Jewish people in Bible prophecy

Lik3

Newbie
Nov 21, 2011
2,809
410
South Carolina
✟94,571.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
I believe that the last days have been the Church Age, or the last 2000 + years or so. I am wondering if Matthew 24 was directly to the Jews? Jesus mentioned all that has happened in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple and those in Judea. Now having written that, do Christians get caught up with the dead in Christ caught up first, then the rest of the world realizing that it is too late for them to be caught up because they have not been truly born again. Now if all of this is true and I believe that it is, then what role do the Jews play in the End Times? Do those Jews who are saved also get caught up along with the saved believers, or are they protected because of what has been written in Revelation 12 about the prophecy of Jesus' Birth, persecution, and protection? In short, is there prophecy written separately for the Jews as written in Matthew 24 and are the Gentiles caught up to meet the Lord in the air first and then the Jews who are saved? What I am trying to express is that will the Gentiles be caught up and then the Jews be caught up later after the Church has been raptured. Or do the Jewish people and the Gentiles get raptured at the same time? Help me understand.
 

John Hyperspace

UnKnown ReMember
Oct 3, 2016
2,385
1,272
53
Hyperspace
✟35,143.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I believe that the last days have been the Church Age, or the last 2000 + years or so. I am wondering if Matthew 24 was directly to the Jews? Jesus mentioned all that has happened in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple and those in Judea. Now having written that, do Christians get caught up with the dead in Christ caught up first, then the rest of the world realizing that it is too late for them to be caught up because they have not been truly born again. Now if all of this is true and I believe that it is, then what role do the Jews play in the End Times? Do those Jews who are saved also get caught up along with the saved believers, or are they protected because of what has been written in Revelation 12 about the prophecy of Jesus' Birth, persecution, and protection? In short, is there prophecy written separately for the Jews as written in Matthew 24 and are the Gentiles caught up to meet the Lord in the air first and then the Jews who are saved? What I am trying to express is that will the Gentiles be caught up and then the Jews be caught up later after the Church has been raptured. Or do the Jewish people and the Gentiles get raptured at the same time? Help me understand.

There's no difference between Jews and Greeks in Christ: Romans 10:12, Galatians 3:28, Colossians 3:11 all are of one seed; the seed of Abraham: Galatians 3:28-29. They're all "caught up" together at the coming of the Lord.
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,563
2,480
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟290,794.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
I believe that the last days have been the Church Age, or the last 2000 + years or so. I am wondering if Matthew 24 was directly to the Jews? Jesus mentioned all that has happened in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple and those in Judea. Now having written that, do Christians get caught up with the dead in Christ caught up first, then the rest of the world realizing that it is too late for them to be caught up because they have not been truly born again. Now if all of this is true and I believe that it is, then what role do the Jews play in the End Times? Do those Jews who are saved also get caught up along with the saved believers, or are they protected because of what has been written in Revelation 12 about the prophecy of Jesus' Birth, persecution, and protection? In short, is there prophecy written separately for the Jews as written in Matthew 24 and are the Gentiles caught up to meet the Lord in the air first and then the Jews who are saved? What I am trying to express is that will the Gentiles be caught up and then the Jews be caught up later after the Church has been raptured. Or do the Jewish people and the Gentiles get raptured at the same time? Help me understand.
There are many prophesies about Judah, the Jewish people for the end times.
Jesus said they belonged to the synagogue of Satan, Rev 2:9b and He said: Bring those enemies of Mine here and slaughter them. Luke 19:27
The OT is even harsher: I intend to do away with both the righteous and wicked alike, from the Negev Northward... Ezekiel 21:4
Judah will be judged and those who have not sought the Lord, nor enquired of Him will be wiped out. Zephaniah 1:4-6
Assuredly your, [Judah] wickedness will never be wiped out, you will die for it....Isaiah 21:14
The Lord says: This time I shall throw out the whole population of the Land.... Jeremiah 10:18
However a remnant will be saved; Isaiah 6:11-13 and they will join Israel- the Israel of God, every true Christian person and they will all go into Zion and make a everlasting Covenant with God. Jeremiah 50:4-5
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,563
2,480
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟290,794.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Now take a look at who Paul said the true Israelites were:

Romans 2:28-29 He is not a Jew, [a member of the Israel of God] who is one outwardly; because of circumcision, which is displayed in the flesh: but he is an Israelite who is circumcision is of the heart, in the Spirit and not in the letter [or outward freshly lineage], whose praise is not of men, but of God.
Speaking to the New Covenant church, Colossians 2:11 he said, You are circumcised with the circumcision of Christ.

Christians are now the chosen and blessed Israelites, one people: the nation who have faith in God through the Lord Jesus Christ. Matthew 21:43

Paul received his understanding in all this by revelation from God, His secret purpose made known: Ephesians 3:1-6, Galatians 1:12.
Paul says: You, brethren should not be ignorant of this mystery. Romans 11:25

How often have people been asked to pray for the peace of Israel & Jerusalem? How often have you heard the contradiction of Jesus’ offer of universal salvation; that you, even though you are a Christian, are a Gentile and that the ethnic Jew is still the chosen of God? This false teaching is promoted by those who believe in a rapture to heaven of the Church, while ethnic Israel remains to undergo purification on earth. This pretentious idea is not supported by scripture.

Zechariah 12:1-14 describes the scene at the Return of Jesus, where a remnant of Judah will finally find their strength in the Lord and mourn for Him that they pierced.

The New Testament is all about God making a Way for a nation of Spiritual Israelites; Christians that would bring forth fruit consistent with their faithfulness and trust in God. Galatians 5:22-25 A fruitful people of God. Matthew 21:43

Many of the prophets had said that if Judah rejected God and the One He sent to them, she would be pulled up by the roots and so she was: Luke 21:20-24, in 70 AD and will be again in the near future: Jeremiah 12:14, Isaiah 22:14

Jesus is declared to be the new tree of life and "the branches" consist of a newly chosen people, called from every nation, John 15:1-17, to form the Christian Israel of God! Galatians 6:16 Ethnic Israelis are "natural branches" and have been broken off the ‘Olive Tree’, that Jesus is the root and sustainer of. Only be becoming Christian, can they be reattached to the tree of Life.

The Christian church is the circumcision. Circumcision; the Marked and set aside ones, also known as Nazarenes.
Paul said to the gentile church: Brethren: We are the circumcision, which worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus and have no confidence in the flesh. Philippians 3:3; Colossians 2:11
Ephesians 2:11-18 also contrasts the saved and the unsaved, Christian believers and every other non-Christian person in the world.
 
Upvote 0

Revealing Times

Well-Known Member
Jun 15, 2016
2,845
420
59
Clanton Alabama
✟108,106.00
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
I believe that the last days have been the Church Age, or the last 2000 + years or so. I am wondering if Matthew 24 was directly to the Jews? Jesus mentioned all that has happened in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple and those in Judea. Now having written that, do Christians get caught up with the dead in Christ caught up first, then the rest of the world realizing that it is too late for them to be caught up because they have not been truly born again. Now if all of this is true and I believe that it is, then what role do the Jews play in the End Times? Do those Jews who are saved also get caught up along with the saved believers, or are they protected because of what has been written in Revelation 12 about the prophecy of Jesus' Birth, persecution, and protection? In short, is there prophecy written separately for the Jews as written in Matthew 24 and are the Gentiles caught up to meet the Lord in the air first and then the Jews who are saved? What I am trying to express is that will the Gentiles be caught up and then the Jews be caught up later after the Church has been raptured. Or do the Jewish people and the Gentiles get raptured at the same time? Help me understand.

The Answer is, most all prophecy is about the Jews, some are Christians, most have been blinded because of UNBELIEF, thus they have been grafted out of the Family. The Family is the same, we are all the Family of God, IF we are in Jesus Christ. Bur we are dealt with at different time periods. Most Jews will not come to the Lord Jesus until the time of Jacobs Trouble. Most Christians are in Christ before this end times event, thus we go to be with the Lord at the Rapture, JUST LIKE Messianic Jews who are Christians at the time of the Rapture. Not all Gentiles who become Christians will do so before the Rapture, after the Rapture, many Gentiles will be come Christians, the are the REMNANT of the SEED in Rev. 12:17.....The Woman is Israel, she is Protected, the REMNANT of Jesus are not.

Now as to the Prophecies in Matthew....Matthew 24:23-31 is Jesus speaking to the Jews who he understands misses the Rapture because of UNBELIEF, but turn to God/Jesus because of Elijah (Malachi 4:5-6) coming and witnessing to them before the Day of the Lord. So before the Abomination of Desolation, Israel turns to Jesus as their Messiah, then God protects the ones that Flee to the Wilderness for 1260 Days. Jesus WARNS THEM in Matthew 24:23-31 that there will be times of trouble like never before, he tells them do not believe a LIE, if someone tells you I am in the Chambers somewhere, or in the Dessert, DON'T GO, (For they will kill you if you leave my protected place in the Wilderness) for I will come in the EASTERN SKIES....And I am coming back (with the church) IMMEDIATELY AFTER the Tribulation of those days. So Jesus warns the majority of the Jews exactly what they need to do after the accept him/Jesus as their Messiah before the AOD.

Jesus having come unto the "Lost sheep of Israel only", now understands he has to give the Jews who will be Christians at the time of the Rapture their Instructions, so he prophesies unto the in Matthew 24:32-44, he says there will be two in the field and ONE will be TAKEN and the OTHER will be LEFT [BEHIND]. This is Jesus preaching/prophesying to the few Messianic Jews who will be Christians at the time of the Rapture, Jesus came unto ALL JEWS, so he had to cover both aspects, the Rapture, and the Jews who accept Jesus as their Messiah after the Rapture.

The Gentile CHURCH and the Rapture was a MYSTERY...
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I believe that the last days have been the Church Age, or the last 2000 + years or so. I am wondering if Matthew 24 was directly to the Jews? Jesus mentioned all that has happened in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple and those in Judea. Now having written that, do Christians get caught up with the dead in Christ caught up first, then the rest of the world realizing that it is too late for them to be caught up because they have not been truly born again. Now if all of this is true and I believe that it is, then what role do the Jews play in the End Times? Do those Jews who are saved also get caught up along with the saved believers, or are they protected because of what has been written in Revelation 12 about the prophecy of Jesus' Birth, persecution, and protection? In short, is there prophecy written separately for the Jews as written in Matthew 24 and are the Gentiles caught up to meet the Lord in the air first and then the Jews who are saved? What I am trying to express is that will the Gentiles be caught up and then the Jews be caught up later after the Church has been raptured. Or do the Jewish people and the Gentiles get raptured at the same time? Help me understand.

Tremendous confusion has been produced in the modern Church by the Two Peoples of God doctrine, which John Nelson Darby brought to America about the time of the Civil War. After that it was incorporated into the notes of the Scofield Reference Bible and then spread like a virus through much of the evangelical Church. Many people have never heard anything else. It is a doctrine based on genealogy.

Let us examine what the Bible says.

The most important genealogy in the Bible is found in Matthew chapter 1. It starts with Abraham and ends with Christ.


Mat 1:1  The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the Son of David, the Son of Abraham:
 

In Matthew chapter 3 John the Baptist tells his people to not put their confidence in being Abraham's seed.

Mat 3:9  and do not think to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. 


In 1 Timothy we find a warning against endless genealogies.

1Ti 1:4  nor give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which cause disputes rather than godly edification which is in faith.

The Apostle Paul tells us that the promise made to Abraham was made only to Christ.

Gal 3:16  Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, "And to seeds," as of many, but as of one, "AND TO YOUR SEED," who is Christ.

In verse 29 of the same passage we find that we are the seed of Abraham and inherit the promise through faith in Christ.

Gal 3:29  And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. 


The middle wall of separation between all races of people was broken down at the Cross.
God does not Judge people based on their DNA.


There are two Israels found in the New Testament.
There is Israel of the Flesh and Israel of the Promise.
A person can only inherit the promise through faith in Christ.


Rom 9:6  But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel, 
Rom 9:7  nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham; but, "IN ISAAC YOUR SEED SHALL BE CALLED." 
Rom 9:8  That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed. 


The New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34 was made with Israel and Judah.

Jer 31:31  "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah— 
Jer 31:32  not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, though I was a husband to them, says the LORD. 
Jer 31:33  But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 
Jer 31:34  No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the LORD. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more." 

At the Last Supper Christ confirmed that He would bring in this New Covenant with His Blood.

Mat 26:28  For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 


On the Day of Pentecost Peter addressed the crowd as "men of Judea", then as "men of Israel", and in Acts 2:36 as "all the house of Israel". On that day about 3,000 Israelites accepted the New Covenant promised to Jeremiah.

Act 2:36  "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ." 

When it first began, almost all members of the New Covenant Church were Israelites. The Gentiles were grafted in several years later.

The Olive Tree of Romans chapter 11 is a symbol of the New Covenant Church made up of Israelites and Gentiles grafted together into one tree. Paul says the branches broken off can be grafted back into the tree, through faith in Christ. He provides no path of salvation outside of the Olive Tree.


The New Covenant is found fulfilled in Hebrews 8:6-13 and we find that the New Covenant has made the Old Covenant "obsolete" in verse 13. The New Covenant is specifically applied to the Church in Hebrews 12:18-24 and 2 Corinthians 3:6-8.

God now judges all people in the same way, not based on race, but rather based on their relationship to His Son.


1Jn 2:22  Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 
1Jn 2:23  Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also. 


If we want modern Jews to be saved we need to share the Gospel with them, now. The "suffering servant" of Isaiah chapter 53, and the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 prove that the baby born in a manger was and is the New Covenant Messiah promised in the Old Testament.

The "Church Age" began on the Day of Pentecost. Based on Hebrews 13:20 the New Covenant is "everlasting". Therefore, it cannot end before the Second Coming of Christ.


This is confirmed by those under the Blood of the Lamb in Revelation 12:11. A person cannot be under the Blood of the Lamb and not be under the Grace of the New Covenant. The 144,000 are described as "firstfruits" of the Lamb. Paul used the same language to describe Christians in Romans 16:5.

Matthew chapter 24 was written mainly to Jewish Christians, since we find the "Great Commission" to the Church at the end of Matthew's Gospel and Christ spoke about His Church in Matthew chapter 16.

If you want to understand what happens in the end times do a study to understand the New Covenant of Christ.

........................................................

"new covenant" in the NKJV

Jer_31:31  "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—

Mat_26:28  For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mar_14:24  And He said to them, "This is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many.

Luk_22:20  Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

1Co_11:25  In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me."

2Co_3:6  who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Heb_8:8  Because finding fault with them, He says: "BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—

Heb_8:13  In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Heb_9:15  And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

Heb_12:24  to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.


Who Confirmed The Covenant?
James Lloyd
http://christianmediaresearch.com/node/1023

 
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Postvieww
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,563
2,480
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟290,794.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Israel and the Church

Reformed interpretation of Scripture has traditionally insisted, especially in opposition to what it has regarded as an Anabaptist (and dispensationalist) disjunction between old and new covenants, the continuity of a single covenant of grace, even to the point of referring to the new covenant church as an extension of the old covenant church. This accords with the language of kahal ("assembly," "congregation"), which the Greek version of the Old Testament translates: synagoge or ekklesia, which is then carried over into the New Testament designation for the people of God. Israel is the recipient of the laws and promises, the covenants of Sinai and Abraham, and whatever happens to extend the family is in fact an expansion rather than replacement of Israel. It is through the earthly, physical, ethnic Israel of God that the covenant of grace has unfolded throughout history and now reaches outward to all the nations and peoples of the world.

The attitude of the New Testament is quite clear. Jews labor under the illusion that they have some sort of advantage in being descended from Abraham. In so thinking, they are thoroughly mistaken. Being descended from Abraham is no advantage whatsoever. God is able to declare anyone a child of Abraham; God is able from these stones to raise up children of Abraham. And Paul confirms this by pointing out that not all of Abraham's children were of Israel. Isaac was of Israel but Esau was not. So being a physical descendant of Abraham does not make one a child of the promise. By quoting the verses from Hosea, Paul says that God can take a people who are not chosen and make them chosen. God is not bound by genealogical considerations... This is presumably the church which is not a natural family characterized by descent from a common ancestor but an association of persons from many peoples united by a common faith.

As Israel's exile testified, God had not reneged on his promise; Israel had reneged on hers. This point is as clear in the prophets as it is in Paul. God would still fulfill the purposes of his eternal election, however, and the Abrahamic promise envisioned this as the blessing that would come to all peoples through the Seed of Abraham and Sarah. That is: through Jesus. As with Eden, there is no way back to Sinai, but this is actually good news, since no one could be saved according to the righteousness of the law. The only way to be saved, and therefore, to belong to the true Israel of God, is to be "in Christ." At Mount Sinai, Israel responded to the conditional terms as one person: "All this we will do!", yet broke their covenant oath. At Mount Calvary, the True Israel, who had fulfilled the terms throughout his life, cried out, "It is finished!"

At the Synod of Jerusalem, this christocentric interpretation of election and redefinition of Israel in line with the prophetic texts was officially adopted and it was Peter who gave such eloquent testimony to this interpretation that Gentile believers, no less than Jews, are justified by grace through faith without any distinction. Acts 15:8-11 Circumcision counts for nothing: everything turns on faith in Christ, announced by the gospel. Romans 2:17-29

The attitude we must have toward ethnic Jews is that of Paul the Jewish apostle to the Gentiles, who would have willingly born Israel's "anathema" in her place. Romans 10:1-3
At the same time, we must remember that this anathema is not over Jews as Jews, but over all of humanity living apart from Christ. If we really follow through with the Pauline logic (maintained elsewhere in the New Testament, as it was throughout the prophets), there is no more guarantee that a particular visible church that bears the name Christian will not fail to have its candlestick removed should it live by any principle other than faith in Christ.

It is therefore, not ultimately a question of whether one is a Jew or a Christian in terms of outward organization, but of whether one is "inwardly circumcised”, that is: buried and raised with Christ. Jesus is not only the high Priest and mediator of the covenant; he is in his very person "a covenant to the people". Isaiah 42:6

The problem is that the Old Covenant that the people made with God at Sinai was being allowed to determine the answer to these questions: How are we saved? By fulfilling the law. Who is Israel? Those who fulfill the law.
Paul held this view before his conversion, as a Pharisee and persecutor of the church, but on the Damascus Road everything was turned upside down when he encountered a vision of the very "cursed" one according to the law. cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree, triumphantly seated at the Father's right hand in glory. Now the questions receive different answers that are, in fact, perfectly consistent with the expectations of the prophets.

How are we saved? We are saved in the same way that all of the saints in redemptive history were saved: by trusting in God's promised Messiah.

Who are the people of God? The children of promise: those who share Abraham's faith. The heirs of the Sinai Covenant are those who are ethnic descendants of Abraham, circumcised in the flesh; the heirs of the Abrahamic covenant (fulfilled in the New Covenant) are: all people, Jew and Gentile, who are "in Christ" through faith alone, circumcised in their hearts.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BABerean2
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,563
2,480
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟290,794.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Romans 11:25-26…when all the Gentile believers are come in..…the Deliverer will come and so all Israel shall be saved.

But remember Romans 9:6-8…not all of ethnic Israel are truly the Israel of God…it is the children born from the Promise, [Jesus: His Christian believers.] who are reckoned as Abrahams descendants.
Galatians 4:28 Now you, my friends, like Isaac; are children of God’s Promise.
We know that the ‘all of Israel’ must include those Christian believers who are grafted in, Romans 11:17, who are the true circumcision, the ‘real Jews’; Romans 2:29 People from every race; nation and language, including Jews, all bought by the blood of Jesus. Revelation 5:9-10

We know that God did choose ethnic Israel to be His people and Jesus came to continue God’s Promises to the Patriarchs, Romans 15:8 He came to save the lost sheep of Israel.
But they rejected and killed Him, as the parable of the vineyard relates. Now the Gentiles glorify God for His mercy, Romans 15:9-13

The ethnic Israelites have lost their vantage ground because of this rejection and todays Jewish people, in the main, continue in this sin and they stand level with the rest of fallen humanity. The Cross has broken down the wall of separation between Israel and all other peoples, it has levelled all distinctions. Ephesians 2:14-18

How can it be when there is now no special people, that in the last days, God could forgive the Jews their centuries of disbelief and now in the State of Israel, their prideful atheism, false religions and LGBT sins?

Simply put: If God was to fulfil the promises He made to ancient Israel, to the current Jewish State of Israel, it would be entirely inconsistent with the truths of the New Testament and a denial of Jesus’ Words in John 3:16.
 
Upvote 0