Jesus' meaning of "world" in Jn 6:51 and 7:7

[FreeGrace2]

The same people believing are adopted. Jn 1:12
The people are predestined to being adopted Ep 1:5

That's correct. It's believers who are adopted and predestined. Check the order.

 

[heymikey80]

That's correct. It's believers who are adopted and predestined. Check the order.

The order from Ep 1:5 requires predestination first. Prooriso puts it first before its object. 1:4 forces election from the world's founding as well, before people believed (or existed). Adoption is afterward, but becoming born of God is not afterward (john 1:13). And, 1 John 5:1 again, new birth is completed for everyone who believes Jesus is the Christ.

 

[FreeGrace2]

The order from Ep 1:5 requires predestination first. Prooriso puts it first before its object.

What's the evidence for your claim? Here's the verse from NASB:

Ephesians 1:4
just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love
Ephesians 1:5
He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will,

In both verses, "us" is defined by Paul in 1:19-
9and what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe.

So, God chose US (believers) that we would be holy and blameless before Him, and He predestined US (believers) to adoption as sons.

1:4 forces election from the world's founding as well, before people believed (or existed).

That matters not one bit. Of course's God's plan before anything existed was to elect believers and predestine believers to adoption as sons.

Adoption is afterward, but becoming born of God is not afterward (john 1:13).

This needs lots of explanation. Relative to what, specifically?

And, 1 John 5:1 again, new birth is completed for everyone who believes Jesus is the Christ.

Sure. I've agreed with that. And Greek grammar rules SAYS that present participles occur at the same time as the ACTION of the main verb.

#1 present participle = believing ones
#2 main verb = has been born again
#3 present participle (when the believing ones believed) occurs at the SAME TIME as the ACTION (when God actually Regenerates the believer) of the main verb.

That is boiled down as far as it can go.

 

[heymikey80]

What's the evidence for your claim? Here's the verse from NASB:

Ephesians 1:4
just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love
Ephesians 1:5
He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ 7to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will,

In both verses, "us" is defined by Paul in 1:19-
9and what is the surpassing greatness of His power toward us who believe.

So, God chose US (believers) that we would be holy and blameless before Him, and He predestined US (believers) to adoption as sons.


That matters not one bit. Of course's God's plan before anything existed was to elect believers and predestine believers to adoption as sons.


This needs lots of explanation. Relative to what, specifically?


Sure. I've agreed with that. And Greek grammar rules SAYS that present participles occur at the same time as the ACTION of the main verb.

#1 present participle = believing ones
#2 main verb = has been born again
#3 present participle (when the believing ones believed) occurs at the SAME TIME as the ACTION (when God actually Regenerates the believer) of the main verb.

That is boiled down as far as it can go.

Even inexperienced exegetes know pronouns refer to preceding nouns. Not those 14 verses later.

And everyone knows the foundation of the world starts all creation. So it is first, not your faith at Ep 1:19 in a different sentence long after the worlds founding.

It is getting to be a lot of errors.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Even inexperienced exegetes know pronouns refer to preceding nouns. Not those 14 verses later.

Was there a point to this??

And everyone knows the foundation of the world starts all creation. So it is first, not your faith at Ep 1:19 in a different sentence long after the worlds founding.

Still quite confused, huh. When Paul used the word "us" throughout ch 1 and 2, he always referred to believers, which 1:19 clearly indicates.

You've failed to prove otherwise. It is believers who God has chosen to be holy and blameless, and who God has predestined.

It is getting to be a lot of errors.

And I keep trying to help you out.

 

[heymikey80]

Was there a point to this??

Your selection of noun follows the pronouns of 1:4-18. Was there a point to picking the wrong noun? Oh, right, to establish the answer you want instead of the answer supported by the apostle. Got it.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I asked what the point was:

Your selection of noun follows the pronouns of 1:4-18. Was there a point to picking the wrong noun? Oh, right, to establish the answer you want instead of the answer supported by the apostle. Got it.

So I "picked the wrong noun", huh? Which noun did I pick, and which noun should I have picked?

Your answers just keep getting more and more bizarre.

Please answer my question. i.e., clarify your comment.

 

[tulipbee]

...

Calvinists claim .....

Welcome to my ignore list