Kentucky County Clerk Kim Davis Jailed for Not Issuing Gay Marriage Licenses

[Pammalamma]

Christians, discuss your opinion of the situation here.

Keep in mind, the forum rules say that this forum believes that homosexuality is immoral, so that is *not* up for discussion.

Is Kim Davis engaging in passive resistance, because her right to religious freedom is being violated? Because it is a lie to say that a gay relationship constitutes "a marriage," would it be a sin for her to issue gay marriage licenses, which is "approving of sin?"

Or, is Kim Davis rightfully in jail, because she did not do her job, and we cannot let government employees pick and choose which orders to follow?

I have heard Christians who oppose gay marriage say both of these things today.

What would happen if we let everyone ignore orders because of religious beliefs? Conversely, what would happen if we forced everyone to obey the government under all circumstances?

Article for your information:
I have heard Christians who oppose gay marriage say both of these things today.

 

[Marius27]

Christians, discuss your opinion of the situation here.

Keep in mind, the forum rules say that this forum believes that homosexuality is immoral, so that is *not* up for discussion.

Is Kim Davis engaging in passive resistance, because her right to religious freedom is being violated? Because it is a lie to say that a gay relationship constitutes "a marriage," would it be a sin for her to issue gay marriage licenses, which is "approving of sin?"

Since we're talking about secular marriage here, not religious marriage, it isn't a lie that a gay relationship constitutes a marriage. It is a legal fact that must be followed by all government employees. No, her religious rights are not being violated. She's an elected official in public office. She doesn't have the right to deny other citizens their civil rights. If her religious beliefs prevent her from doing her job, she should resign.

Or, is Kim Davis rightfully in jail, because she did not do her job, and we cannot let government employees pick and choose which orders to follow?

Yup. She's in contempt of court. That's what happens when you refuse a court order.

 

[Red Fox]

Since we're talking about secular marriage here, not religious marriage, it isn't a lie that a gay relationship constitutes a marriage. It is a legal fact that must be followed by all government employees. No, her religious rights are not being violated. She's an elected official in public office. She doesn't have the right to deny other citizens their civil rights. If her religious beliefs prevent her from doing her job, she should resign.

If she had any real integrity, she would resign her position.

 

[jacknife]

Christians, discuss your opinion of the situation here.

Keep in mind, the forum rules say that this forum believes that homosexuality is immoral, so that is *not* up for discussion.

Is Kim Davis engaging in passive resistance, because her right to religious freedom is being violated? Because it is a lie to say that a gay relationship constitutes "a marriage," would it be a sin for her to issue gay marriage licenses, which is "approving of sin?"

Or, is Kim Davis rightfully in jail, because she did not do her job, and we cannot let government employees pick and choose which orders to follow?

I have heard Christians who oppose gay marriage say both of these things today.

What would happen if we let everyone ignore orders because of religious beliefs? Conversely, what would happen if we forced everyone to obey the government under all circumstances?

Article for your information:
I have heard Christians who oppose gay marriage say both of these things today.

It was the only practical resolve for the situation. I doubt fines would have had an impact of her she is rightfully in jail.

 

[Red Fox]

It was the only practical resolve for the situation. I doubt fines would have had an impact of her she is rightfully in jail.

It is a basic Christian tenet, a person reaps what they sow.

 

[nightflight]

But an official who doesn't follow immigration law would get a wink.

 

[SinnerInTheHands]

"Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven." [Matthew 5:10]

 

[durangodawood]

....what would happen if we forced everyone to obey the government under all circumstances?...

Thats not her situation.

She can resign and free herself from all obligation to enable gay marriages.

 

[durangodawood]

...What would happen if we let everyone ignore orders because of religious beliefs?....

What if a wahabbi style Muslim became clerk?

Could he just run the office per his religious conscience, until his term was up???

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Correction: She was jailed for ignoring a federal judge's orders, not for denying gays marriage licenses. She was flat out not doing her job for anyone gay or straight. Go ahead and go into work tomorrow, tell your boss you're not going to do your work and he's going to keep paying you regardless. See how that works out.

 

[Pammalamma]

It is a basic Christian tenet, a person reaps what they sow.

So, the gays who are being denied marriage, what did they sow?

 

[Pammalamma]

What if a wahabbi style Muslim became clerk?

Could he just run the office per his religious conscience, until his term was up???

People in elected offices can be impeached.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

But an official who doesn't follow immigration law would get a wink.

I have to assume you're talking about the President... I didn't know Obama was a.) and illegal immigrant or b.) an immigration officer.

 

[durangodawood]

People in elected offices can be impeached.

So now its OK to impeach someone for following their religious conscience?

 

[Pammalamma]

But an official who doesn't follow immigration law would get a wink.

Where were the cries about "the rule of law" when Travis County started issuing gay marriage licenses before it was legal? What about immigration? Do the people opposing Kim Davis' actions believe in upholding the rule of law, there? If not, then why mention the law at all? Everyone wants to get their own way...

 

[Red Fox]

"Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven." [Matthew 5:10]

She is not a martyr for her faith. If she had any integrity whatsoever, she would have humbly resigned from the job that inflicted her conscience so much.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

People in elected offices can be impeached.

Which is a lengthy process and she probably knows that. She is using her position as leverage to deny people their right to live out their lives how they see fit, regardless of the opinion of a local court clerk. That's not just illegal, it's immoral in my opinion.

 

[durangodawood]

Where were the cries about "the rule of law" when Travis County started issuing gay marriage licenses before it was legal? What about immigration? Do the people opposing Kim Davis' actions believe in upholding the rule of law, there? If not, then why mention the law at all? Everyone wants to get their own way...

For sure.
If Travis Country had issued inter racial marriage certificates before it was legal, I'd applaud that, law be dammed.

 

[Pammalamma]

She is not a martyr for her faith. If she had any integrity whatsoever, she would have humbly resigned from doing the job that inflicted her conscience so much.

So, if someone stands up for what they believe in, even when the government tells them to do something they believe is very wrong, you see that as a *lack* of integrity? Personally, I think it shows a lot more integrity to stick to your morals no matter what the government and other people say. That is what Jesus did.

If you ask someone, "What do you do?" and they say, "Whatever my boss tells me to," you think, "Wow! This person has an awful lot of integrity!" Right? Or, does it show more integrity to disobey a bad rule? Understand, she has different beliefs than you do about what is right and wrong.

"In ethics, integrity is regarded by many people as the honesty and truthfulness or accuracy of one's actions. Integrity can stand in opposition to hypocrisy, in that judging with the standards of integrity involves regarding internal consistency as a virtue, and suggests that parties holding within themselves apparently conflicting values should account for the discrepancy or alter their beliefs."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrity

 

[Red Fox]

Which is a lengthy process and she probably knows that. She is using her position as leverage to deny people their right to live out their lives how they see fit, regardless of the opinion of a local court clerk. That's not just illegal, it's immoral in my opinion.

Despite what she or some other Christians may believe, Christians are not above the laws of this country and using their religious beliefs as an excuse to break the law will get them nowhere fast in a court of law, as we have seen in this case. This woman's Christian beliefs are irrelevant to her responsibilities as an elected official. If she cannot do her job because it violates her Christian convictions, then the most honorable thing for her to do is resign and then protest afterward if she wanted to.