News should be nuanced and intellectual, not loud and emotional

poolerboy0077

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Political commentator Cenk Uygur from The Young Turks recently wrote a piece for The New York Times' opinion pages declaring not only the demise of network news but offering us his reasons for it. Rather than think that the sinking ship of network news might be due to younger generations viewing less and less television as time progresses, he is convinced it is due instead to the way in which news is delivered. Whereas the established news media disseminate information—and I use the term 'information' here loosely—with blandness and neutral, pseudo-objectivity, newer mediums deliver it with fiery passion and zeal. Cenk argues that anchors and pundits must "show that [they] actually care about the news."

I agree with him to the extent that often you get journalists who merely inquire as to the positions of political figures without much of a challenge—like asking Coke and Pepsi their opinions on beverage supremacy and ending it with "I'm [so-and-so] reporting." The media are largely lazy, sensationalistic and conflict-driven because it gets more people glued to the television, and shows like The Daily Show With Jon Stewart have for over a decade and a half exposed it for what it is. But I disagree with Cenk that our news need to be loud and emotional.

I recognize that it's difficult to put out a quality product as a private network and get people engaged, since most seem to crave entertainment for virtually everything consumed. Shows like The Young Turks often have to put out a lot of mindless fluff and titillating sexual stories to get viewers hooked. When it's their turn to cover politics it's usually Cenk preaching to the choir, huffing and puffing his chest as he delivers a story with little to no nuance or fact-checking. This is no different than the garbage seen at CNN, MSNBC or FOX. Harvard professor Steven Pinker said recently: "I think our intellectual and journalistic culture has to become more evidence-based, data-oriented [and] quantitative. The current practice of journalism report a story, ask a person on the street their comments on the story, and then a columnist or pundit tells people how to emote with regard to the story. That's not a way to give people an accurate understanding of the world." Indeed. News coverage and analysis as currently presented by both the mainstream, established networks as well as in modern media are doing a disservice to the public. I'd even go so far as to place a large part of the blame for recent disastrous foreign and domestic policies on them (e.g., the Iraq war).

Discuss
 

dgiharris

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There is a lot of blame to go around concerning Today's news. Imo there are two big principle reasons driving how TV news is presented today:

#1) Advertisers

#2) American Viewing Public

Originally, the News was a contract between the 3 principle stations CBS, NBC, and ABC and the US government. The government would "allow" these stations to broadcast in exchange these stations would perform a public service known as "The News".

Somewhere over time The News fell into the ratings trap and ratings game and instead of being viewed as a "public service" now the News has to hit the same performance metrics as other shows on the Networks.

#2) The American public simply would rather watch blood and guts and emotional stories rather than boring fact based stories that have a much stronger impact on their lives. Rather than in depth coverage of important legislation or birddog accounting of crucial government agencies... instead we get celebrity trials and emotion laden stories based on 30 second sound bytes taken out of context. Through in the occasional War or Terror story and that's the news.

Both sides: Left and Right are guilty of the above.

So what is the fix?

#1) Well, you've got to decouple News from ratings and profit. The news is like Medicine and not all medicine is going to be cherry flavored and taste like ice cream. Sometimes the best medicine, the medicine you need to stay alive is going to taste like wet cat wrapped in garbage but that is just the way it is.

#2) The American public has to watch the news and hold our government accountable. The news doesn't mean anything if no one watches it and if there are no repercussions. The public needs to "react" to the news otherwise the News has no teeth. What is the point of screaming "the house is on fire" if no one hears it and calls the fire department
 
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jayem

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News should be nuanced and intellectual, not loud and emotional

Agree. That's why I mostly watch the PBS News Hour, which I think comes closer to doing that than any other network. And, of course, their ratings are miniscule, compared to the other news programs.
 
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cow451

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Agree. That's why I mostly watch the PBS News Hour, which I think comes closer to doing that than any other network. And, of course, their ratings are miniscule, compared to the other news programs.
:preach::thumbsup::amen:
 
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Oafman

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Agree. That's why I mostly watch the PBS News Hour, which I think comes closer to doing that than any other network. And, of course, their ratings are miniscule, compared to the other news programs.
When I lived in the US, I watched Fox and MSNBC for shouty fun, and I watched CSPAN for facts.
 
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leftrightleftrightleft

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"I think our intellectual and journalistic culture has to become more evidence-based, data-oriented [and] quantitative. The current practice of journalism report a story, ask a person on the street their comments on the story, and then a columnist or pundit tells people how to emote with regard to the story. That's not a way to give people an accurate understanding of the world."

News coverage and analysis as currently presented by both the mainstream, established networks as well as in modern media are doing a disservice to the public. I'd even go so far as to place a large part of the blame for recent disastrous foreign and domestic policies on them (e.g., the Iraq war).

Discuss

I largely agree but there are two problems:

1) Sensationalism sells. Profit-based news companies benefit from sensationalism and hurt from objective, "boring" analysis.

2) Any group can always shout "bias" if they disagree with the news channel. Even if a news channel was exceptionally objective, unbiased and well-reasoned, you would still have groups shouting "bias" simply because the analysis does not support their viewpoint.


In Canada we have the government-run CBC which, in my opinion, is less sensationalistic and biased compared to other private news companies simply because the profit-motive is partly removed. However, there is a large segment of the population which thinks the CBC has a liberal bias which seeks to bash the current Conservative government. Its hard to tell how much spin is being put on the news. Canada has also so far been unscathed from 24/7 news channels (although many people get US stations). I think 24/7 news is a huge part of the problem because it requires stations to "make" news and "make" things exciting which would otherwise not be newsworthy.
 
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bill5

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There is a lot of blame to go around concerning Today's news. Imo there are two big principle reasons driving how TV news is presented today:

#1) Advertisers

#2) American Viewing Public

Originally, the News was a contract between the 3 principle stations CBS, NBC, and ABC and the US government. The government would "allow" these stations to broadcast in exchange these stations would perform a public service known as "The News".

Somewhere over time The News fell into the ratings trap and ratings game and instead of being viewed as a "public service" now the News has to hit the same performance metrics as other shows on the Networks.

#2) The American public simply would rather watch blood and guts and emotional stories rather than boring fact based stories that have a much stronger impact on their lives. Rather than in depth coverage of important legislation or birddog accounting of crucial government agencies... instead we get celebrity trials and emotion laden stories based on 30 second sound bytes taken out of context. Through in the occasional War or Terror story and that's the news.

Both sides: Left and Right are guilty of the above.

So what is the fix?

#1) Well, you've got to decouple News from ratings and profit. The news is like Medicine and not all medicine is going to be cherry flavored and taste like ice cream. Sometimes the best medicine, the medicine you need to stay alive is going to taste like wet cat wrapped in garbage but that is just the way it is.

#2) The American public has to watch the news and hold our government accountable. The news doesn't mean anything if no one watches it and if there are no repercussions. The public needs to "react" to the news otherwise the News has no teeth. What is the point of screaming "the house is on fire" if no one hears it and calls the fire department
:thumbsup: :bow: Couldn't have said it better. I doubt anyone could. This is it exactly.

Sadly, there is no way and I do mean no way either "fix" is ever going to happen, at least not in our lifetimes. Our society is way too far down the road of knuckle-dragging immaturity and drama obsession and blissfully ignorant/uncaring about the increased blurring of fiction and reality which has been going on for decades. Cronkite is surely spinning if not vomiting in his grave.

Political commentator Cenk Uygur is a complete moron.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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How does someone working for The Young Turks have the audacity to say that news shouldn't be emotional?

I agree that it shouldn't, however, hearing this coming from The Young Turks program makes me thinks of pots & kettles...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmbHWFVMKrg


Watch the vid...

[SARCASM]No, Cenk Uygur isn't emotional loudmouth at all on his program[/SARCASM]

Sarcasm aside, I agree with the poster earlier that news should be decoupled from ratings.

Another thing that we need to do as well...we need to be able to make the distinction between legitimate news programs, and political commentary programs.

A lot of what people get fired up over is political commentary shows and confuse that with "News programs are going down the toilet".

I think we still have the same number of legitimate news broadcasts today that we had back in the day...however, there is a heck of a lot more political commentary shows than there were back then, and people falsely lump them all under the "news" blanket together and then make statements saying that "75% of the news out there is junk"
 
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Autumnleaf

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There is a lot of blame to go around concerning Today's news. Imo there are two big principle reasons driving how TV news is presented today:

#1) Advertisers

#2) American Viewing Public

Perhaps there is a #3. Maybe the owners of the major media outlets have an agenda of their own in how they present the news and what news they present to the public.
 
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I think alot are rejecting news and what not because more and more it's less about facts, and more about opinions. Just look at any big hot button issue, and the big trend of being unbiased means, you have 1 guy that believes the earth is round, and one guy that believes the earth is flat and let them duke it out, r refuse to call anyone when they spout nonsense.
 
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dgiharris

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I think alot are rejecting news and what not because more and more it's less about facts, and more about opinions. Just look at any big hot button issue, and the big trend of being unbiased means, you have 1 guy that believes the earth is round, and one guy that believes the earth is flat and let them duke it out, r refuse to call anyone when they spout nonsense.

I wish you were right, but I don't think so.

If you notice, the news shows that have less facts and more opinions have the higher ratings and most viewers.

If what you said was true, then BBC America would be the highest rated News Show in the country and it's not even close.
 
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bill5

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A lot of what people get fired up over is political commentary shows and confuse that with "News programs are going down the toilet".
Hardly. Take a look at the front page of any online news service. You vastly overestimate the news media and the general public. More and more it's this "stupid extremist person/group does outrageous thing!" and people rant and rave about how it was or wasn't, like some typed out online version of Jerry Springer/Maury Povich/Ricky Lake/ad nauseam show.

We have become as a society have become the low-life, mindless silliness we used to laugh at for how ridiculous and trashy it was. It's like we're morphing into a live version of the National Enquirer.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Hardly. Take a look at the front page of any online news service. You vastly overestimate the news media and the general public. More and more it's this "stupid extremist person/group does outrageous thing!" and people rant and rave about how it was or wasn't, like some typed out online version of Jerry Springer/Maury Povich/Ricky Lake/ad nauseam show.

We have become as a society have become the low-life, mindless silliness we used to laugh at for how ridiculous and trashy it was. It's like we're morphing into a live version of the National Enquirer.

Can you provide an example? Much like most of the "News programs" are actually political commentary, their web counterpart would fall in the similar genre. Which means that if you're looking at FoxNews website, or CNN's website, it's going to fall in the category of political commentary.

What the nightly news programs offer is ok, but it's he stuff on CNN, FOXNews, etc... that is junk.

People look at Nightly News and The O'reilly Factor and say "50% of the news is biased"... I say "The News is OK, 100% of the commentary shows are biased"
 
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Why rely on newspaper headlines, 20-second news bites and "angles", on AP/AFP/Reuters generic staff-written news releases that get recycled from newscaster to newscaster word by word over and over again, or on the pundit newstainment "takes"?

In the era of Internet, you don't have to rely on someone else's 15 second brief or 150-word interpretation or even on a three-page analytical essay of what the President of Russia or the President of the United States of America was supposedly saying in his 15-minute speech. You can read the transcript of the whole speech and judge for yourself. You can be your own informed journalist instead of outsourcing your information gathering to predigested, ready-to-wear opinions while complaining about the poor quality of modern journalism.
 
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dgiharris

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In the era of Internet, you don't have to rely on someone else's 15 second brief or 150-word interpretation or even on a three-page analytical essay of what the President of Russia or the President of the United States of America was supposedly saying in his 15-minute speech. You can read the transcript of the whole speech and judge for yourself. You can be your own informed journalist instead of outsourcing your information gathering to predigested, ready-to-wear opinions while complaining about the poor quality of modern journalism.

This is what gives me nightmares. For the record, I'm neither Republican or Democrat. What scares me more than anything is that a majority of Americans, does not come to conclusions themselves. They rely on their favorite pundits to tell them what to think. And these pundits have gotten very adept at shaping and crafting both emotions and thoughts. They will lie by omission, spin a truth here, conveniently misrepresent a fact there, roll it around in some emotion, then put it in the oven of righteous rage until it is just right and then spoon feed it to their audience and they digest it as pure 100% Gospel.

What absolutely terrifies me is that you can then show said person facts, sources, links that clearly refute their warped version of reality and yet they will not accept they are wrong.

Take for instance the latest thread by Interloper about Obama. In the thread he claims Obama said in a speech that the US owes its founding to Islam. I read the entire speech in no way shape or form does he even remotely claim anything like that. but Interloper listened to someone else's breakdown of the speech and that someone else said Obama said that, so as far as Interloper is concerned, that is what Obama said even though someone provided links for the speech...

rinse and repeat that a thousand times and that is the current mess we are in as a nation. A bunch of people running around immersed in warped twisted versions of reality...
 
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I largely agree but there are two problems:

1) Sensationalism sells. Profit-based news companies benefit from sensationalism and hurt from objective, "boring" analysis.
That's the problem. News should not be profit based.


2) Any group can always shout "bias" if they disagree with the news channel. Even if a news channel was exceptionally objective, unbiased and well-reasoned, you would still have groups shouting "bias" simply because the analysis does not support their viewpoint.


In Canada we have the government-run CBC which, in my opinion, is less sensationalistic and biased compared to other private news companies simply because the profit-motive is partly removed. However, there is a large segment of the population which thinks the CBC has a liberal bias which seeks to bash the current Conservative government. Its hard to tell how much spin is being put on the news. Canada has also so far been unscathed from 24/7 news channels (although many people get US stations). I think 24/7 news is a huge part of the problem because it requires stations to "make" news and "make" things exciting which would otherwise not be newsworthy.
I heard a story about a study. Two groups were shown a series of news clips. One group was pro Israeli, the other pro Palestinian. Both groups felt the stories were biased against them, despite watching the exact same stories. The moral I got from that story, Bias is in the eye of the beholder.
 
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dgiharris

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That's the problem. News should not be profit based.



I heard a story about a study. Two groups were shown a series of news clips. One group was pro Israeli, the other pro Palestinian. Both groups felt the stories were biased against them, despite watching the exact same stories. The moral I got from that story, Bias is in the eye of the beholder.

You should watch the ABC show What Would You Do

In it, they will have the same scenario but different actors playing in that scenario. Usually a white guy, a black guy, and a white woman. Even though the actors are all doing the exact same thing, peoples interpretation and or reactions will vary based on the actors' race or gender.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9odAuzz6kB0
 
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