Discussion King David and King Saul

[ToBeLoved]

Yeah, David respected Saul because he was Yahweh's anointed (I Sam 22). But we don't mind posting our opinions of ministers and other folks we don't agree with - me included.

I believe that verse is talking about Saul being put by God into that position of authority. There are many verses that talk about how as Christians we are to live by the laws of our government.

Saul wasn't 'annointed' per se.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Yeah, David respected Saul because he was Yahweh's anointed (I Sam 22). But we don't mind posting our opinions of ministers and other folks we don't agree with - me included.

Talking about this whole 'annointed' and talking about ministers, I don't think their is anything wrong with it if we are talking about what they teach.

One who is a minister is to be ABOVE reproach in their conduct and with their lives. That is Biblical.

If a minister does not conduct themselves as the Bible instructs them to do when they take that position, then they know they are going to be under scrutiny.

Blind faith in a person because of their position can be a very ugly thing. Let's be real.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I believe that verse is talking about Saul being put by God into that position of authority. There are many verses that talk about how as Christians we are to live by the laws of our government.

Saul wasn't 'annointed' per se.

Then Samuel took a flask of olive oil and poured it on Saul’s head and kissed him, saying, “Has not the Lord anointed you ruler over his inheritance? (1 Samuel 10:1)

When all those who had formerly known him saw him prophesying with the prophets, they asked each other, “What is this that has happened to the son of Kish? Is Saul also among the prophets?” (1 Samuel 10:11)

He stripped off his garments, and he too prophesied in Samuel’s presence. He lay naked all that day and all that night. This is why people say, “Is Saul also among the prophets?” (1 Samuel 19:23-24)

Samuel said to Saul, “Why have you disturbed me by bringing me up?” “I am in great distress,” Saul said. “The Philistines are fighting against me, and God has departed from me. He no longer answers me, either by prophets or by dreams. So I have called on you to tell me what to do.” (1 Samuel 28:15)

For your consideration.

 

[bloodbought09]

I believe that verse is talking about Saul being put by God into that position of authority. There are many verses that talk about how as Christians we are to live by the laws of our government.

Saul wasn't 'annointed' per se.

But if those laws of the land contradict what the bible teaches we are to resist them. Aka, abortion and homosexual marriage.

 

[YoureMyBeloved]

Well, neither Saul or David were perfect. Saul tried to kill David, David committed adultery and ordered to kill Uriah...so I guess it's a difficult answer.

 

[brinny]

Look through the bible at the life of King David and King Saul, which person do you identify with the most? Why?

David.

 

[Strong in Him]

King David was superior to King Saul. King Saul when chosen was because of how he appeared to the eyes of men, but he fell short. King David when chosen was chosen because of how he appeared to the eyes of God.

I read this view in a commentary recently. It seems like a plausible explanation of how Saul failed and David succeeded; the trouble is that it's not exactly what the Bible says.
1 Samuel 9:15-17, 21; 10:1

 

[Strong in Him]

I can identify with Saul. Yes, he was given specific instructions, but because Samuel was taking so long to arrive, he offered the sacrifice himself, rather than go into battle without it being offered, and therefore without the Lord's help and blessing. He waited and waited, then did the wrong thing for the right reason. I can't say that I've never run ahead of God, in my enthusiasm.

I always thought it rather suspect that Samuel sent no word at all for a week, then came along just as Saul finished the sacrifice. Maybe that's just me, though.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I read this view in a commentary recently. It seems like a plausible explanation of how Saul failed and David succeeded; the trouble is that it's not exactly what the Bible says.
1 Samuel 9:15-17, 21; 10:1

Actually, what I said is based on scripture.

1) There was a Benjamite, a man of standing, whose name was Kish son of Abiel, the son of Zeror, the son of Bekorath, the son of Aphiah of Benjamin. 2 Kish had a son named Saul, as handsome a young man as could be found anywhere in Israel, and he was a head taller than anyone else. (1 Samuel 9:1-2)

2) About this time tomorrow I will send you a man from the land of Benjamin. Anoint him ruler over my people Israel; he will deliver them from the hand of the Philistines. I have looked on my people, for their cry has reached me. When Samuel caught sight of Saul, the Lord said to him, “This is the man I spoke to you about; he will govern my people.” (1 Samuel 9:16-17)

3) “You have done a foolish thing,” Samuel said. “You have not kept the command the Lord your God gave you; if you had, he would have established your kingdom over Israel for all time. But now your kingdom will not endure; the Lord has sought out a man after his own heart and appointed him ruler of his people, because you have not kept the Lord’s command.” (1 Samuel 13:13-15)

4) When they arrived, Samuel saw Eliab and thought, “Surely the Lord’s anointed stands here before the Lord. ”But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.” (1 Samuel 16:6-8)

Saul was anointed king at the people's preference, David was anointed king as one after God's heart.

 

[Gregory Thompson]

I can identify with Saul. Yes, he was given specific instructions, but because Samuel was taking so long to arrive, he offered the sacrifice himself, rather than go into battle without it being offered, and therefore without the Lord's help and blessing. He waited and waited, then did the wrong thing for the right reason. I can't say that I've never run ahead of God, in my enthusiasm.

I always thought it rather suspect that Samuel sent no word at all for a week, then came along just as Saul finished the sacrifice. Maybe that's just me, though.

this is possibly the story with denominations today, God doesn't answer so they just make their own plans.

 

[Strong in Him]

2) About this time tomorrow I will send you a man from the land of Benjamin. Anoint him ruler over my people Israel; he will deliver them from the hand of the Philistines. I have looked on my people, for their cry has reached me. When Samuel caught sight of Saul, the Lord said to him, “This is the man I spoke to you about; he will govern my people.” (1 Samuel 9:16-17)

Exactly; God chose Saul and told Samuel to anoint him.
My point was that Saul did not go to Samuel on his own and say "please make me king", neither did a delegation from Israel say that they wanted Saul to be their king because he was handsome and taller than anyone else.
Saul's donkeys were lost, he decided to consult a man of God - Samuel - to ask where they were, and the Lord told Samuel that Saul was to be the king. As confirmation, Saul was filled with the Holy Spirit, (1 Samuel 10:10)

3) “You have done a foolish thing,” Samuel said. “You have not kept the command the Lord your God gave you; if you had, he would have established your kingdom over Israel for all time. But now your kingdom will not endure; the Lord has sought out a man after his own heart and appointed him ruler of his people, because you have not kept the Lord’s command.” (1 Samuel 13:13-15)

I'm not disputing that Saul disobeyed God, nor that God was looking for someone who would put him first and obey his word.
But I've always wondered why it was that Saul made one mistake and Samuel told him that God had finished with him, whereas David coveted another man's wife, committed adultery and murder (breaking 3 of the commandments at least) and remained as king.

4) When they arrived, Samuel saw Eliab and thought, “Surely the Lord’s anointed stands here before the Lord. ”But the Lord said to Samuel, “Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart.” (1 Samuel 16:6-8)

Saul was anointed king at the people's preference, David was anointed king as one after God's heart.

God chose both Saul and David.
The people requested a king. Samuel anointed Saul with oil, (1 Sam 10:1) God changed him and filled him with his Spirit, then Samuel presented Saul to the people as God's anointed one. In 1 Samuel 10:17-24, although it does not say so, I believe it was the Lord who selected the various clans and so on, until he came to Saul, the man who had already been chosen and anointed as king.

 

[YESLORDIWILL]

I've always wondered why it was that Saul made one mistake and Samuel told him that God had finished with him, whereas David coveted another man's wife, committed adultery and murder (breaking 3 of the commandments at least) and remained as king.

Do you mean Ahinoam? (2 Samuel 12:8)

 

[Strong in Him]

Do you mean Ahinoam? (2 Samuel 12:8)

No, I mean Bathsheba.
David saw her bathing, wanted her, sent for her and slept with her. When he found she was pregnant, first of all he recalled her husband from the war and gave him time off to sleep with his wife; when that failed, David ordered that he be put on the frontline, where he would likely get himself killed. Which is what happened - and David then married Bathsheba "legitimately".

 

[Chicken Little]

Queen Abigail!

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Exactly; God chose Saul and told Samuel to anoint him.
My point was that Saul did not go to Samuel on his own and say "please make me king", neither did a delegation from Israel say that they wanted Saul to be their king because he was handsome and taller than anyone else.
Saul's donkeys were lost, he decided to consult a man of God - Samuel - to ask where they were, and the Lord told Samuel that Saul was to be the king. As confirmation, Saul was filled with the Holy Spirit, (1 Samuel 10:10)



I'm not disputing that Saul disobeyed God, nor that God was looking for someone who would put him first and obey his word.
But I've always wondered why it was that Saul made one mistake and Samuel told him that God had finished with him, whereas David coveted another man's wife, committed adultery and murder (breaking 3 of the commandments at least) and remained as king.



God chose both Saul and David.
The people requested a king. Samuel anointed Saul with oil, (1 Sam 10:1) God changed him and filled him with his Spirit, then Samuel presented Saul to the people as God's anointed one. In 1 Samuel 10:17-24, although it does not say so, I believe it was the Lord who selected the various clans and so on, until he came to Saul, the man who had already been chosen and anointed as king.

My point was that what you said was "not in the bible" was in the bible. So much as Saul, he followed the pattern of the judges, "who did what was right in their own eyes" . since we were moving on from that, David ended up being the good example except for one incident that the history says "except for his dealings with.."

Saul was an illustration of the previous era which was ineffective, David was an illustration of a way that was much later in history. And today, Saul and David remain in the church until the harvest.

 

[Strong in Him]

My point was that what you said was "not in the bible" was in the bible.

Sorry, maybe I've misunderstood, or not explained myself properly.

I believe you said that Saul was chosen because of how he appeared in the eyes of men. That is what I am disputing. Scripture says that the Lord chose him, told Samuel that he was his chosen one, and confirmed it by filling Saul with his Holy Spirit.

Yes, Samuel did ask all the men to stand before him; a tribe was selected, then a clan, then a family, then Saul. To the nation, this is how the selection took place - but Saul had already been anointed a few days earlier. It's true, too, that Scripture says that Saul was taller than the others, and handsome. But it doesn't say that the people chose Saul to be their king because he was tall and handsome.
That's all I was trying to say.

It's true that Saul fell short though, (but I still feel sorry for him.)

 

[Gregory Thompson]

Sorry, maybe I've misunderstood, or not explained myself properly.

I believe you said that Saul was chosen because of how he appeared in the eyes of men. That is what I am disputing.

Yes that is what the scriptures that I shared illustrated.

 

[FutureAndAHope]

Personally I identify with both of them. David was a hero, but Saul was a little more on the cowardly side (he hid when he was called to be king). I find myself constantly hiding, but then occasionally coming out with a miracle through faith, as David had. So I feel a bit mixed.

 

[tturt]

David "And he said unto his men, The Lord forbid that I should do this thing unto my master, the Lord's anointed, to stretch forth mine hand against him, seeing he is the anointed of the Lord." I Sam 24:6

 

[YESLORDIWILL]

No man can enter into a strongman's house, and spoil his goods, except he will first bind the strong man; and then he will spoil his house. (Mat 12:29, Mar 3:27)...Peter Pan's the only one that could pull that off. Was Peter Pan a real boy?