"Jesus loves me. This I know..."

[98cwitr]

Even at 5 years old I pondered this song in my head. Now at 31 I am still perplexed that churches indoctrinate the song into the children's ministry and into the minds of the children that sing it.

"For the Bible tells me so" - A play on John 3:16 I assume, but what about John 3:17-20? Have you ever heard John 3:17-20 preached in church? Do you think that without it that John 3:16 is out of context by itself?

"Little ones to Him belong" - True, yet all of creation belongs to God, both the saved and the damned. Does this line insinuate salvation in the mind of child? It did to me when I was a kid. Now that Im older I see that it's a reference to Mark 10:14, but now as an adult my focus is on verse 15 as well.

"They are weak, but He is strong" - Very true

That said...there's more lines to the song than that...lines that are more telling:

"See I know that he loves me, Whether I'm right, whether I'm wrong" Are we giving a license to sin here?

"Undeserving, and stubbornly never fail to love me still" When does regeneration come into play?

I would much rather have the children sing "I love the Lord!" rather than "Jesus loves me"...song just seems so self-focused and egocentric.

 

[MWood]

Even at 5 years old I pondered this song in my head. Now at 31 I am still perplexed that churches indoctrinate the song into the children's ministry and into the minds of the children that sing it.

"For the Bible tells me so" - A play on John 3:16 I assume, but what about John 3:17-20? Have you ever heard John 3:17-20 preached in church? Do you think that without it that John 3:16 is out of context by itself?

"Little ones to Him belong" - True, yet all of creation belongs to God, both the saved and the damned. Does this line insinuate salvation in the mind of child? It did to me when I was a kid. Now that Im older I see that it's a reference to Mark 10:14, but now as an adult my focus is on verse 15 as well.

"They are weak, but He is strong" - Very true

That said...there's more lines to the song than that...lines that are more telling:

"See I know that he loves me, Whether I'm right, whether I'm wrong" Are we giving a license to sin here?

"Undeserving, and stubbornly never fail to love me still" When does regeneration come into play?

I would much rather have the children sing "I love the Lord!" rather than "Jesus loves me"...song just seems so self-focused and egocentric.

No one needs a license to sin. Its going to happen whether we have a license or not.

 

[98cwitr]

What I mean by "license" is a leading a sinful life with no remorse or repentance.

 

[SarahsKnight]

I would much rather have the children sing "I love the Lord!" rather than "Jesus loves me"...song just seems so self-focused and egocentric

Either that or maybe children (and adults, too) are just glad to have a God who loves them.

 

[twin1954]

It is one of the Devil's greatest deceptions. Children grow up sitting on grandma's knee being told that God loves them. In Sunday School they sing "Jesus loves me" and in church they are told that God loves them. Then they grow up to be profligates and full of Hell but all the while they believe that Jesus loves me. If He loves me He will not send me to Hell. That isn't what love does. They have no fear of God because of it and no desire to be free from the bondage to sin. God loves me is enough for them. They "got saved" when they were 5 or 6 years old and they always look back to that time as their hope. But the Scriptures do not say that the love of God abides on them it says that the wrath of God abides on them. John 3:36


Oh how many souls go to Hell hoping in the love of God?

 

[Matt Faith]

Jesus does love us all, he just doesn't love our sin. I don't think there's anything wrong with children or adults singing about Jesus loving them. But yes, if you love God, and believe the bible...you will also repent of your sins.

 

[Matt Faith]

delete post

 

[SarahsKnight]

That isn't what love does. They have no fear of God because of it and no desire to be free from the bondage to sin. God loves me is enough for them. They "got saved" when they were 5 or 6 years old and they always look back to that time as their hope. But the Scriptures do not say that the love of God abides on them it says that the wrath of God abides on them. John 3:36

Well, if that's true for them, can they do any different according to your theology? Can they change to truly respect and love God and be genuinely saved unless God makes it happen?

 

[twin1954]

Well, if that's true for them, can they do any different according to your theology? Can they change to truly respect and love God and be genuinely saved unless God makes it happen?

No they can't but that isn't the point, they will not. They neither desire to or need to. John 5:39-40

 

[twin1954]

Jesus does love us all, he just doesn't love our sin. I don't think there's anything wrong with children or adults singing about Jesus loving them. But yes, if you love God, and believe the bible...you will also repent of your sins.

So when the Bible says that God hates all workers of iniquity or that He loves Jacob and hates Esau it is a lie? Psa. 5:5, Mal.1:3, Rom. 9:13

What about John 3:36 which clearly says that the wrath of God abides on the unbeliever not the love of God?

 

[SarahsKnight]

No they can't but that isn't the point, they will not. They neither desire to or need to. John 5:39-40

Okay, good, you clarified this. But then I must ask, what's the point in saying the stuff like this in your first post,

It is one of the Devil's greatest deceptions. Children grow up sitting on grandma's knee being told that God loves them. In Sunday School they sing "Jesus loves me" and in church they are told that God loves them. Then they grow up to be profligates and full of Hell but all the while they believe that Jesus loves me. If He loves me He will not send me to Hell.

like you are trying to warn children who just sing Jesus loves me and do nothing else to smarten up and get it right, to serve and fear Him too? Because if they will not, if they will never desire or need to, then what's the point of saying this at all like they can change and they'd better do it soon? It's as if you are just reminding them that they are going to hell, like rubbing it into their faces (well, I guess they wouldn't see it that way if they are non-elect and/or reprobate because they wouldn't care in the first place) that this is the way it is going to be. Sorry but this is what it sounds like you are saying.

 

[Matt Faith]

So when the Bible says that God hates all workers of iniquity or that He loves Jacob and hates Esau it is a lie? Psa. 5:5, Mal.1:3, Rom. 9:13

What about John 3:36 which clearly says that the wrath of God abides on the unbeliever not the love of God?

I am confused with what your mad at me for? What did I say wrong?

 

[98cwitr]

I am confused with what your mad at me for? What did I say wrong?

Matt, you said "Jesus does love us all, he just doesn't love our sin."

But I think twin's scriptures reference might be in conflict with that view.

 

[twin1954]

Okay, good, you clarified this. But then I must ask, what's the point in saying the stuff like this in your first post,

like you are trying to warn children who just sing Jesus loves me and do nothing else to smarten up and get it right, to serve and fear Him too? Because if they will not, if they will never desire or need to, then what's the point of saying this at all like they can change and they'd better do it soon? It's as if you are just reminding them that they are going to hell, like rubbing it into their faces (well, I guess they wouldn't see it that way if they are non-elect and/or reprobate because they wouldn't care in the first place) that this is the way it is going to be. Sorry but this is what it sounds like you are saying.

We, as watchmen on the wall (Ezek. 33:6), are to declare the danger to all. It is our duty to set before all men, young and old, the judgment coming and to warn them. If we give them a false hope or fail to warn them when we could have we have trifled with their souls and God will require it at our hands.

Moreover if we truly love men we will declare the truth to them not giving them a false hope in the love of God. If I knew who the elect are I would preach only to them but I don't and am required to warn all. The preaching of the Gospel of the sovereign grace of God as it is in Christ alone is the power of God unto salvation to them that believe. I believe this with all my heart.

 

[98cwitr]

Well stated, twin.

 

[Matt Faith]

I'm not going to argue about this. Maybe I said something wrong, I'm still a relatively new Christian. I think it's easy in Christianity to get bogged down in arguing with other Christians who have differing beliefs. (That's why there's so many denominations)But I think the bibles overall message is quite simple, and I am at peace with it.

But thank you twin1954 for being a watchman on the wall. I respect those kind of Christians. I don't think Christians talk about the second coming enough. There needs to be more end times prophecy talk.

 

[98cwitr]

I'm not going to argue about this. Maybe I said something wrong, I'm still a relatively new Christian. I think it's easy in Christianity to get bogged down in arguing with other Christians who have differing beliefs. (That's why there's so many denominations)But I think the bibles overall message is quite simple, and I am at peace with it.

But thank you twin1954 for being a watchman on the wall. I respect those kind of Christians. I don't think Christians talk about the second coming enough. There needs to be more end times prophecy talk.

As a new Christian, I will always offer you the challenge of whatever theology someone throws at you...whether it be on the Internet or at church or wherever, ALWAYS make sure they can back it up with Scripture.

 

[Matt Faith]

Keep in mind though, that not everything that can be backed up with scripture is true. A Jehovah's Witness could sit here and with scripture try to tell you that Jesus is Michael the Archangel...and with conviction. There's people that will try to claim God is done with national Israel despite the fact that Paul taught the opposite. Then you have people that would have you believe that God operates in 3 modes, modalism..and they'd back it up with scripture. They'd also have you believe that you have to speak in tongues to be saved. And they'd sell you on all that with conviction too. The reality is, your never going to please everybody with your Christian doctrine. That's why theres a million denominations..and then theres preterism, post trib, mid trib, pre trib, and it goes on and on and on. My best advice for everybody is just read the bible, and believe the stuff that is clearly taught and you'll be fine. The stuff that is less clear, do your best to understand, but don't get too stressed about. You'll never have everybody agree with you on here, in church or wherever theres believers.

In regards to Calvinism, I'm not 100% sure where I stand on it. I don't claim to be a theologian. I have not spent enough time researching Calvinism. I always thought God loves all, and wishes we would all repent and turn to Jesus. I know he obviously hates sin though. But we all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. The only thing that makes us any better is we believed in Jesus, he is the propitiation for our sins. Like I said, I don't know enough about Calvinism yet.

 

[98cwitr]

Keep in mind though, that not everything that can be backed up with scripture is true. A Jehovah's Witness could sit here and with scripture try to tell you that Jesus is Michael the Archangel...and with conviction. There's people that will try to claim God is done with national Israel despite the fact that Paul taught the opposite. Then you have people that would have you believe that God operates in 3 modes, modalism..and they'd back it up with scripture. They'd also have you believe that you have to speak in tongues to be saved. And they'd sell you on all that with conviction too. The reality is, your never going to please everybody with your Christian doctrine. That's why theres a million denominations..and then theres preterism, post trib, mid trib, pre trib, and it goes on and on and on. My best advice for everybody is just read the bible, and believe the stuff that is clearly taught and you'll be fine. The stuff that is less clear, do your best to understand, but don't get too stressed about. You'll never have everybody agree with you on here, in church or wherever theres believers.

Quite true, Matt! "Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves."

"My best advice for everybody is just read the bible"

^^^Agree fully, bear in mind that the Enemy is at work...and there are MANY false teachers.

 

[Matt Faith]

Quite true, Matt! "Therefore be as shrewd as snakes and as innocent as doves."

"My best advice for everybody is just read the bible"

^^^Agree fully, bear in mind that the Enemy is at work...and there are MANY false teachers.

Amen, I always try to see if what I'm hearing matches what the bible says from the teachers I listen to. I'm open to different views, and I don't write people off as heretics if they don't believe exactly what I believe. There are those issues in the bible that are a little more confusing, and are not as clear cut. However, there are certain things the bible is clear about. As long as somebody believes the things the bible is pretty clear about, I don't have an issue with that person. But when they start saying stuff like all bible prophecy was fulfilled in AD 70, I get concerned about them. I think we can all agree at least in this section of the forum that the devil is not bound, and Jesus has yet to return physically as the bible teaches.