Partakers of Christ's Nature

[Cross Reference]

Proof to whom?

"To thine own self, be true". So lets not obfuscate the issue. How do you even know you have been saved?

 

[ticker]

RND,


He is to be our pattern.
No He is our life. Patterns are for copycats. You're a copycat.




The grace of Christ must mold the entire being
The grace of Christ is not dependent on us, otherwise it would be called "the grace of us".
So you use Christian-speak, but you mean something quite other. Watch below for proof of this.....




God works, and man works, that man may be one with Christ as Christ is one with God.
Proof that your "grace of Christ" is really a disguised "man tries hard".
Only God works, thus it is commanded "be still and know that I am God".




Then we sit together with Christ in heavenly places.
Perhaps for you it is future tense, but the born-again believer already sits there. "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:". Note the present perfect tense.




Each person must obtain an experience for himself.
The old man can never become the new man of his own volition, otherwise he were already the new man by virtue of having the same desire as the new man.
No rather, the old man must be crucified by God, and the new man raised in his place. This has not occurred in your life, which is why you speak of the new man as a revamped old man.





When it all boils down, what you have said is simply "try to be a good person, and attach the name "Christ" to your efforts." Anyone can do that. Most religious people do. Being born again, however, is something entirely different, and will remain a mystery to you.

....ahhhh. So good to hear the Gospel among all this confusion.

 

[Cross Reference]

....ahhhh. So good to hear the Gospel among all this confusion.

Gospel according to who?

 

[Stryder06]

....ahhhh. So good to hear the Gospel among all this confusion.

You're kidding right?

 

[ticker]

You're kidding right?

No. Why?

 

[Stryder06]

RND,


He is to be our pattern.
No He is our life. Patterns are for copycats. You're a copycat.

Are you seriously trying to disagree just for the sake of disagreeing? Was Jesus a copycat? Didn't He say that He did only that which He saw His Father do? He also said that He only spoke those things which His Father told Him to speak. Did that make Him a puppet as well?

The grace of Christ must mold the entire being
The grace of Christ is not dependent on us, otherwise it would be called "the grace of us".
So you use Christian-speak, but you mean something quite other. Watch below for proof of this.....

Grace is given to all but only accepted by some, thus grace is dependent on us. If it weren't than everyone would be saved no matter what decision they made as to whom they choose to serve.

God works, and man works, that man may be one with Christ as Christ is one with God.
Proof that your "grace of Christ" is really a disguised "man tries hard".
Only God works, thus it is commanded "be still and know that I am God".

Faith without works is dead. That's biblical. You're totally missing the point. Are you trying to be disagreeable just for the sake of it? Did not Christ tell those that followed Him that if they didn't believe Him because of what He said, to at least believe Him because what He had done?

There is a huge difference between working because you are saved, and working to be saved.

Then we sit together with Christ in heavenly places.
Perhaps for you it is future tense, but the born-again believer already sits there. "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:". Note the present perfect tense.

So now you're arguing over semantics. She is saying the same thing. Only when the believe moves into a relationship with Christ does s/he sit with Him in heavenly places. Have a form of godliness but denying the power thereof doesn't cut it. Simply saying you're a Christian doesn't mean you are, and simply thinking you are in heavenly places with Christ doesn't mean you are. By their fruits you shall know them.

Each person must obtain an experience for himself.
The old man can never become the new man of his own volition, otherwise he were already the new man by virtue of having the same desire as the new man.
No rather, the old man must be crucified by God, and the new man raised in his place. This has not occurred in your life, which is why you speak of the new man as a revamped old man.

Again, you're missing the point. Can your experience with God save me? Can my experience with God save my sister? Can her's save her best friend? No! Each one must pick up his own cross and follow Him. For your old man to die you must decide for yourself to allow Christ to bury your old nature.

When it all boils down, what you have said is simply "try to be a good person, and attach the name "Christ" to your efforts." Anyone can do that. Most religious people do. Being born again, however, is something entirely different, and will remain a mystery to you.

When it all boils down, what you're saying is that he said ""try to be a good person, and attach the name "Christ" to your efforts."" This couldn't be further from the truth. Being born again is a process. You don't go down into the water, come up and boom! Perfect in Christ Jesus!

Justification, Sanctification, Glorification. It's a process. You are justified by Christ, sanctified throughout your life by Him, and than glorified by Him when He returns. All of this however is dependent on your cooperation with Him. You can elect to be lost, and there is no amount of grace in the world that can change that decision. You have to want God to work the change in you, and once you do it's not about sitting on your couch and waiting for the change to occur like a caterpillar in a cocoon, waiting to become a butterfly.

 

[Stryder06]

No. Why?

NM, lest I break forum rules. My above post shows what I'm thinking.

 

[Cross Reference]

Why should anyone who claims the Name of Christ not expect to be treated like a son? But then, I don't believe the church realizes what son-ship is all about and that it is a growth process. That is tragic.

For that matter many don't even believe we have to overcome anything after we are saved. That is pathetic.

 

[pdudgeon]

MOD HAT ON

Excuse me for a minute, but can y'all just step back and take a breather for a minute here? The thread is on "Partakers of Christ's Nature" and it would be very good to see some examples of that nature in the posting.

please remember the following rules and correct your posting from here on out.

Messages posted to this board must be polite and free of personal attacks, threats, and crude or sexually-explicit language, rude comments and innuendo.

and

Disruptive Behavior
You will not disrupt the peace and harmony of the site. Disruptive behavior includes, but is not limited to, the rehashing of alleged grievances or disputes; publicly complaining about posts or threads submitted in forums throughout the site; or ranting about Christian Forums or its staff.

mod hat off.

 

[RND]

Thank you Pdudgeon.....just exactly what this thread needed.

 

[RND]

[FONT=times new roman,new york,times,serif] I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me; that ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Luke 22:29, 30. {AG 67.1}

What a promise is this! Christ's faithful ones are to be sharers with Him in the kingdom He has received from His Father. This is a spiritual kingdom, in which those who are most active in serving their brethren are the greatest. Christ's servants, under His direction, are to administer the affairs of His kingdom. They are to eat and drink at His table, that is, be admitted to near communion with Him. {AG 67.2}

Those who search for worldly distinction and glory make a sad mistake. It is the one who denies self, giving to others the preference, who will sit nearest to Christ on His throne. He who reads the heart sees the true merit possessed by His lowly, self-sacrificing disciples, and because they are worthy He places them in positions of distinction, though they do not realize their worthiness and do not seek for honor. . . . {AG 67.3}

God places no value on outward display or boasting. Many who in this life are looked upon as superior to others, will one day see that God values men according to their compassion and self-denial. . . . Those who follow the example of Him who went about doing good, who help and bless their fellow men, trying always to lift them up, are in God's sight infinitely higher than the selfish ones who exalt themselves. {AG 67.4}

God does not accept men because of their capabilities, but because they seek His face, desiring His help. God sees not as man sees. He judges not from appearances. He searches the heart, and judges righteously. . . . {AG 67.5}

He accepts and communes with His lowly, unpretentious followers; for in them He sees the most precious material, which will stand the test of storm and tempest, heat and pressure. Our object in working for the Master should be that His name may be glorified in the conversion of sinners. . . . {AG 67.6}

Let us rejoice that the Lord does not measure the workers in His vineyard by their learning or by the educational advantages they have had. The tree is judged by its fruit. The Lord will cooperate with those who cooperate with Him. {AG 67.7}
[/FONT]

 

[ticker]

Are you seriously trying to disagree just for the sake of disagreeing? Was Jesus a copycat? Didn't He say that He did only that which He saw His Father do? He also said that He only spoke those things which His Father told Him to speak. Did that make Him a puppet as well?

No, not a puppet....but He did all this by abiding (...the very same thing He's asked us to do).

Grace is given to all but only accepted by some, thus grace is dependent on us. If it weren't than everyone would be saved no matter what decision they made as to whom they choose to serve.

But......it's grace that saved you. You didn't save yourself. God's contunued grace is as much dependant on us as was our initial salvation (...not at all).

Faith without works is dead. That's biblical. You're totally missing the point. Are you trying to be disagreeable just for the sake of it? Did not Christ tell those that followed Him that if they didn't believe Him because of what He said, to at least believe Him because what He had done?

There is a huge difference between working because you are saved, and working to be saved.

That's right....faith without works IS dead. That verse isn't saying we have to do works to somehow prove/warrant/honour our faith, it's just plainly saying that the absence of works is an indication of a dead faith (...a non-existent one, 'cause even the demons believe ).

So now you're arguing over semantics. She is saying the same thing. Only when the believe moves into a relationship with Christ does s/he sit with Him in heavenly places. Have a form of godliness but denying the power thereof doesn't cut it. Simply saying you're a Christian doesn't mean you are, and simply thinking you are in heavenly places with Christ doesn't mean you are. By their fruits you shall know them.

I don't see what he's saying as semantics...it actually makes ALL the difference between accepting what the Bible says you are in Christ (...and acting out of that), and trying to be what the Bible says you are in Christ (...and consequently failing to act accordingly).

Again, you're missing the point. Can your experience with God save me? Can my experience with God save my sister? Can her's save her best friend? No! Each one must pick up his own cross and follow Him. For your old man to die you must decide for yourself to allow Christ to bury your old nature.

......He already has. Our old nature was crucified (...and buried) with Him on the cross.

When it all boils down, what you're saying is that he said ""try to be a good person, and attach the name "Christ" to your efforts."" This couldn't be further from the truth. Being born again is a process. You don't go down into the water, come up and boom! Perfect in Christ Jesus!

Justification, Sanctification, Glorification. It's a process. You are justified by Christ, sanctified throughout your life by Him, and than glorified by Him when He returns. All of this however is dependent on your cooperation with Him. You can elect to be lost, and there is no amount of grace in the world that can change that decision. You have to want God to work the change in you, and once you do it's not about sitting on your couch and waiting for the change to occur like a caterpillar in a cocoon, waiting to become a butterfly.

....but who says God (...by His Grace) would just allow you to feel content sitting on your couch doing nothing?

(....that's the whole point right there).

Peace

 

[Cross Reference]

What is {AG 67.1, 2, 6, 7}??

 

[Stryder06]

No, not a puppet....but He did all this by abiding (...the very same thing He's asked us to do).


But......it's grace that saved you. You didn't save yourself. God's contunued grace is as much dependant on us as was our initial salvation (...not at all).



That's right....faith without works IS dead. That verse isn't saying we have to do works to somehow prove/warrant/honour our faith, it's just plainly saying that the absence of works is an indication of a dead faith (...a non-existent one, 'cause even the demons believe ).


I don't see what he's saying as semantics...it actually makes ALL the difference between accepting what the Bible says you are in Christ (...and acting out of that), and trying to be what the Bible says you are in Christ (...and consequently failing to act accordingly).


......He already has. Our old nature was crucified (...and buried) with Him on the cross.


....but who says God (...by His Grace) would just allow you to feel content sitting on your couch doing nothing

(....that's the whole point).

Peace

Because I agree with everything you said I don't see how one can disagree with the OP. (Perhaps because I have more experience with her writings I'm able to infer what she doesn't out rightly say).

The point here is that one must be active in their walk with Christ to be able to partake of His nature, and by this we mean (at least as far as I can tell), be able to experience the power of God in one's life.

I apologize if I went on a tangent and disturbed the essence of this thread. I just get a little burned up when certain posts seem to lend themselves to the idea that all one has to do is say "I'm a Christian" and everything is all good. Such a way of thinking is a deception from the adversary. God works so hard to save us that I don't think we'll even understand the half of it once we're in heaven.

 

[Stryder06]

What is {AG 67.1, 2, 6, 7}??

"Amazing Grace" with the subsequent chapters or page numbers I'd assume.

 

[RND]

What is {AG 67.1, 2, 6, 7}??

God's Amazing Grace

By Ellen G. White

 

[ticker]

Because I agree with everything you said I don't see how one can disagree with the OP. (Perhaps because I have more experience with her writings I'm able to infer what she doesn't out rightly say).

The point here is that one must be active in their walk with Christ to be able to partake of His nature, and by this we mean (at least as far as I can tell), be able to experience the power of God in one's life.

I think the discrepancy is what "being active" in one's walk entails.

For myself, I'd say that it requires nothing more than for us to abondon ourselves to Christ, and then it is Him who motivates us into action (....not us having to motivate ourselves).

I apologize if I went on a tangent and disturbed the essence of this thread.

I didn't notice you do this.

I just get a little burned up when certain posts seem to lend themselves to the idea that all one has to do is say "I'm a Christian" and everything is all good.

....well, the preaching of the true Gospel of grace (which is what I think RTE did) can often be (mis)understod that way....but I don't think RTE was implying that at all.

Such a way of thinking is a deception from the adversary. God work
s so hard to save us that I don't think we'll even understand the half of it once we're in heaven.

I hope we understand it all.

Peace

 

[Stryder06]

I think the discrepancy is what "being active" in one's walk entails.

For myself, I'd say that it requires nothing more than for us to abondon ourselves to Christ, and then it is Him who motivates us into action (....not us having to motivate ourselves).

Again I agree. The thing is that it still involves action on our part. We don't take credit for the good we do for we know that it is Christ in us doing that good work. But we can't work if we don't put our hand to the plow.

I didn't notice you do this.

That's because feelings are hard to express over message boards. In my head I was jumping and screaming and fuming and all other sorts of foolishness

....well, the preaching of the true Gospel of grace (which is what I think RTE did) can often be (mis)understod that way....but I don't think RTE was implying that at all.

I disagree here. The true gospel of grace shows us how it works with the law, not how it somehow managed to abolish it. If the law were no more we'd not need grace for there'd be no standard for us to be held against.

I hope we understand it all.

Peace

I think we'll never get a full understanding of the goodness of God. Eternity isn't long enough.