Spiritual manifestations at Pentecost

[pauluk333]

Hi there

I am really hoping someone can help me with a question. I was wondering why a lot of the spiritual manifestations found in churches today are not found at Pentecost. To clarify the type of manifestations I am talking about are the following:

Continues laughing for no apparent reason (Rodney Howard brown) - see vid below
Continues bouts of shaking - see vid below
Speaking in a non earthly - non human language - see vide below

What I see from scripture in regards to Spiritual manifestations are the following:

Supernatural ability to speak in earthly human languages
Supernatural boldness
Supernatural ability to speak words that cut to the heart of men
Supernatural unselfishness, were everything was shared

Nothing more.

So I would just like some feedback on why Continues laughing, Continues bouts of shaking or Speaking in a non earthly tongues was not present as a manifestation of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost or (anywhere in the bible), but is now present in churches today ?

My aim is not to offend anyone, so please do reply with honest feedback in the spirit of 2 Timothy 2:23 - A servant of the Lord must not quarrel but must be kind to everyone, be able to teach, and be patient with difficult people. 25 Gently instruct those who oppose the truth. Perhaps God will change those people’s hearts, and they will learn the truth. 26 Then they will come to their senses and escape from the devil’s trap. For they have been held captive by him to do whatever he wants.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Before Pentecost Jesus gave the disciples power.
17 "And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the demons are subject to us through Your name. 18 And He said to them, I saw Satan fall from Heaven like lightning. 19 Behold, I give to you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the authority of the enemy. And nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20 Yet do not rejoice in this, that the evil spirits are subject to you, rather rejoice because your names are written in Heaven." Luke 10:17-20. MKJV.

"And He reproached their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen. 15 And He said to them, Go into all the world, proclaim the gospel to all the creation. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved, but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And signs will follow to those believing these things: in My name they will cast out demons; they will speak new tongues; 18 they will take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it will not hurt them. They will lay hands on the sick, and they will be well." Mark 16:14-18 MKJV.

Jesus wanted them to have joy, yes because of authority but also purely by faith because of Heaven. He said they would speak new languages, probably he meant both new to them and new to Earthly people.

17 "And the book of the prophet Isaiah was handed to Him. And unrolling the book, He found the place where it was written, 18 "The Spirit of the Lord is on Me; because of this He has anointed Me to proclaim the Gospel to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to proclaim deliverance to the captives, and new sight to the blind, to set at liberty those having been crushed, 19 to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord." 20 And rolling up the book, returning it to the attendant, He sat down." Luke 4:17-20.
1 "The Spirit of the Lord Jehovah is on Me; because the LORD has anointed Me to preach the Gospel to the poor; He has sent Me to bind up the broken-hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to those who are bound; 2 to preach the acceptable year of the LORD and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all who mourn; 3 to appoint to those who mourn in Zion, to give to them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the mantle of praise for the spirit of heaviness; so that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that He might be glorified." Isaiah 61:3. MKJV
The above shows God wants us to have joy and freedom. The synagogue did not get the joy. But after Pentecost there is more. And joy is in laughter. We do not laugh at folly only. But hardship, we can sometimes laugh, in joy is strength. There is oil, anointing of joy.

"We have more than the law now, joy gives us strength.
For all the people wept when they heard the words of the law. 10 Then he said to them, Go eat the fat and drink the sweet, and send portions to him for whom nothing is prepared. For this day is holy to our LORD. And do not be sorry, for the joy of the LORD is your strength. MKJV " Neh 8:9-10.

Tongues can be interpreted according to Corinthians 12.

God gives us righteousness, peace and joy in the kingdom.
"Then do not let your good be spoken evil of, 17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit." Rom 14:16-17. MKJV.

From Moses, to Isaiah to Hosea God likens our relationship to God like a marriage, and Jesus is the bride groom. It is a metaphor. In church there should be joy, not only repentance, part of intimacy with God, and prophecy as spoken over Timothy is like the seed, and the mission the child.
Timothy 4:14. MKJV.

25 And there are also many things, whatever Jesus did, which, if they should be written singly, I suppose the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen. John 21:25. MKJV.

God is not limited to the old Bible works, or I could say, each miracle one after the other in the Bible was something new almost every time.

 

[Another Lazarus]

That woman at Toronto blessing was surely "high"
1 Cor 14:32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. (the prophets control the spirit) not the spirits shakin ur head.

Copeland :
when u speak in tongue you cannot prepare what you are going to say cause The Holy Spirit is the One who speaks and its for personal edification /built of faith ONLY. you cannot pray for other people with tongues. you cannot dictate what u wish to utter to the Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
1 Cor 14 2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him

Holy Laughter Chaos :
1 Cor 14:11 Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a BARBARIAN and he that speaketh shall be a BARBARIAN to me.

If you received the Holy Spirit baptism you will feel the "unexplainable electric current" inside your body but it didnt hurt the least, and you shall be slain in the spirit and cry at the feet of Jesus, sooner or later when u pray your tongue will move by itself/Holy Spirit takes control, and its called speaking in tongues. you can stop at any second cause you r the one in control.

Speaking in tongues divided in 2 :
1. Glossolalia : consists of 2 things : speak in words nobody understand or to utter prophecy by Spirit
2. xenolalia : foreign language

May Jesus bless you all HalleluYAH

 

[pauluk333]

That woman at Toronto blessing was surely "high"
1 Cor 14:32 And the spirits of the prophets are subject to the prophets. (the prophets control the spirit) not the spirits shakin ur head.

So are saying that was perhaps a demonic manifestations ?

Copeland :
when u speak in tongue you cannot prepare what you are going to say cause The Holy Spirit is the One who speaks and its for personal edification /built of faith ONLY. you cannot pray for other people with tongues. you cannot dictate what u wish to utter to the Holy Spirit.
1 Cor 14:4 He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.
1 Cor 14 2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him

1 Cor 14 2 - The church of Corinth had lots and lots of different languages and people as it was located near a port.
Is it possible in this this verse Paul is saying if a English speaker speaks by the power of God in Dutch to French believers, no one will understand him, he will only speak to God and utter mysteries in the spirit, because french people will not understand dutch.

1 Cor 14:4 - For if you have the ability to speak in tongues,a]'>[a] you will be talking only to God, since people won’t be able to understand you. You will be speaking by the power of the Spirit,b]'>[b] but it will all be mysterious. - Yes if you read that in the context I think its saying any practice of any spiritual gift with edify a Christian, including supernatural speaking in an earthly human tounge when no one there understands, as they don't speak that particular langue.

Holy Laughter Chaos :
1 Cor 14:11 Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a BARBARIAN and he that speaketh shall be a BARBARIAN to me.

11If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is saying, I am a foreigner to the speaker, and the speaker is a foreigner to me....sorry ow does this verse relate to holy laughter ?

If you received the Holy Spirit baptism you will feel the "unexplainable electric current" inside your body but it didnt hurt the least, and you shall be slain in the spirit and cry at the feet of Jesus, sooner or later when u pray your tongue will move by itself/Holy Spirit takes control, and its called speaking in tongues. you can stop at any second cause you r the one in control.

If you received the Holy Spirit baptism you will feel the "unexplainable electric current" inside your body - sorry is that scriptural ?

I mean how do you explain that this is the very same feeling felt in a kundlenin experience - This awakening involves the Kundalini physically moving up the central channel to reach within the Sahasrara Chakra at the top of the head. Many systems of yoga focus on the awakening of Kundalini through meditation, pranayama breathing, the practice of asana and chanting of mantras.[6] In physical terms, one commonly reports the Kundalini experience to be a feeling of electric current running along the spine.[7][8][9]

Speaking in tongues divided in 2 :
1. Glossolalia : consists of 2 things : speak in words nobody understand or to utter prophecy by Spirit
2. xenolalia : foreign language

Can you give me one instance when anyone ever actual spoke Glossolalia in the bible ? I have three instances in acts of the apsotles speaking in xenolalia, but could find no Glossolalia,

Many thanks

May Jesus bless you all HalleluYAH

 

[pauluk333]

Before Pentecost Jesus gave the disciples power.
17 "And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the demons are subject to us through Your name. 18 And He said to them, I saw Satan fall from Heaven like lightning. 19 Behold, I give to you authority to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the authority of the enemy. And nothing shall by any means hurt you. 20 Yet do not rejoice in this, that the evil spirits are subject to you, rather rejoice because your names are written in Heaven." Luke 10:17-20. MKJV.

Thanks for that verse but how does it relate to spiritual manifestations not found in the bible ?

"And He reproached their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they did not believe those who had seen Him after He had risen. 15 And He said to them, Go into all the world, proclaim the gospel to all the creation. 16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved, but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And signs will follow to those believing these things: in My name they will cast out demons; they will speak new tongues; 18 they will take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it will not hurt them. They will lay hands on the sick, and they will be well." Mark 16:14-18 MKJV.

Jesus wanted them to have joy, yes because of authority but also purely by faith because of Heaven. He said they would speak new languages, probably he meant both new to them and new to Earthly people.


Thanks again, how does that relate to spiritual manifestations not found in the bible ? Of course we should have joy but there is nothing about the type of holy laughter show in those videos.

17 "And the book of the prophet Isaiah was handed to Him. And unrolling the book, He found the place where it was written, 18 "The Spirit of the Lord is on Me; because of this He has anointed Me to proclaim the Gospel to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to proclaim deliverance to the captives, and new sight to the blind, to set at liberty those having been crushed, 19 to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord." 20 And rolling up the book, returning it to the attendant, He sat down." Luke 4:17-20.
1 "The Spirit of the Lord Jehovah is on Me; because the LORD has anointed Me to preach the Gospel to the poor; He has sent Me to bind up the broken-hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to those who are bound; 2 to preach the acceptable year of the LORD and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all who mourn; 3 to appoint to those who mourn in Zion, to give to them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the mantle of praise for the spirit of heaviness; so that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that He might be glorified." Isaiah 61:3. MKJV

The above shows God wants us to have joy and freedom. The synagogue did not get the joy. But after Pentecost there is more. And joy is in laughter. We do not laugh at folly only. But hardship, we can sometimes laugh, in joy is strength. There is oil, anointing of joy.

Again of course we should have unspeakable joy in the Lord and who he is, but there is nothing about the type of holy laughter show in those videos, which is imparted by others.

"We have more than the law now, joy gives us strength.
For all the people wept when they heard the words of the law. 10 Then he said to them, Go eat the fat and drink the sweet, and send portions to him for whom nothing is prepared. For this day is holy to our LORD. And do not be sorry, for the joy of the LORD is your strength. MKJV " Neh 8:9-10.

Tongues can be interpreted according to Corinthians 12.... of course tounges can be interpreted, so a person who cannot speak Russian, can now supernatural translate what an English person is saying in Russian to Dutch believers.

God gives us righteousness, peace and joy in the kingdom.
"Then do not let your good be spoken evil of, 17 for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit." Rom 14:16-17. MKJV.

Again, I am not saying we should not have joy, we should cry, grief, be anger at sin and joyfull , all these are found in the bible.

From Moses, to Isaiah to Hosea God likens our relationship to God like a marriage, and Jesus is the bride groom. It is a metaphor. In church there should be joy, not only repentance, part of intimacy with God, and prophecy as spoken over Timothy is like the seed, and the mission the child.
Timothy 4:14. MKJV.

25 And there are also many things, whatever Jesus did, which, if they should be written singly, I suppose the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. Amen. John 21:25. MKJV.

But in these test its clear John is talk about Jesus miracles not manifestations.

God is not limited to the old Bible works, or I could say, each miracle one after the other in the Bible was something new almost every time.

Of course God is beyond limit and can act however he wants, he cannot act outside of his word he has given us as a guide, but would he ?

How do you interpret this verse - Do not quench the Spirit. 20Do not treat prophecies with contempt 21but test them all; hold on to what is good, 22reject every kind of evil.

How would we test a spirit ?

6Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” Then you will not be puffed up in being a follower of one of us over against the other. 7For who makes you different from anyone else? What do you have that you did not receive? And if you did receive it, why do you boast as though you did not?

Lastly do you think some manifestations may be demonic ?

Many thanks

 

[Another Lazarus]

quoting : So are saying that was perhaps a demonic manifestations ?
I dont think it was demonic manifestations, she shake her head so the "spirit" inspiration can be created
as she planned before the show.

quoting : .sorry ow does this verse relate to holy laughter ?
The early church was never recorded to have had a laughter which is called "holy", Paul called it barbarian
1 Cor 14:11 Therefore if I know not the meaning of the voice, I shall be unto him that speaketh a BARBARIAN and he that speaketh shall be a BARBARIAN to me.

sorry is that scriptural ?
That was not written by The Apostles. It was not that smart Yoga Kundalini experience.
I would say the electric current was indescribable
It was the feeling that let you understand How Jesus was resurrected from DEATH.
Ask God yourself instead of just asking questions while the chance still remains, to receive the Holy Spirit man oh man you must pray and fast for months some even for years. It wasnt something yu receive as soon as you ask.

May Jesus bless you all HalleluYAH

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

When I briefly received laughter it was under the control of the priest who laid hands on me. So I did not go home laughing but he prayed, stop Holy Spirit and I stopped laughing. More recently a young lady up at the local Catholic church was prayed for by a priest, and laughed a lot maybe for half an hour, and a week later describes a painfulness in life that was persistent was lifted off and she was more at peace more content.

 

[jiminpa]

You're arguing with a cessationist preaching another gospel, trying to play a guilt by association game.

It's real simple. Just because it's not in the Bible doesn't mean that God can't do it. Tongues weren't in the scriptures until the book of Acts, but that didn't stop God from giving them.

I didn't watch those videos, and I won't waste my time on them, and I would have no way to judge the presence of the Holy Spirit in them unless they are blatantly opposed to the scriptures. Unless you can show me where the scriptures oppose laughter you can't speak against it.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

Cessationism omits many passages from the Bible and creates the idea of a 75 year dispensation of grace. Rather it is a thousands of years long dispensation until the world hears the Gospel and then instead of grace patience until Christ returns, rules and judges. It, the period of patience is the 7 year tribulation.

 

[Righttruth]

Hi there

I am really hoping someone can help me with a question. I was wondering why a lot of the spiritual manifestations found in churches today are not found at Pentecost. To clarify the type of manifestations I am talking about are the following:

Continues laughing for no apparent reason (Rodney Howard brown) - see vid below
Continues bouts of shaking - see vid below
Speaking in a non earthly - non human language - see vide below

What I see from scripture in regards to Spiritual manifestations are the following:

Supernatural ability to speak in earthly human languages
Supernatural boldness
Supernatural ability to speak words that cut to the heart of men
Supernatural unselfishness, were everything was shared

Nothing more.

So I would just like some feedback on why Continues laughing, Continues bouts of shaking or Speaking in a non earthly tongues was not present as a manifestation of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost or (anywhere in the bible), but is now present in churches today ?

My aim is not to offend anyone, so please do reply with honest feedback in the spirit of 2 Timothy 2:23 - A servant of the Lord must not quarrel but must be kind to everyone, be able to teach, and be patient with difficult people. 25 Gently instruct those who oppose the truth. Perhaps God will change those people’s hearts, and they will learn the truth. 26 Then they will come to their senses and escape from the devil’s trap. For they have been held captive by him to do whatever he wants.

In the first place, speaking in unknown tongue is nothing to do with the Holy Spirit. Simply mountain has been made out of the molehill!

 

[NJA]

I am really hoping someone can help me with a question. I was wondering why a lot of the spiritual manifestations found in churches today are not found at Pentecost.

Simple, 2 reasons:

1) Pentecost was not a meeting for Christians as detailed in 1 Corinthians 14, it is an evangelistic meeting where many people become Christians, so, a number of the gifts and ministries would not be needed immediately.

2) a lot of the spiritual manifestations found in churches today are not of the Holy Spirit, they are of man's, his mind / heart and emotions.

So, all you need to do is to follow Jesus by becoming a Christian, as detailed in Acts 2:4, 33, 37-39, then join a church that sticks to this and what God wants in meetings.
Then yo will have clear vision, answers instead of questions, unity and fast spiritual growth.

I'm with these for those reasons.

We became members by being baptised in water and the Holy Spirit (evidenced by the new prayer language).
In meetings we have:

• songs
• personal testimony of how someone found God & what happened
• communion (Sundays only)
• 2 or 3 gifts of tonghues, each followed by an interpretation (also from God's Spirit)
• 2 or 3 prophecies
• talk - words of wisdom and knowledge
• prayer for needs
• close & chat.

Most people have never even been to a church like this.

 

[jiminpa]

In the first place, speaking in unknown tongue is nothing to do with the Holy Spirit. Simply mountain has been made out of the molehill!

Nice assumption, but scripture says otherwise, but then, you know that.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

In the mainstream Evangelical theological and exegetical scholar world the gift of tongues was established as Biblical best by Professor Emeritus, Gordon D Fee. He is from Regent College Vancouver. His modules can still be studied under Rick Watts at that college, The Holy Spirit in the New Testament.

 

[Righttruth]

Nice assumption, but scripture says otherwise, but then, you know that.

It is better to quote the verse to support your case.

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

It is better to quote the verse to support your case.

I already quoted it myself from Jesus' words. Mark 16:14-18

 

[NJA]

I already quoted it myself from Jesus' words. Mark 16:14-18

And if anyone dares to suggest that the gospel ends with people running away scared, (written by Mark who knew the full story), based on MSS related to the Vaticanus that has a gap that fits these verses, read this.

 

[Righttruth]

I already quoted it myself from Jesus' words. Mark 16:14-18

That refers to new existing foreign languages, not unknown tongue!

 

[jiminpa]

That refers to new existing foreign languages, not unknown tongue!

You've been refuted a thousand times, and you keep coming back with your anti-biblical assumptions. People like you are why I don't discuss the Bible with cessationists. If cessationists considered the Bible relevant they wouldn't be cessationists.

 

[Righttruth]

You've been refuted a thousand times, and you keep coming back with your anti-biblical assumptions. People like you are why I don't discuss the Bible with cessationists. If cessationists considered the Bible relevant they wouldn't be cessationists.

I am not a cecessionist. I have never believed that what was written to Corinthians specifically can now be applied to mature Christians!

 

[GoldenKingGaze]

People cast out demons and have a fearless trampling authority, but do not speak in new known languages often or notoriously. I have heard of those who pray in tongues, speaking Hebrew unbeknown to them except that passers by were Jewish and understood.