So what's it actually like...

[Ignatius21]

...living in Russia these days?

I know we have a few regulars who are living there, or have lived. I wonder, because I sense a bit of "Rusaphilia" (is that a word?) among some Orthodox lately, mostly converts, who have latched onto the idea that Russia has stepped up to the plate to defend Christians, establish traditional morality on the world stage, and stop the collapse of civilization that has already gripped "the west." This, despite having obviously no first-hand knowledge of Russia whatsoever.

I know a few Russians who've moved to the US, who miss their homeland but for various reasons, would not want to go back.

So...since all I ever hear is through the usual news, who can't be trusted to report correctly on things happening in my own town, much less across the world...

- Is Putin really the fire-breathing monster he's made out to be, who throws female rock stars into prison for a year simply for "peacefully demonstrating" against his policies?

- Conversely, is he the new Constantine who is boldly leading Christian values back into global civilization, as some others seem to think? (Basing this mostly on his speaking out in defense of Syrian Christians recently).

- Any sense of how much of Russia's Orthodox population really believes Orthodoxy, vs. how much it's just part of the cultural fabric? What's the difference between, say, Orthodox in Russia, and so many Evangelicals in the "Bible Belt" of America? Or the Anglicans in 18th Century England, when Methodists and other groups were springing up to protest the lax superficiality of their national church?

- How about education in Russia? Is it fundamentally different from various American approaches? Are high school grads in Russia better or worse educated (at least in terms of factual knowledge) than their European or American counterparts? Is there an emphasis in Russia on cultural and moral foundations, or is it very job-market driven?

Just thought I'd start a discussion. Merry Christmas!

 

[seashale76]

nm

 

[buzuxi02]

I know we have a few regulars who are living there, or have lived. I wonder, because I sense a bit of "Rusaphilia" (is that a word?) among some Orthodox lately, mostly converts, who have latched onto the idea that Russia has stepped up to the plate to defend Christians, establish traditional morality on the world stage, and stop the collapse of civilization that has already gripped "the west." This, despite having obviously no first-hand knowledge of Russia whatsoever.

I cant add anything to the first hand knowledge of Russia, never being there. I certainly don't think Russia can establish traditional morality, from what I understand Russia has its own social problems. But I am glad that Putin has stepped up to the plate and put the beta male leaders of the west in their place concerning their insatiable appetite for homosexuality. Being that Russia is a large country and a player on the world stage, its good that their leader is showing the world what an alpha male is.

I know a few Russians who've moved to the US, who miss their homeland but for various reasons, would not want to go back.

From my experience Russians are the ideal American immigrants. Not only have I never met Russians that want to go back, I haven't met many Russians that like being Russian! There are section in NY with many Russians yet you wouldn't know it, they wave no Russian flags, there kids don't speak Russian and some have severed relations with their Russian relatives back home.

This is complete night and day with greeks, who mostly view themselves as sojourners, hang greek flags from their businesses, own properties in Greece, and have even named a few streets here in USA after places in Greece or other greek words to remind themselves of back home.

- Is Putin really the fire-breathing monster he's made out to be, who throws female rock stars into prison for a year simply for "peacefully demonstrating" against his policies?

While things in Russia and by extension the way things Putin does things would not fly in the west, Russia never has patterned themselves after that paradigm. Most is a product of the western media's and the wests political leaders propaganda. We see it in Syria and Ukraine where the west supports the opposition yet this opposition is no better, in fact all the evidence suggests their worst.
The female rock stars is the proof. In European countries people are in jail for holocaust denial, freedom of speech does not exist, just go to Germany and publicly praise the Nazis. So jailing some females who trespassed, exposed themselves in public and blasphemed in a church isn't strange. In fact they are laws against that here in America. What do you think would of happened if they did that in a mosque in Britain blaspheming Muhammed?

Furthermore Ive always found all Slavic women (san Serbian) to be beyond strange. I really don't know how anyone wants to date them. For me this rock group is typical behavior for Russian women.

- Any sense of how much of Russia's Orthodox population really believes Orthodoxy, vs. how much it's just part of the cultural fabric? What's the difference between, say, Orthodox in Russia, and so many Evangelicals in the "Bible Belt" of America? Or the Anglicans in 18th Century England, when Methodists and other groups were springing up to protest the lax superficiality of their national church?

Ive seen a recent poll that suggests Russian church attendance is up at about 6 %. Even the low end of 3-4% is higher than any northern European country and on par with most European countries. As you can see most westerners criticize low church attendance in Russia when its higher than their own. There so immersed in propaganda that they need to heed the parable which says to remove the log in your own eye before taking it out of your neighbors.
The rest can be answered by those living there.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I dunno cause I have never been there, but I imagine both the good and the bad we think of when we think of the Russian political scene is inflated. prolly somewhere in the middle.

I do wonder how beluga caviar tastes though....

 

[Ignatius21]

Thanks everyone!

Surely there must be someone on this forum who lives in Russia...

 

[ArmyMatt]

Thanks everyone!

Surely there must be someone on this forum who lives in Russia...

rus.........? I think you been called.........

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

LOL! I was about to post the same thing and brother Matt beat me to it! When it comes to being an expert in "Russian stuff," Rusmeister is our guy. If they need a Seinfeld quote, call in Matt and Gurney!

rus.........? I think you been called.........

 

[rusmeister]

...living in Russia these days?

I know we have a few regulars who are living there, or have lived. I wonder, because I sense a bit of "Rusaphilia" (is that a word?) among some Orthodox lately, mostly converts, who have latched onto the idea that Russia has stepped up to the plate to defend Christians, establish traditional morality on the world stage, and stop the collapse of civilization that has already gripped "the west." This, despite having obviously no first-hand knowledge of Russia whatsoever.

I know a few Russians who've moved to the US, who miss their homeland but for various reasons, would not want to go back.

So...since all I ever hear is through the usual news, who can't be trusted to report correctly on things happening in my own town, much less across the world...

- Is Putin really the fire-breathing monster he's made out to be, who throws female rock stars into prison for a year simply for "peacefully demonstrating" against his policies?

- Conversely, is he the new Constantine who is boldly leading Christian values back into global civilization, as some others seem to think? (Basing this mostly on his speaking out in defense of Syrian Christians recently).

- Any sense of how much of Russia's Orthodox population really believes Orthodoxy, vs. how much it's just part of the cultural fabric? What's the difference between, say, Orthodox in Russia, and so many Evangelicals in the "Bible Belt" of America? Or the Anglicans in 18th Century England, when Methodists and other groups were springing up to protest the lax superficiality of their national church?

- How about education in Russia? Is it fundamentally different from various American approaches? Are high school grads in Russia better or worse educated (at least in terms of factual knowledge) than their European or American counterparts? Is there an emphasis in Russia on cultural and moral foundations, or is it very job-market driven?

Just thought I'd start a discussion. Merry Christmas!

Hiya, Iggy!
I am an American who has moved to Russia, who misses my homeland but for various reasons, but would not want to go back.[bless and do not curse]

A Russophile is a non-Russian who digs things Russian, and yes, it is a word.

Very good call on distrusting the news. The news NEVER shows normal life anywhere; it's raison d'etre is to report abnormal life.

I think you are quite right that it is fashionable among American Orthodox to overestimate the aspects of Russia we see in exaggerated form in the news, seeing Russia as "Orthodox" and its leader as a "savior". These things are RELATIVELY true, relative to us, anyway, having an anti-Christian president and a nation that has clearly fallen away from faith. And yes, I think American Orthodox Christians commit the sin of completely whitewashing Putin to conform to what we wish were true.

I think you already know that the dichotomy you've sketched of Putin is untrue on both sides. Pretty much all leaders of countries widely though erroneously believed to be democratic are opportunist, and I think hardly any would take a principled stand against the plutocracies that really rule them. I think that if, say, there were a Communist upsurge in Russia, Putin or his successor would fly Communist colors, which is not much different from Obama's "evolving" views on morality and truth. So we are lucky that right now he backs the Church, but I could imagine that ending. Still, the fact that the mess in Syria was planned and instigated in the West (I remember them openly planning it when Syria was still at peace), and the fact that homosexuality really IS unnatural make it easy for him to take stands against them with popular support.

How many serious Orthodox believers? Yeah, 6-10% sounds about right. But there are perhaps as many as there are Muslims and non-Orthodox Christians. The majority nowadays wears a cross and sees the religion as a cultural thing - nominalism. Maybe a third of those show up at church at Easter and Christmas, and many of those only to watch the procession of the Cross; they leave before the Liturgy begins. So it's really a gross exaggeration to think of the country as actually Orthodox. (It is nice to see Orthodox chapels in the major airports, though.)

The general design of the public schools comes from 19th-century Prussia and is the same over most of the world now, but differs in product based on the philosophy behind the education, a thing undiscussed in our time.The Soviets used that design to push scientific knowledge based on the truth they professed in Marxism, resulting in their successes in the sciences. Even today, they will still out-perform Americans, who have positively the worst system in the world thanks to the philosophy of pluralist relativism driving ours.

"This, despite having obviously no first-hand knowledge of Russia whatsoever. "

Exactly.
Probably the chief malaise of our time is imagining that our very thin smattering of education qualifies us to have opinions on everything. Not that I think we can't think about things and have opinions; just that many of us tend to try to "opinionate" authoritatively about any topic that comes up, regardless of experience and actual knowledge, the corollary being a disdain for actual knowledge and experience, something I have experienced even here.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Not sure to whom this is referencing, but if it is me, I hope you'll forgive me, Rus.

just that many of us tend to try to "opinionate" authoritatively about any topic that comes up, regardless of experience and actual knowledge, the corollary being a disdain for actual knowledge and experience, something I have experienced even here.

 

[rusmeister]

Not sure to whom this is referencing, but if it is me, I hope you'll forgive me, Rus.

No, not picking on anybody specific, Gurney. I had someone denigrating my knowledge of Chesterton when I had been studying him for several years and it was clear that she had only read a book or two. On these few things, education (especially the history of), GKC, and Russia I do think I really know something. On the mass of other topics raised here, I'm just an average bear or even ignoramus. That's why I don't say much on so many threads, because I am really an amateur dilettante.
It's on the things you have given your life to, that you know most only have a very surface experience with, that you will be irritated when such people treat your opinion in those things as equal to all others.