The being of light of NDE fame, G-d or Satan?

Is the being of light, G-d or Satan?

  • He is Messiah Yeshua - Jesus in his glorified form.

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • He is Satan appearing as an angel of light.

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • He is HaShem/ the G-d of Abraham/ YHWH.

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • If there is a LIFE REVIEW... then it is G-d.

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • I really am not sure but I am researching this.

    Votes: 3 20.0%
  • Who we meet depends on if we are sincerely religious?

    Votes: 2 13.3%
  • Near death experiences are a halucination caused by brain chemical reactions.

    Votes: 5 33.3%
  • Maybe it is connected to memories of lights in delivery room from birth.

    Votes: 1 6.7%
  • The being of light is the Elohim who formed Adam and Eve.

    Votes: 2 13.3%

  • Total voters
    15

DennisTate

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It seems to me that we are in a situation somewhat like the time of the Prophet Elijah.

1Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."


I began to study these experiences a great deal back in 1990. They immediately made me realize that the "soul sleep" doctrine that I had been taught was almost certainly in error. I got kicked out of two churches due to disagreements mainly over that doctrine. But as a Christian there was no way that I could deny the possibility of people having an "out of the body experience!"

2 Corinthians 12:2 "I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter."
 

DennisTate

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What about when a near death experiencer is shown something that might contradict scritpure?

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...-asks-about-holocaust-during-his-nde.7647330/

Doesn't what Howard was shown here seem to violate:

Acts 4:12 "Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

Or.... isn't it possible that Messiah Yeshua - Jesus is free to take people into paradise much like he promised to the thief on the cross beside him?
 
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DennisTate

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I am really impressed with the results of this poll so far!

It is a relief to know that I am not alone in thinking that these NDE accounts may fit with......

Rev 12:11

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the wordof their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
 
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DennisTate

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I have even wondered if Messiah Yeshua - Jesus may have induced an out of the body experience...... or even a full fledged NDE through fasting?!

Could the following temptations perhaps have taken place in the out of the body state that the Apostle Paul refused to utterly rule out as being a possibility?????????!

https://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/mat/4/1/s_933001

Mat 4:1


Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.
And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungred.

...
Mat 4:5

Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,

.....

Mat 4:8

Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;"
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Your poll has quite biased options with multiple ones implying that the Light is somehow God and not allowing a nuanced view of near death experience.

Multiple medical studies have been conducted into Near death Experiences such as the Perera study in Australia in 2005 or Lommel's study in the Netherlands in 2001 for instance.
The medical fraternity have created a weighted Core Experience index to try and objectively measure the phenomena and the Near-Death experience scale to try and predict who is more likely to experience the phenomenon.
Generally they concluded that about 10% of people who undergo cardiac arrest and have dilated pupils and cessation of observable brain activity but survive, will report a Near Death Experience afterward. The problem is that there is no way to see if there is really no brain activity as we cannot hook up a dying unstable person to an MRI or EEG, so we cannot say that a Near death experience is not related to brain activity.

Another problem is that if we use the Anaesthetic agent Ketamine, which is a NMDA receptor antagonist, we get very similar reported phenomena afterward such as lights, out of body etc. This agent raises your heart rate, releases adrenaline, decreases dopamine re-uptake and activates pain reduction pathways, so loosely mimics what one would expect in a dying person physiologically, although more controlled.

Based on the reported phenomena, it looks similar to disorders of the Occipital and temporal lobes of the brain and lymbic system. These symptoms are visual and non-verbal auditory hallucination, autoscopia etc. and no one would suggest that these people with brain damage or epilepsy are now communing with God.

Generally the modern medicine has concluded that Near Death Experiences are either lucid dreaming, breakdown of cerebral physiology, lymbic system stress or alternatively a psychological defence mechanism.

I find it doubtful that the mere mortal hands of physicians can bring someone back that has already begun to commune with God. If God wanted to take you, believe me you would die regardless of every intervention of modern medicine.
So my personal opinion is that it is either a process of dying or a lucid dream. I have not investigated this matter thoroughly though, so I am willing to give a lot of leeway to other more esoteric interpretations, but they must be weighed against the facts as well.

As an aside, the idea of souls leaving bodies and astral projection etc. I find ridiculous for I do not believe a body would be able to survive without its soul. This to me seems to be hallucinations at best and the fact that practitioners thereof continue to show brain activity in MRI and EEG tests confirm that someone is still at home upstairs while they are supposedly 'travelling'.
I also see no reason why visions in the Bible require the soul to leave the body. This does not necessarily follow.
 
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DennisTate

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Your poll has quite biased options with multiple ones implying that the Light is somehow God and not allowing a nuanced view of near death experience.

Multiple medical studies have been conducted into Near death Experiences such as the Perera study in Australia in 2005 or Lommel's study in the Netherlands in 2001 for instance.
The medical fraternity have created a weighted Core Experience index to try and objectively measure the phenomena and the Near-Death experience scale to try and predict who is more likely to experience the phenomenon.
Generally they concluded that about 10% of people who undergo cardiac arrest and have dilated pupils and cessation of observable brain activity but survive, will report a Near Death Experience afterward. The problem is that there is no way to see if there is really no brain activity as we cannot hook up a dying unstable person to an MRI or EEG, so we cannot say that a Near death experience is not related to brain activity.

Another problem is that if we use the Anaesthetic agent Ketamine, which is a NMDA receptor antagonist, we get very similar reported phenomena afterward such as lights, out of body etc. This agent raises your heart rate, releases adrenaline, decreases dopamine re-uptake and activates pain reduction pathways, so loosely mimics what one would expect in a dying person physiologically, although more controlled.

Based on the reported phenomena, it looks similar to disorders of the Occipital and temporal lobes of the brain and lymbic system. These symptoms are visual and non-verbal auditory hallucination, autoscopia etc. and no one would suggest that these people with brain damage or epilepsy are now communing with God.

Generally the modern medicine has concluded that Near Death Experiences are either lucid dreaming, breakdown of cerebral physiology, lymbic system stress or alternatively a psychological defence mechanism.

I find it doubtful that the mere mortal hands of physicians can bring someone back that has already begun to commune with God. If God wanted to take you, believe me you would die regardless of every intervention of modern medicine.
So my personal opinion is that it is either a process of dying or a lucid dream. I have not investigated this matter thoroughly though, so I am willing to give a lot of leeway to other more esoteric interpretations, but they must be weighed against the facts as well.

As an aside, the idea of souls leaving bodies and astral projection etc. I find ridiculous for I do not believe a body would be able to survive without its soul. This to me seems to be hallucinations at best and the fact that practitioners thereof continue to show brain activity in MRI and EEG tests confirm that someone is still at home upstairs while they are supposedly 'travelling'.
I also see no reason why visions in the Bible require the soul to leave the body. This does not necessarily follow.

Your reply is brilliant!

May I quote you into other related discussions that I have going on this?

I am sure that you will enjoy reading about the Pam Reynolds procedure:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pam_Reynolds_case

"Pam Reynolds Lowery (1956 – May 22, 2010), from Atlanta, Georgia, was an American singer-songwriter.[1] In 1991, at the age of 35, she stated that she had a near-death experience (NDE) during a brain operation performed by Robert F. Spetzler at the Barrow Neurological Institute in Phoenix, Arizona. Her experience is one of the most widely documented in near-death studies because of the circumstances under which it happened. Reynolds was under close medical monitoring during the entire operation. During part of the operation she had no brain-wave activity and no blood flowing in her brain, which rendered her clinically dead. She claimed to have made several observations during the procedure which later medical personnel reported to be accurate."

..... Reynolds reported to her physician that she was experiencing symptoms of dizziness, loss of speech and difficulty in moving parts of her body. Her physician referred her to a neurologist and a CAT scan later revealed that Reynolds had a large aneurysm in her brain, close to the brain stem. Because of the difficult position of the aneurysm, Reynolds was predicted to have no chance of survival. As a last resort, Robert F. Spetzler — a neurosurgeon of the Barrow Neurological Institute in Phoenix, Arizona — decided that a rarely performed surgical procedure, known as hypothermic cardiac arrest, was necessary to improve Pam's outcome. During this procedure, also known as a standstill operation, Pam's body temperature was lowered to 50 °F (10 °C), her breathing and heartbeat stopped, and the blood drained from her head. Her eyes were closed with tape and small ear plugs with speakers were placed in her ears. These speakers emitted audible clicks which were used to check the function of the brain stem to ensure that she had a flat EEG — or a non-responsive brain — before the operation proceeded. The operation was a success and Reynolds recovered completely. The total surgery lasted about 7 hours with a few complications along the way."

....
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Your reply is brilliant!

May I quote you into other related discussions that I have going on this?

I am sure that you will enjoy reading about the Pam Reynolds procedure:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pam_Reynolds_case

Pam Reynolds Lowery (1956 – May 22, 2010), from Atlanta, Georgia, was an American singer-songwriter.[1] In 1991, at the age of 35, she stated that she had a near-death experience (NDE) during a brain operation performed by Robert F. Spetzler at the Barrow Neurological Institute in Phoenix, Arizona. Her experience is one of the most widely documented in near-death studies because of the circumstances under which it happened. Reynolds was under close medical monitoring during the entire operation. During part of the operation she had no brain-wave activity and no blood flowing in her brain, which rendered her clinically dead. She claimed to have made several observations during the procedure which later medical personnel reported to be accurate.

This near-death experience claim has been considered by some believers to be evidence of the survival of consciousness after death, and of a life after death. However, critics and skeptics have pointed to prosaic and conventional means as possible explanations.[2] Reynolds died from heart failure, on Saturday May 22, 2010, age 53 at Emory University Hospital, in Atlanta, Georgia. Her memorial service was held on May 28, 2010 at 2PM at H.M. Patterson & Son, Oglethorpe Hill.

Quote away.

Interesting case. I also think it was likely Anaesthetic awareness which can happen in about 1 in 50000 surgeries. I shall look up the case studies the doctors obviously wrote on Pam Reynolds.
 
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DennisTate

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Quote away.

Interesting case. I also think it was likely Anaesthetic awareness which can happen in about 1 in 50000 surgeries. I shall look up the case studies the doctors obviously wrote on Pam Reynolds.
Thank you!

I am also pretty sure that these quotations on basic String Theory will give you reason to wonder exactly what intelligence/ consciousness/ life...... in a higher invisible dimension of space - time would probably be like.

"In spite of
these bizarre overtones, it seems probable that in future a "theory of everything" will make use of the idea of unseen higher dimensions."
.
...

"Although nature manifests four distinct forces, physicists believe that
each may be part of a smaller number of more primitive forces. At high energy, the electromagnetic and weak forces appear to merge into a single "electroweak" force. Some "grand unified theories" suggest that a further amalgamation takes place between the electroweak and strong forces at as yet unattained energies. The most ambitious unification schemes envisage an amalgamation of all four forces into a single "superforce" at ultra-high levels of energy."...
"The real burden in the next three centuries will not be the development of fancy mathematics, but the experimental testing of these ambitious theories. All current thinking about total unification assumes that the effects of linking all the forces and particles together will only become manifest at energies that are some trillion times greater than those currently attainable in particle accelerators. Probably we shall never reach such energies directly" ( A Theory of Everything" Volume 21 of "The World of Science)
 
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DennisTate

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Back in 1943 Dr. George Ritchie was given a tour of four higher invisible dimensions of space - time by Messiah Yeshua - Jesus. I personally believe that his description assists to understand many scriptures that I personally could not understand at all back while I was still a believer in "soul sleep."
.....
....
Then Jesus begins to take Ritchie on a journey through various realms of the afterlife. They fly toward a large city on Earth where they notice a group of assembly-line workers at work. They witnesses the spirit of a woman trying desperately to grab a cigarette from the workers who were oblivious to her presence. This woman had died severely addicted to cigarettes and was now cut off from the one thing she desperately desired most.



Ritchie realizes how the spirits in these realms immediately know the thoughts of other spirits around them. This is the reason they tend to group together with other spirits. It is too threatening to be around others who knew and disagreed with their thoughts.



Jesus leads Ritchie to a house somewhere on Earth where he is shown the spirit of a young man following his living family members around and begging them for forgiveness. But the family members are completely unaware of his presence. Jesus tells Ritchie the young man committed suicide and is "chained to every consequence of his act."



They then traveled to a bar somewhere on Earth which was filled with sailors drinking heavily. Spirits surrounded the sailors as they tried desperately, and in vain, to grasp the shot glasses to get a drink. Other spirits tried to control the sailors' alcoholic behavior. Ritchie learns these are the spirits of people who died still having a severe alcoholic addiction which went beyond the physical. He is bewildered as he observes one of the sailors passing out causing the sailor's protective aura surrounding him to crack open. When it does, it allows a spirit to scramble into the sailor's unconscious body. This scene was repeated over and over.

Return to Top receiving station" where spirits would arrive in a deep hypnotic sleep because of a particular religious belief they held to be true. Here there were "angels" trying to arouse them and help them realize, "God is truly a God of the living and that they did not have to lie around sleeping until Gabriel or someone came along blowing on a horn." These are the spirits of people who believe they must sleep in their grave until the second coming of Christ (i.e., soul sleep.)
(near-death.com)
 
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timewerx

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It seems to me that we are in a situation somewhat like the time of the Prophet Elijah.

1Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."


I began to study these experiences a great deal back in 1990. They immediately made me realize that the "soul sleep" doctrine that I had been taught was almost certainly in error. I got kicked out of two churches due to disagreements mainly over that doctrine. But as a Christian there was no way that I could deny the possibility of people having an "out of the body experience!"

2 Corinthians 12:2 "I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter."


I voted "I'm not sure".

There's overwhelming clues that the brain gets flooded with DMT in near death in an attempt to imprint the DNA to both the immediate environment and to loved ones.

The DNA is the soul and DMT is the brain's last ditch attempt to immortalize itself by summoning quantum mechanical processes to create copies of one's DNA into the fabrics of space and time.

Time no longer takes meaning at such point. So the whole process could seem like forever and DNA could even be imprinted back in time. The "soul sleep" could still take place but again, it won't make meaning at all.

What people may be seeing, NDE could be the brain doing these radical steps to preserve its memories and identity beyond death.


If we know the Universe or the Earth is coming to an end and nobody will survive it, what would we do? We embark on a global effort taking aside economics to build a massive ship or thousands of rockets to be launched out to the stars, it may contain people in it or may just contain our DNA, or the genetic sequences of the entire human and animals and plants on Earth, plus all the data regarding Earth's and man's history. That to immortalize our race, our memories, and our achievements.

I believe our brain is doing the same thing in the throes of death. A last ditch effort to be remembered and to live forever.
 
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Quote away.

Interesting case. I also think it was likely Anaesthetic awareness which can happen in about 1 in 50000 surgeries. I shall look up the case studies the doctors obviously wrote on Pam Reynolds.

Here is another discussion that illustrates how useful this question can be to
raising the debate up to a higher level on other topics.........

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/gods-many-plans-for-the-gay-community.7728763/

God's many plans for the Gay community???????

Do You Agree That God Has Plans For The Gay Community?
  1. *
    Yes, God owns this studio, we are the actors playing out our role!
    12 vote(s)
    27.9%

  2. No, God would never compromise one millionth of an inch with sin!!!!
    11 vote(s)
    25.6%
  3. *
    Yes, deep down we all love God and He has good planned for all of us.
    16 vote(s)
    37.2%

  4. I have really never considered this idea before???
    12 vote(s)
    27.9%

 
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DennisTate

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I voted "I'm not sure".

There's overwhelming clues that the brain gets flooded with DMT in near death in an attempt to imprint the DNA to both the immediate environment and to loved ones.

The DNA is the soul and DMT is the brain's last ditch attempt to immortalize itself by summoning quantum mechanical processes to create copies of one's DNA into the fabrics of space and time.

Time no longer takes meaning at such point. So the whole process could seem like forever and DNA could even be imprinted back in time. The "soul sleep" could still take place but again, it won't make meaning at all.

What people may be seeing, NDE could be the brain doing these radical steps to preserve its memories and identity beyond death.


If we know the Universe or the Earth is coming to an end and nobody will survive it, what would we do? We embark on a global effort taking aside economics to build a massive ship or thousands of rockets to be launched out to the stars, it may contain people in it or may just contain our DNA, or the genetic sequences of the entire human and animals and plants on Earth, plus all the data regarding Earth's and man's history. That to immortalize our race, our memories, and our achievements.

I believe our brain is doing the same thing in the throes of death. A last ditch effort to be remembered and to live forever.

Interesting theories!

I am of the belief that we humans have been given more power........ more authority..... and more capability...... than we tend to realize at this time!
 
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BobRyan

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It seems to me that we are in a situation somewhat like the time of the Prophet Elijah.

1Kings 18:21 "And Elijah came unto all the people, and said, How long halt ye between two opinions? if the LORD be God, follow him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word."


I began to study these experiences a great deal back in 1990. They immediately made me realize that the "soul sleep" doctrine that I had been taught was almost certainly in error. I got kicked out of two churches due to disagreements mainly over that doctrine. But as a Christian there was no way that I could deny the possibility of people having an "out of the body experience!"

2 Corinthians 12:2 "I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;)
How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter."

Why do you claim that the 1Thess 4 teaching on soul sleep is opposed to the 2Cor 12 OBE - out of body experience of Paul?
 
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BobRyan

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the dormant state of 1Thess 4 -

13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

John 11 "our friend Lazarus SLEEPS I go that I may WAKE him"


But this does not preclude/negate the 2 Cor 12 out of body experience of Paul.

In Matt 22 Christ presents an irrefutable argument for the future resurrection when debating with the Sadducees which only works in the context of soul sleep.
 
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Why do you claim that the 1Thess 4 teaching on soul sleep is opposed to the 2Cor 12 OBE - out of body experience of Paul?

That is the way that I viewed the topic back in 1988. Once I studied near death experience accounts for a while........ then it all became clear.
 
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the dormant state of 1Thess 4 -

13 But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

John 11 "our friend Lazarus SLEEPS I go that I may WAKE him"


But this does not preclude/negate the 2 Cor 12 out of body experience of Paul.

In Matt 22 Christ presents an irrefutable argument for the future resurrection when debating with the Sadducees which only works in the context of soul sleep.

Back in 1988, I would have thought that the verses that I took to imply "soul sleep" would make a visionary dream such as Pastor Rick Joyner had back in 1995 impossible.

Now I know better.

http://www.christianforums.com/thre...-sick-no-arms-or-legs-and-persecuted.7653651/
 
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That is the way that I viewed the topic back in 1988. Once I studied near death experience accounts for a while........ then it all became clear.

The 1Thess 4 statement on death - simply says that the soul is in a dormant state at death.

But 2 Cor 12 Paul is not saying "I died one time and went to heaven" -- Paul is not describing death at all in 2Cor 12.

Visions and dreams can take the form of an out-of-body experience the way Paul describes it in 2Cor 12.
 
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The 1Thess 4 statement on death - simply says that the soul is in a dormant state at death.

But 2 Cor 12 Paul is not saying "I died one time and went to heaven" -- Paul is not describing death at all in 2Cor 12.

Visions and dreams can take the form of an out-of-body experience the way Paul describes it in 2Cor 12.

But...... apparently that "dormant" state can include at least some thought and awareness going on......

Rev 6:10

And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
 
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DennisTate

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The 1Thess 4 statement on death - simply says that the soul is in a dormant state at death.

But 2 Cor 12 Paul is not saying "I died one time and went to heaven" -- Paul is not describing death at all in 2Cor 12.

Visions and dreams can take the form of an out-of-body experience the way Paul describes it in 2Cor 12.

I do agree with you though that there is a real difference.......
in the way that Christians will be able to act.... after that rapture and/or
Second Coming event does take place......

This is just a theory and I may be wrong but after being highly skeptical of the idea of a rapture for most of my life I am now open to the idea that the Rapture could fit in extremely well with the ultimate fulfillment of the Fast of Yom Kippur.


I could not get my head around this idea until reading the NDE account of Dr. Richard Eby:



He paused as though the joy of that thought had overwhelmed him for the moment.

"My Father assures me that the time is yet a little while, but very little. Soon he will call those already in paradise to surround me as we descend from this third heaven to the first heaven around the Earth. The souls of all my saints will be instantly clothed in their new resurrection bodies, as will the living saints on Earth who rise to us in the glory cloud! At the sounding trumpet they all receive new bodies and rise to meet us in the air. We return as my body to my throne room with the Father. Now do you understand why I called this place a temporary abiding place? Do you grasp what it will mean to be one with me and the Father in your incorruptible bodies? My book states that I assumed mankind's sin so you "might be made the righteousness of God' in me!"

I can clearly recall how Jesus' voice paused at this moment. He was savoring an anticipation too intense and private to be revealed. Was he pre-living that moment at which he would enjoy the victory which his Father would give him as the eternal reward for his own long-suffering? His own sting of death would be swallowed up, and he would be the omniscient Head of a completed and compliant body for whom he had shed his blood on a terrible cross. He would reign as KING of the Jews after these days of grace. Then his thoughts returned to me.

"My son, when that time has come, my Father will call to me. The applause of the heavenly hosts will be deafening; they too have been awaiting that day, ever since they announced my birth to the shepherds at Bethlehem so long ago. Scoffers will gaze with fear and wonder as my angelic hosts watch me fulfill my promise to my earthly body of believers at my soon return to Earth. (Dr. Richard Eby)
 
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