NYC Satanists Want to Erect Monument Next to OK's 10 Commandments

[KarateCowboy]

Prove it.

It's provable, just not over the web.

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[Sistrin]

You don't have to take it on faith. I can, in principle, produce evidence that either increases or decreases your confidence in the claim "Archaeopteryx loves his mother."

I can produce evidence which either increases or decreases your confidence in the claim God exist. However it will never constitute "proof" in the context demanded by the playground argument.

That you cannot know for certain because you are unable to access my private thoughts does not mean that you cannot, in principle, mount a reasonable case for either that I do or do not love my mother.

I can mount a reasonable case for almost anything. Doesn't make it so. KC stated satan was a real person. You shot back demanding proof. Why make that demand, unless you were attempting to illustrate the obvious? KC can't prove the existence of either God or the devil any more than you can prove you love your mother.

Stamp your feet all you want.

Red-herring brought up on your part.

It is a counter-point, one you obviously don't want to deal with, thus all the whining.

 

[KarateCowboy]

I can produce evidence which either increases or decreases your confidence in the claim God exist. However it will never constitute "proof" in the context demanded by the playground argument.

I can mount a reasonable case for almost anything. Doesn't make it so. KC stated satan was a real person. You shot back demanding proof. Why make that demand, unless you were attempting to illustrate the obvious? KC can't prove the existence of either God or the devil any more than you can prove you love your mother.

Stamp your feet all you want.

It is a counter-point, one you obviously don't want to deal with, thus all the whining.

Well, proving Satan is possible. Problem is he's only one guy on this big planet, so he's kind of hard to pin down

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[Archaeopteryx]

I can produce evidence which either increases or decreases your confidence in the claim God exist. However it will never constitute "proof" in the context demanded by the playground argument.



I can mount a reasonable case for almost anything. Doesn't make it so. KC stated satan was a real person. You shot back demanding proof. Why make that demand, unless you were attempting to point out the obvious? KC can't prove the existence of either God or the devil any more than you can prove you love your mother.

Stamp your feet all you want.

I already told you that there are ways in which I could demonstrate that I love my mother. I could, in principle, mount such a case, drawing on various sources of evidence that bear upon the question. I'm asking whether you are willing and able to do the same.

It is a counter-point, one you obviously don't want to deal with, thus all the whining.

But I have dealt with it.

 

[super animator]

It is a counter-point, one you obviously don't want to deal with,

But I did, by point it out that it's a red herring.

thus all the whining.

I am not whining, stop projecting.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Satan is a person whose nature is evil.

Satan is a character who has been co-opted by Christians to personify evil

But Satan is an actual person.

Oh, my..... this just gets more and more adorable.

Well, you started throwing around relativism. Relativism is intellectually infantile and self-refuting, so the discussion was doomed at that point. You're probably just not used to having it thrown right back at you. You claim that it's sad, but you're pointing the finger at a mirror. Finally, you can claim that what I wrote is sad, but without the authority to enforce that claim it's just noise.

Actually, "relativism" was your rabbit trail, not mine, but I do agree that rational discussion on the matter is more or less a lost cause at this point.

Gotten any Satanists to listen to you yet, by the way?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Anyone else finding it as amusing as I am how much effort is being put in, by Christians, no less, to defend Satan's character and protect his reputation?

 

[Ishraqiyun]

OK well Satan comes from Judaism and Christianity, so they're going to have to get their own evil guy. You can't go in and say the symbol of evil isn't the symbol of evil.

Seems like you are assuming he is a fictional character and can thus belong to the religion that made him up. Did they take out a copyright when they invented him?

 

[TLK Valentine]

Seems like you are assuming he is a fictional character and can thus belong to the religion that made him up. Did they take out a copyright when they invented him?

Indeed -- KC is trying to have it both ways -- either Satan is a symbol, and that symbol's meaning is a matter of interpretation, or Satan is a person who speaks for himself, thankyouverymuch.

 

[KarateCowboy]

Satan is a character who has been co-opted by Christians to personify evil

Oh, my..... this just gets more and more adorable.

Actually, "relativism" was your rabbit trail, not mine, but I do agree that rational discussion on the matter is more or less a lost cause at this point.

Gotten any Satanists to listen to you yet, by the way?

Your condescension is palpable. If that's what you really think of Christianity then I wonder why you are frequenting these forums.

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[1Feather]

But Satan is an actual person.

An actual being, not human as we know human. This is the belief system held by those that are "theistic Satanists". A literal being named Satan is what they worship.

Not to be confused with atheistic Satanists, like the LaVey hedonists. Or with spiritual Satanists that believe Satan is a spirit, metaphor, allegory, in literature and reality.

 

[KarateCowboy]

An actual being, not human as we know human. This is the belief system held by those that are "theistic Satanists". A literal being named Satan is what they worship.

That's what I meant when I said person. You're right about those Levey types. They're better described as hedonists

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[keith99]

Here's a .pdf of the original legislation. The only language I see in it that could be construed as allowing, much less forcing the Leg to place other monuments is section 2 subsection D.
http://www.oklegislature.gov/cf_pdf/2009-10 FLR/hflr/HB1330 hflr.pdf

D. The placement of this monument shall not be construed to mean that the State of Oklahoma favors any particular religion or denomination thereof over others, but rather will be placed on the Capitol grounds where there are numerous other monuments.​

I just realized a major problem here.

Which 10 commandments it use?

Different denominations actually have different versions. The Catholics, Protestants and Jews are all different. The most obvious being that the Catholics omit that graven image bit and split out coveting into 2 commandments, one for wives and one for everything else.

Not sure what the Mormons do. Everyone else has it a wife singular, but they may have it plural!

Doh, 10 Commandments is in the Bible that means the Muslims have them too. Wonder how they parse it out.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Your condescension is palpable.

Ya think?

If that's what you really think of Christianity then I wonder why you are frequenting these forums.

Luckily I've encountered examples of Christianity who give me reason to stick around -- besides entertainment, that is.

 

[MachZer0]

Luckily I've encountered examples of Christianity who give me reason to stick around -- besides entertainment, that is.

You're welcome

 

[TLK Valentine]

You're welcome

Did you send me a Christmas card?

 

[MachZer0]

Did you send me a Christmas card?

If you have to ask, you must have not received it. Darn that post office

 

[KarateCowboy]

I read some commentary recently that made a good point. The evil people could put monuments up at their own places but they never do. They choose this spot because that way they can force it on people. If it weren't a matter of forcing people then there would be no point. After all, 'it does not matter what you are doing so much as you are forced to do it'. That's why leftists love tyrants like Che Guevara so much

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[Archaeopteryx]

I read some commentary recently that made a good point. The evil people could put monuments up at their own places but they never do. They choose this spot because that way they can force it on people. If it weren't a matter of forcing people then there would be no point. After all, 'it does not matter what you are doing so much as you are forced to do it'. That's why leftists love tyrants like Che Guevara so much

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Forum Runner. Pardon my brevity and spelling.

Projection much?

Christians could put monuments up at their own places also. Or did that just not occur to you?

 

[MachZer0]

Projection much?

Christians could put monuments up at their own places also. Or did that just not occur to you?

They do