Religious traditions that cause OCD

[cloudyday2]

Religious obsessive compulsive disorder is called scrupulosity (for anybody who doesn't already know that).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scrupulosity

Mostly I read about scrupulosity in Christianity, but I have wondered if it might be a problem in other religions. For example, Islam requires Muslims to pray five times per day, and apparently the Quran regulates all kinds of behaviors such as sleeping, eating, washing, etc. Baha'i behavior is apparently heavily regulated just like Islam. I have heard that some forms of Judaism have prayers and hand washing ceremonies before every meal.

One big feature of scrupulosity seems to be feelings of guilt for having not done something properly (not prayed the Rosary properly, not confessed properly, etc.).

So I've wondered if there are certain religions that are worse than others for a person with OCD tendencies.

 

[gord44]

Islam would be tough for a person with OCD problems I reckon. I tried Islam twice. The first time my OCD was a bit worse and messing up a prayer would be brutal as I would have to start over or add another rakat (round). Same with doing the ablutions. The second time I tried Islam my OCD was pretty much defeated so I would just ignore most small errors and move on. But Islam does have quite a few rules per see when it comes to prayer and ablutions that might give a person with OCD some trouble for sure.

 

[seashale76]

A friend of mine has this problem. Religion did not cause her scrupulosity though. She was already like that. She has had to undergo a lot of therapy and our priest is aware of her issues as well. She needs constant reminders that her mindset regarding things like fasting (which we do a lot of in Orthodoxy) isn't healthy or what is intended.

 

[seashale76]

Islam would be tough for a person with OCD problems I reckon. I tried Islam twice. The first time my OCD was a bit worse and messing up a prayer would be brutal as I would have to start over or add another rakat (round). Same with doing the ablutions. The second time I tried Islam my OCD was pretty much defeated so I would just ignore most small errors and move on. But Islam does have quite a few rules per see when it comes to prayer and ablutions that might give a person with OCD some trouble for sure.

I don't mean to be crass, but is it true that farting can invalidate your prayers in Islam? Someone with GI issues would be up a creek without a paddle, if so.

 

[cloudyday2]

A common problem for people with Christian backgrounds seems to be "the unforgivable sin", "selling your soul to the devil", etc. I've met a lot of people on forums who have irrational guilt and worry of those things. One person found a bargain while buying a collectible item on the internet and became convinced that he had sold his soul to the devil.

When I was a Christian, I tried to pray various prayers several times per day (along with the Jesus Prayer) - ugh.

 

[gord44]

I don't mean to be crass, but is it true that farting can invalidate your prayers in Islam? Someone with GI issues would be up a creek without a paddle, if so.

It doesn't really invalidate the prayers, but invalidates your state of ritual purity that you gained by performing wudu or ghusl. So in order to do your prayers after breaking wind, using the bathroom, etc you would have to perfrom wudu again. Since many Muslims perform wudu right before prayers anyways it's not a huge deal for a person with GI issues

 

[LoAmmi]

I haven't met anybody personally, but I've heard of some Jews having some issues with this. I would say that most rabbis I've ever met would agree that an honest mistake while doing something doesn't invalidate it or make it a sin. I remember a story I heard about prayer was that a man had learned the Hebrew alphabet but didn't know the prayers so he repeated the alphabet over and over again. When asked what he was doing, he said that he didn't know the words but knew that if he gave HaShem all the letters, HaShem would arrange them into the correct prayers. So, while there's a proper way to do things, I imagine most rabbis would tell someone suffering with this that HaShem understands.

 

[seashale76]

A common problem for people with Christian backgrounds seems to be "the unforgivable sin", "selling your soul to the devil", etc. I've met a lot of people on forums who have irrational guilt and worry of those things. One person found a bargain while buying a collectible item on the internet and became convinced that he had sold his soul to the devil.

When I was a Christian, I tried to pray various prayers several times per day (along with the Jesus Prayer) - ugh.

The idea is to pray the Jesus Prayer a lot. However, there are reasons why one is supposed to have a spiritual father. The type of thing you're talking about is one of them. It is considered spiritually dangerous to do certain prayer techniques without the instruction of a spiritual father.

I have been given a prayer rule to follow myself. However, my own issue is the exact opposite of scrupulosity, if such a thing exists. I find it difficult to follow my prayer rule (which is bare basics easy), fast, et cetera.

 

[seashale76]

I haven't met anybody personally, but I've heard of some Jews having some issues with this. I would say that most rabbis I've ever met would agree that an honest mistake while doing something doesn't invalidate it or make it a sin. I remember a story I heard about prayer was that a man had learned the Hebrew alphabet but didn't know the prayers so he repeated the alphabet over and over again. When asked what he was doing, he said that he didn't know the words but knew that if he gave HaShem all the letters, HaShem would arrange them into the correct prayers. So, while there's a proper way to do things, I imagine most rabbis would tell someone suffering with this that HaShem understands.

I had a teacher in high school that was an Orthodox Jew. She was the most amazing senior English teacher. She also taught German. She had type I diabetes and followed whatever fasts and dietary restrictions she was supposed to. Even though her rabbi specifically told her she was exempt from things due to her health issues, she didn't listen. The result was that the students actually kept candy on hand to help with her blood sugar, and we once had to call an ambulance for her.

Looking back, she likely had this scrupulosity problem. She died a few years back. She was a lovely woman.

 

[LoAmmi]

I had a teacher in high school that was an Orthodox Jew. She was the most amazing senior English teacher. She also taught German. She had type I diabetes and followed whatever fasts and dietary restrictions she was supposed to. Even though her rabbi specifically told her she was exempt from things due to her health issues, she didn't listen. The result was that the students actually kept candy on hand to help with her blood sugar, and we once had to call an ambulance for her.

Looking back, she likely had this scrupulosity problem. She died a few years back. She was a lovely woman.

Yeah, that is a problem. To be honest, her rabbi probably told her that by following it so exactly and putting her health in danger, she was actually sinning. We are not supposed to risk our health to keep the fasts and all that. Once during Yom Kippur I had a very serious illness and the rabbi told me that I was not to fast that day but eat the foods the doctor recommended. I also am required to take my seizure medication even on fast days.

 

[ananda]

I suspect that any religion or belief system which expects "righteousness as defined by rigid adherence to an external set of rules (laws)" would have higher incidences of OCD, whereas systems which emphasize "righteousness according to heart's intent" would have lower incidences of OCD.

 

[LoveBeingAMuslimah]

I don't have OCD but sometimes while driving, I'd say the traveling prayer more than once (especially if I'm surrounded by semis or had a close call). I made a conscious effort to stop doing that because I was afraid it would lead to OCD.

Anyway, isn't feeling guilty normal after you've done something wrong (e.g. sinning)?

 

[LoAmmi]

Anyway, isn't feeling guilty normal after you've done something wrong (e.g. sinning)?

I think we're talking about making a minor mistake in a ritual outside of your control. I'm not sure how your faith handles that, but I know in mine it wouldn't be a sin for the most part because it wasn't something you could control. I have trouble with speech sometimes and can't say a word correctly so when I say prayers I will sometimes have that happen. I'd like to think He understands.

 

[LoveBeingAMuslimah]

I think we're talking about making a minor mistake in a ritual outside of your control. I'm not sure how your faith handles that, but I know in mine it wouldn't be a sin for the most part because it wasn't something you could control. I have trouble with speech sometimes and can't say a word correctly so when I say prayers I will sometimes have that happen. I'd like to think He understands.

Unintentional mistakes generally aren't sins for us either. There are different rules if we make a mistake in prayer depending on the degree of the mistake and when you remember it but it's not considered a sin. Since you were talking about fasting in one of your previous posts, I'll use that example. If we accidentally eat or drink, our fast is still valid and whatever we ate/drank is actually considered a mercy from God. We are also not to fast if it (legitimately) jeopardizes our health (e.g. those who were at risk of serious health issues in Pakistan during the heatwave that ended up killing many during Ramadhan should not have been fasting).

 

[LoAmmi]

Unintentional mistakes generally aren't sins for us either. There are different rules if we make a mistake in prayer depending on the degree of the mistake and when you remember it but it's not considered a sin. Since you were talking about fasting in one of your previous posts, I'll use that example. If we accidentally eat or drink, our fast is still valid and whatever we ate/drank is actually considered a mercy from God. We are also not to fast if it (legitimately) jeopardizes our health (e.g. those who were at risk of serious health issues in Pakistan during the heatwave that ended up killing many during Ramadhan should not have been fasting).

Yeah, it's usually legitimate health concerns. In the case of my illness, the doctor believed that if I fasted with it I was putting myself in serious risk of a furthering the illness and raising the chance for an epileptic seizure. Neither were very good.

Pregnant women have an automatic pass, no questions asked.

 

[Red Fox]

I worried all the time when I was still a Christian and compulsive about certain things.

I worried if I was truly saved or not. I worried if I committed the unforgivable sin or not.

I worried a lot and I was a nervous wreck almost all the time.

 

[LoveBeingAMuslimah]

For example, Islam requires Muslims to pray five times per day, and apparently the Quran regulates all kinds of behaviors such as sleeping, eating, washing, etc. Baha'i behavior is apparently heavily regulated just like Islam. .

Islam would be tough for a person with OCD problems I reckon. I tried Islam twice. The first time my OCD was a bit worse and messing up a prayer would be brutal as I would have to start over or add another rakat (round). Same with doing the ablutions. The second time I tried Islam my OCD was pretty much defeated so I would just ignore most small errors and move on. But Islam does have quite a few rules per see when it comes to prayer and ablutions that might give a person with OCD some trouble for sure.

Islaam is a way of life...but it's not that difficult.

"...Allaah intends for you ease and does not intend for you hardship..." (Surah al-Baqarah 2:185)

"...He has chosen you and has not placed upon you in the religion any difficulty...." (Surah al-Hajj 22:78)

The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “Religion is easy, and no one overburdens himself in his religion but he will be unable to continue in that way. So do not be extremists, but try to be near perfection and receive the good tidings that you will be rewarded. Gain strength by worshipping in the mornings and afternoons and during the last hours of the night.” [Saheeh al-Bukhaari & Muslim]

Commentary on the hadeeth, "No one overburdens himself in his religion but he will be unable to continue in that way"

He also said, "O `Abdullah! Have I not been informed that you fast all the day and stand in prayer all night?" I said, "Yes, O Allaah's Messenger!" He said, "Do not do that! Observe the fast sometimes and also leave them (the fast) at other times; stand up for the prayer at night and also sleep at night. Your body has a right over you, your eyes have a right over you, and your wife has a right over you." [Saheeh al-Bukhaari]

(this refers to voluntary fasts and prayers, not the obligatory ones)

 

[gord44]

Yes. I didn't find Islam that difficult, just some OCD issues is all at one point with the prayers and ablutions.

 

[LoveBeingAMuslimah]

Oh, and here's another narration:

A man from Najd with unkempt hair came to Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) and we heard his loud voice but could not understand what he was saying, till he came near and then we came to know that he was asking about Islam. Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) said, "You have to offer prayers perfectly five times in a day and night (24 hours)." The man asked, "Is there any more (praying)?" Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) replied, "No, but if you want to offer the Nawafil prayers (you can)." Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) further said to him: "You have to observe fasts during the month of Ramadan." The man asked, "Is there any more fasting?" Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) replied, "No, but if you want to observe the Nawafil fasts (you can.)" Then Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) further said to him, "You have to pay the Zakat (obligatory charity)." The man asked, "Is there any thing other than the Zakat for me to pay?" Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) replied, "No, unless you want to give alms of your own." And then that man retreated saying, "By Allaah! I will neither do less nor more than this." Allaah's Messenger (ﷺ) said, "If what he said is true, then he will be successful (i.e. he will be granted Paradise)." [Saheeh al-Bukhaari]

 

[cloudyday2]

Here is something I found about Islam and scrupulosity
http://mentalhealth4muslims.com/201...disorder-and-scrupulosity-in-islam/#&panel1-6

I have a feeling that many people are not aware of scrupulosity, so the people with this problem go undiagnosed. If a mentally healthy Muslim is supposed to pray five times per day (with repeats for mistakes), then the OCD Muslim will seem to be merely trying his/her best.