Texas City Pulls nativity, despite objections of atheists.

AnonymousRain

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If the government refuses to allow any group other than Christians to display their celebratory items, then that's not religious freedom, but religious exclusion.
Government has no obligation to include atheists or allow atheists to display.
Because atheists do not celebrate the holy days the religious do. Atheists know this.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Government has no obligation to include atheists or allow atheists to display.
Because atheists do not celebrate the holy days the religious do. Atheists know this.
Government also cannot stop atheists from celebrating whatever holidays they like.

Who is going to tell me what I can or cannot celebrate?
 
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Cute Tink

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Government has no obligation to include atheists or allow atheists to display.
Because atheists do not celebrate the holy days the religious do. Atheists know this.

You are incorrect. Atheists do celebrate the same holy days that others choose to. Their reasons aren't the same. I'm not sure how many times I have to point out that I celebrate Christmas.

The government has taken the position that atheism is deserving of the same protection as religions.
 
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grasping the after wind

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Well I guess the city is doing what is correct whether the atheist group wanted the city to do it or not and whether the city meant to do the right thing or not. Governments ought to stay out of religion altogether and ought not be promoting people having happy holy days even if the religion is a secular one. Let citizens not only make their own private accommodations for their religious symbols but also for their well wishes about holy days as well. A government that considers a date a secular holy day is engaging in some kind of religious activity and that ought to be out to a stop. Governments can give their employees days off without resorting to phrases that have religious significance. Independence day for instance ought to considered a day to commemorate the beginning of the country not a holy day. A sign proclaiming Happy New Year should have been acceptable but Happy Holy Day should be considered inappropriate.
 
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grasping the after wind

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Government also cannot stop atheists from celebrating whatever holidays they like.

Who is going to tell me what I can or cannot celebrate?

Well, yes, that is correct as long as you aren't asking the government to allow you to celebrate your holy day on government property.
 
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AnonymousRain

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You are incorrect. Atheists do celebrate the same holy days that others choose to. Their reasons aren't the same. I'm not sure how many times I have to point out that I celebrate Christmas.
What would make you think anyone here is obligated to count the number of times you've admitted you're not an atheist?

Atheists don't celebrate Christ's mass.
If someone who calls themselves an atheist does celebrate December 25th, they're doing it for the material gain in receiving gifts.
Christmas is an exclusive celebration honoring the birth of the Christian's god in the form of the Christ child Jesus.

The government has taken the position that atheism is deserving of the same protection as religions.
Sure, atheism is afforded protections. However, atheism doesn't celebrate religious holy days.
 
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GoldenBoy89

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Atheists don't celebrate Christ's mass.
Some do. They don't have to believe the story to celebrate the day with family and friends who do believe in the story.

If someone who calls themselves an atheist does celebrate December 25th, they're doing it for the material gain in receiving gifts.
Or for the fun of just being around family, friends, enjoying good food and exchanging gifts with loved ones. I don't need to believe in Christ to do any of that.

I, for example, don't buy gifts, I prefer to make them. I do that because I enjoy the work I put into my gifts and even more the reaction I get from someone when they receive my gift to them.

I don't know about you but I don't have any ulterior motives behind gift exchange... It's just a nice thing to do.

Christmas is an exclusive celebration honoring the birth of the Christian's god in the form of the Christ child Jesus.
So?


Sure, atheism is afforded protections. However, atheism doesn't celebrate religious holy days.
Not any of its own, no. Atheism has no holy days. Atheists are still free to celebrate any and all holidays they like, though.
 
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grasping the after wind

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That's not true.
Lynch v. Donnelly 1984 via SCOTUS

I find the idea laughable that my statement is objectively false simply because 31 years ago the majority of 9 old people in robes ( some perhaps senile at the time) disagreed with what I am now saying. You are conflating subjective legal opinion with objective fact. If all legal opinions of the Supreme Court were objectively verifiable facts then how is it that it is arrived at by majority vote and not unanimous acclimation and how is it that Courts ever disagree with previous rulings. We would still have Dred Scott as a benchmark and the 13th Amendment would never have been adopted if it were the case that the Supreme Court was inerrant.
 
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TLK Valentine

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That's not true.
Lynch v. Donnelly 1984 via SCOTUS

Indeed -- "The Court ruled that the crèche has a legitimate secular purpose within a larger holiday display to celebrate the season and the origins of Christmas which has long been a part of Western culture." (Wikipedia)

And since Atheists are also a part of Western Culture, they also celebrate Christmas.
 
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grasping the after wind

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Some do. They don't have to believe the story to celebrate the day with family and friends who do believe in the story.
You have to admit though that it is rather strange to celebrate something you do not think is worth celebrating? Christians also do this though. Halloween a celebration of greed, gluttony and pagan beliefs in evil spirits is celebrated by many Christians that would say that all three of those things are bad ideas. New Year is another. So Atheists are not alone in celebrating something for no good reason. Celebrations are usually fun and people like them so no reason necessary, I guess.
 
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AnonymousRain

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I find the idea laughable that my statement is objectively false simply because 31 years ago the majority of 9 old people in robes ( some perhaps senile at the time)
I'm going to stop you there.
It was a SCOTUS decision concerning a nativity on government property.
I realize you have no respect for that, due to your inflammatory remarks. However, that is what the court said. And since you apparently don't know I'll say this in conclusion; SCOTUS' decisions don't have an expiration date. Unless they overturn their decision it stands. And to my knowledge, they did not overturn this decision.

The court proved your prior proclamation wrong. Therefore, you're expressing a personal bias that has no legal merit.
Laugh. It does a body good.
 
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TLK Valentine

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I'm going to stop you there.
It was a SCOTUS decision concerning a nativity on government property.
I realize you have no respect for that, due to your inflammatory remarks. However, that is what the court said. And since you apparently don't know I'll say this in conclusion; SCOTUS' decisions don't have an expiration date. Unless they overturn their decision it stands. And to my knowledge, they did not overturn this decision.

The court proved your prior proclamation wrong. Therefore, you're expressing a personal bias that has no legal merit.
Laugh. It does a body good.

Indeed -- long may their decisions on abortion and same sex marriage stand as well...
 
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AnonymousRain

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Indeed -- "The Court ruled that the crèche has a legitimate secular purpose within a larger holiday display to celebrate the season and the origins of Christmas which has long been a part of Western culture." (Wikipedia)
Wikipedia is not a valid resource. You can easily find this case on a credible site.

And since Atheists are also a part of Western Culture, they also celebrate Christmas.
Christianity is the the most popular tradition in western culture. By your argument as pertains to the blanket statement regarding atheists celebrating Christ's mass, atheists also go to church.
 
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grasping the after wind

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I'm going to stop you there.
It was a SCOTUS decision concerning a nativity on government property.
I realize you have no respect for that, due to your inflammatory remarks. However, that is what the court said. And since you apparently don't know I'll say this in conclusion; SCOTUS' decisions don't have an expiration date. Unless they overturn their decision it stands. And to my knowledge, they did not overturn this decision.

The court proved your prior proclamation wrong. Therefore, you're expressing a personal bias that has no legal merit.
Laugh. It does a body good.

The Court ruled it did not prove. There is a difference you seem to be unaware of. If the Supreme Court ruled that what goes up stays up it would not change the fact of gravity. The Supreme Court merely rules on points of law and nothing more substantial than that. The Supreme courts rulings are called opinions for a reason. You continue to conflate an opinion of the majority of 9 with an objective fact.
 
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TLK Valentine

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Wikipedia is not a valid resource. You can easily find this case on a credible site.

Rather than dismiss Wikipedia, why don't you tell me where it's wrong?

Christianity is the the most popular tradition in western culture.

Remember when it used to be a religion?

By your argument as pertains to the blanket statement regarding atheists celebrating Christ's mass, atheists also go to church.

Are you saying that Atheists must participate in all the traditions or none? Do you think you can enforce such a statement?
 
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AnonymousRain

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The Court ruled it did not prove. There is a difference you seem to be unaware of. If the Supreme Court ruled that what goes up stays up it would not change the fact of gravity. The Supreme Court merely rules on points of law and nothing more substantial than that. The Supreme courts rulings are called opinions for a reason. You continue to conflate an opinion of the majority of 9 with an objective fact.
You appear not to realize when SCOTUS delivered the opinion that a nativity creche does not violate the establishment clause in Lynch v. Donnelly in 1989 , that that means the atheist can't try to force a government office to remove the nativity creche that they may have displayed on government property. Because the court ruled it does not violate the establishment clause.

The anti-religious atheist hopes apparently to lead people to believe SCOTUS means nothing at all to the United States laws. That the nine justices you attempted to insult are just delivering opinions that mean nothing at all in matters of how the law reads or is applied after they've opined.
 
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