Spiritual Knowledge

[Ana the Ist]

I've often heard from believers that science can only learn about the realm of the material and we need religion to learn about the spiritual realm....or similar such things.

The point is that they believe there is such a thing as spiritual knowledge. The idea that there is spiritual knowledge seems to imply there are spiritual "truths". That is...there are things that are true about the spiritual realm.

This got me to thinking of a question. I'd invite anyone who believes that spiritual truths exist to answer.

If you met someone who knew a spiritual "truth" that was completely contradictory and incompatible with your spiritual "truth"....how would you go about figuring out which one of you is correct? Is there a method, means, or some standard to determine spiritual truths by?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

 

[Davian]

It is my understanding that, historically, this was done through warfare.

 

[7angels]

I've often heard from believers that science can only learn about the realm of the material and we need religion to learn about the spiritual realm....or similar such things.

The point is that they believe there is such a thing as spiritual knowledge. The idea that there is spiritual knowledge seems to imply there are spiritual "truths". That is...there are things that are true about the spiritual realm.

This got me to thinking of a question. I'd invite anyone who believes that spiritual truths exist to answer.

If you met someone who knew a spiritual "truth" that was completely contradictory and incompatible with your spiritual "truth"....how would you go about figuring out which one of you is correct? Is there a method, means, or some standard to determine spiritual truths by?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

i like these kinds of challenges. even the Word tells us to have a stance on all things. so of course there are spiritual truths out there.

when i meet people that have a view i am unfamiliar with i require scripture to back it up. so far i have not found any spiritual truth that you cannot find scripture to support it. the hardest spiritual truth to prove is one that your opponent refuses to discuss any view but his own. these discussions turn into arguments which will get you nowhere.

God bless

 

[Ana the Ist]

It is my understanding that, historically, this was done through warfare.

Lol ahhh...no jokes, I was debating on putting something almost exactly like that into the OP. I decided against because I want to see some serious answers and not just angry snarky comeback posts.

 

[Ana the Ist]

i like these kinds of challenges. even the Word tells us to have a stance on all things. so of course there are spiritual truths out there.

when i meet people that have a view i am unfamiliar with i require scripture to back it up. so far i have not found any spiritual truth that you cannot find scripture to support it. the hardest spiritual truth to prove is one that your opponent refuses to discuss any view but his own. these discussions turn into arguments which will get you nowhere.

God bless

I'm sorry...when I said "a spiritual truth that completely contradicts your spiritual truth" I meant something not even necessarily in the same religion. So obviously it wouldn't be found in the bible.

Or are you saying that the only spiritual truths that exist are those which match up to the writings of your particular religion?

Also, if you require scripture to verify a spiritual truth...then aren't you guilty of this....

"the hardest spiritual truth to prove is one that your opponent refuses to discuss any view but his own"

 

[tealight]

If you met someone who knew a spiritual "truth" that was completely contradictory and incompatible with your spiritual "truth"....how would you go about figuring out which one of you is correct? Is there a method, means, or some standard to determine spiritual truths by?

Hi Ana, I think it is to evaluate it according to life experience. I would substitute the word 'truth' in the question with the word 'theory'.

 

[paulm50]

i like these kinds of challenges. even the Word tells us to have a stance on all things. so of course there are spiritual truths out there.

when i meet people that have a view i am unfamiliar with i require scripture to back it up. so far i have not found any spiritual truth that you cannot find scripture to support it. the hardest spiritual truth to prove is one that your opponent refuses to discuss any view but his own. these discussions turn into arguments which will get you nowhere.

God bless

What if they have scriptures that support their view?

Would you refuse to discuss their scriptures?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Hi Ana, I think it is to evaluate it according to life experience. I would substitute the word 'truth' in the question with the word 'theory'.

So you don't think there are spiritual truths...just spiritual theories....and they're all subjectively based on life experience?

 

[paulm50]

Ane, one must first define spiritual knowledge. Is it that of Australian Aborigines, South American Sun Worshippers, Druids, Islam, Hindus, Judaic or Scientology? Don't have time to list them all.

Would 7angels discuss the spiritual views of another religion, backed up by their scriptures?

All religions have a long history of killing those with different spiritual views. Secular society stops them doing this, it even holds it as a crime. Once executing people and now putting them in prison.

It is my understanding that, historically, this was done through warfare.

And still is.

 

[paulm50]

Hi Ana, I think it is to evaluate it according to life experience. I would substitute the word 'truth' in the question with the word 'theory'.

I would change it to belief.

 

[juvenissun]

I've often heard from believers that science can only learn about the realm of the material and we need religion to learn about the spiritual realm....or similar such things.

The point is that they believe there is such a thing as spiritual knowledge. The idea that there is spiritual knowledge seems to imply there are spiritual "truths". That is...there are things that are true about the spiritual realm.

This got me to thinking of a question. I'd invite anyone who believes that spiritual truths exist to answer.

If you met someone who knew a spiritual "truth" that was completely contradictory and incompatible with your spiritual "truth"....how would you go about figuring out which one of you is correct? Is there a method, means, or some standard to determine spiritual truths by?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

You are trying to run before you can walk.
We do not know what is the nature of Spiritual Truth. So we can not compare yet.

Do you know what is love/hate in terms of science? You don't. So you can not compare.

If you ever like to tell love from hate, there are two ways: get into religion, or be a politician.

 

[tealight]

I would change it to belief.

I thought of 'belief' too but went with 'theory'. There are probably several words along the same lines that would fit.
The word 'truth' on the other hand is more specific in what it means and what it points to and did not belong in the question.

 

[paulm50]

You are trying to run before you can walk.
We do not know what is the nature of spiritual knowledge. So we can not compare yet.

Do you know what is love/hate in terms of science? You don't. So you can not compare.

If you ever like to tell love from hate, there are two ways: get into religion, or be a politician.

Does Ana mean religious doctrines? The problem will always be. One man's spiritual truth, is another man's lie. As no one can define it in real terms, the result is often war or executions.

Actually they can define love/hate in terms of science. It's done via brain scans. I'm sure there are many other ways, facial, scent, mannerisms, etc.

 

[AV1611VET]

I've often heard from believers that science can only learn about the realm of the material and we need religion to learn about the spiritual realm....or similar such things.

You heard correctly.

Science is myopic.

Until they can build a machine that can do this ...

2 Kings 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

... they can admit their myopia.

The point is that they believe there is such a thing as spiritual knowledge.

Yes, indeed.

Imparted by the Holy Spirit, Himself.

2 Peter 1:21b ... but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

The idea that there is spiritual knowledge seems to imply there are spiritual "truths".

Yup.

That is...there are things that are true about the spiritual realm.

Yup.

This got me to thinking of a question. I'd invite anyone who believes that spiritual truths exist to answer.

If you met someone who knew a spiritual "truth" that was completely contradictory and incompatible with your spiritual "truth"....how would you go about figuring out which one of you is correct?

I would use the Bible to break the tie.

Is there a method, means, or some standard to determine spiritual truths by?

There is indeed!

For lack of a better term, I call them "Boolean standards:"

1. If the Bible says it, but Science disagrees: go with the Bible.
2. If the Bible doesn't say it, but Science does: go with Science.

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Thank YOU for asking!

 

[AV1611VET]

It is my understanding that, historically, this was done through warfare.

In spite of the Bible, or with respect to It?

 

[AV1611VET]

Or are you saying that the only spiritual truths that exist are those which match up to the writings of your particular religion?

Yes.

The word "religion" aside ... yes.

 

[AV1611VET]

What if they have scriptures that support their view?

Neat.

I would applaud them for their faith; but disagree with the object of their faith.

As we like to put it:

Sincere, but sincerely wrong.

Would you refuse to discuss their scriptures?

Nope.

Show me your scripture, then I'll show you where my Scripture says your scripture is wrong.

 

[paulm50]

You heard correctly.

Science is myopic.

Until they can build a machine that can do this ...

2 Kings 6:17 And Elisha prayed, and said, LORD, I pray thee, open his eyes, that he may see. And the LORD opened the eyes of the young man; and he saw: and, behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire round about Elisha.

... they can admit their myopia.Yes, indeed.

Science isn't in the business of proving myths. It works on facts only.

 

[paulm50]

Neat.

I would applaud them for their faith; but disagree with the object of their faith.

As we like to put it:

Sincere, but sincerely wrong.Nope.

Even if their faith demanded your death?

Show me your scripture, then I'll show you where my Scripture says your scripture is wrong.

Your scripture saying mine is wrong, isn't important. You need to prove it's wrong.

I can show you Harry Potter, doesn't make it true.

 

[paulm50]

In spite of the Bible, or with respect to It?

Because of bibles.

There are many passages in many bibles that tell people to kill the other side.

At the moment we have war in the Middle East over two sides that can't decide who was the true follower of Mohammed, we had one in Europe for 30 years. This is the same religions using bible texts to kill. Don't start me on different religions. To long a list.