More accurately labeled poll on Creationism vs. TE

Creationist vs TE vs Deist

  • Young Earth Creationist

  • Old Earth Creationist (what is that exactly?)

  • TE who believes that God plays an active role in the universe, even if it can't be detected in a lab

  • TE who does not believe God plays an active role in the universe (actually an oxymoron)

  • Deist (the more accurate label for the above belief)


Results are only viewable after voting.

Fascinated With God

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My dyslexia is kicking in. I misspelled "deist" as diest, twice...

Other:
I think God was able to set it up so He would get the results He wanted without needing to constantly make adjustments.
That would qualify as deism. The "clock maker" God who starts the universe rolling and is then hands off.
 
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Gottservant

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God is able to use His Spirit as a force with natural law properties.

But when we say God created the Universe, we do not mean His force was loose in the vacuum, we mean He used that force at times and places of His choosing.

This cannot be grasped by examining the force itself, but only by looking at the whole of what is created as a result, hence faith remains necessary.
 
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Fascinated With God

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Other:
I think God was able to set it up so He would get the results He wanted without needing to constantly make adjustments.
That would qualify as deism. The "clock maker" God who starts the universe rolling and is then hands off.

In Mark Kennedy's poll he referred to "strictly secondary causes". You sound like that describes your beliefs, which would be deism.
 
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Assyrian

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What about a watchmaker God outside time who not only makes the watch to fulfil his purposes but prepares the answers to the prayers of his people from before the foundation of the universe? Isaiah 65:24 Before they call I will answer.
 
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Papias

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Old earth creationists accept an earth significantly older than 6,000 years (they don't deny the evidence of an old earth), but deny that today's species were created by evolution (they do deny Universal Common Ancestry - UCA).


Perhaps a short description would be:

Old Earth Creationist (Earth may be millions or billions of years old, and God created animals in their present form, not using evolution).

This position has an interesting history.

Christian geologists found more and more evidence of an old earth in the late 1700s. By the early 1800's, this mounting evidence led to a raging debate among geologists about the age of the earth - specifically, whether the geologic features found were formed during a literal, global flood, or by geologic processes over at least millions of years.

The biggest proponant of "flood geology" was the Rev. Adam Sedgewick, who was an ordained minister, and the top geologist of is day. As more and more evidence clearly showed an old earth, Rev. Sedgewick found he had a harder and harder case to make to deny that evidence. He realized that he was simply wrong, and formally recanted flood geology in 1831 as his last statement as President of the Geological Society of London (the main geological society at that time).

A much more detailed history can be found at this Christian source, here: History of the Collapse of Flood Geology and a Young Earth


OK, notice that the reality of an old earth was accepted among those familiar with the evidence (all of whom were Christians) by 1840 - about a century before radioactive dating was discovered. When the later discovery of radioactivity gave us powerful and reliable methods to test this early Christian conclusion again, it was confirmed over and over.

With an the reality of an old earth already accepted, when Darwin's Origin of Species was published in 1859, the controversy centered on the creation account in Genesis. Because it was already settled that the earth was much older than a literal reading, many Christians held to an Old Earth Creationist view - denying evolution (which had only some evidence at the time) and accepting an old earth.

This was the case until the late 1800's, when more and more evidence for evolution (specifically for universal common ancestry - UCA) was piling up. By 1900 or so, UCA was accepted by biologists, paleontologists, etc. However, there was still a lot of fundamentalist based opposition - almost all of which was still from old earth creationists (who made up the majority of Christians). However, at this point, those Christians (who had previously held a justifiable position based on the evidence) needed to start denying evidence - because now there was clear evidence for UCA.

Around 1940 to 1950, radioactive dating provided another area of confirmation of an old earth. At the same time, fundamentalists were finding that they were rejecting massive evidence for UCA, while still accepting an old earth. If one is going to reject evidence, then why not also reject the evidence of an old earth, going back to a literalist position for both age of the earth and UCA? So more an more evidence deniers became Young Earth Creationists (YEC), and the numbers of OEC correspondingly decreased from 1940 until today.

So today, there are very few OECs, and almost all of those who deny evidence are YECs.

Papias
 
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Fascinated With God

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What about a watchmaker God outside time who not only makes the watch to fulfil his purposes but prepares the answers to the prayers of his people from before the foundation of the universe? Isaiah 65:24 Before they call I will answer.
You describe an active God, not a passive one, so that qualifies as the option most voted for by TE's.
 
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mark kennedy

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First of all, I'm a young earth creationist by default. In other words that is where I stand unless I have good reason not to and I've seen very few. I'm actually an old earth creationist because there is no reference to time in Genesis 1:1 and I'm convinced that the universe was created billions of years ago along with the earth, that was covered in darkness and water.

Now, the creation of life happened 6-8 thousand years ago exactly as described in Genesis 1. Fully formed, without precursors. I don't really have a category, I don't know what you would call it really, Old Earth creationist would be about the closest.

The issue at the heart of the controversy is simply whether God created life, that's really all the Scriptures address. Adam is our first parent and 6 days before his creation the earth was covered in darkness and water.
 
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Fascinated With God

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Adam is our first parent and 6 days before his creation the earth was covered in darkness and water.
Life did not begin with Adam. Living creatures in the water and birds in the air were created before man.
 
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