.

 

[Albion]

I read Dave Ramsey's total money makeover and he was railing against people being in denial- people who think that they don't have to save for retirement because everything is going to "work out"...Ramsey uses the phrase "The calvaray isn't coming" and "things will not be okay" to illustarate this truth.

Does anyone know of any biblical parallels- like any bible verses that say the same thing?

The wise and foolish virgins? Matthew 25:1-13.

 

[W2L]

As @DiscipleHeLovesToo points out, there are many verses in the Bible that indicate that focusing on things of the world - particularly to the exclusion of or lower prioritization of your eternal future - may be detrimental to one's eternal well-being. Those verses do not, however, suggest that one should ignore one's future here on earth entirely. In most cases where God took special care of someone in the Bible, they were working hard on God's plan. Of course, God's plan is different for each of us. I cannot find an example in the Bible, however, of God's plan including relying on Social Security or someone else's money or good will to take provide in later years. Quite the opposite, parents are instructed to leave an inheritance for their children.

Social security isn't someone else's money. It belongs to those who paid into it. It also belongs to those who cannot work such as handicapped folks and children with different disabilities.

 

[Albion]

Social security isn't someone else's money. It belongs to those who paid into it. It also belongs to those who cannot work such as handicapped folks and children with different disabilities.

Not exactly. It's social insurance. Premiums (in the form of taxes) are levied and a payout at a later time is promised. It's not as though each of us has a bank account somewhere that the federal government draws from to pay our retirement, survivors, dependents, or disability benefits. And it's not as though we get back only what we paid in. We, in fact, get back NOTHING of what we ourselves paid in. That's all been spent and what we get is from other people.

 

[W2L]

Not exactly. It's social insurance. Premiums (in the form of taxes) are levied and a payout at a later time is promised. It's not as though each of us has a bank account somewhere that the federal government draws from to pay our retirement, survivors, dependents, or disability benefits. And it's not as though we get back only what we paid in. We, in fact, get back NOTHING of what we ourselves paid in. That's all been spent and what we get is from other people.

Yes we all know that. That didn't change my point though.

 

[Albion]

If you think that this:

Social security isn't someone else's money. It belongs to those who paid into it.

equals this:

We, in fact, get back NOTHING of what we ourselves paid in. That's all been spent and what we get is from other people.

There's nothing more to discuss.