.

[sunlover1]

The Holy Spirit is poured out on all believers. But not ALL MANKIND as Joel's prophecy states. That won't occur until Christ returns. Peter never said Joel's prophecy was fulfilled at Pentecost.

Well that's fine, but I'm saying that I AM one of the "all believers"
So if the Holy Spirit is poured out on me, then why wouldn't God give me
dreams, visions and prophecy? (Or you for that matter, except this stuff
works "by faith").

 

[swordsman1]

Well that's fine, but I'm saying that I AM one of the "all believers"
So if the Holy Spirit is poured out on me, then why wouldn't God give me
dreams, visions and prophecy? (Or you for that matter, except this stuff
works "by faith").

If you are referring to the New Testament gift of prophecy, then that gift ceased along with the gifts of tongues and healing at the end of the apostolic age. Once the churches had their New Testaments there was no longer any need for prophecy.

Prophecy is not what you see today in certain churches - a fuzzy feeling that people verbalize using their own words. It is God speaking HIS ACTUAL WORDS in a dream or vision, which the prophet accurately relayed. It was authoritative and infallible.

And people did not receive it 'by faith'. It was given to whomever the Holy Spirit determined (1 Cor 12:11).

 

[sunlover1]

If you are referring to the New Testament gift of prophecy, then that gift ceased along with the gifts of tongues and healing at the end of the apostolic age. Once the churches had their New Testaments there was no longer any need for prophecy.

What was the purpose of the gifts (that you say ceased), according to Scripture?

Prophecy is not what you see today in certain churches - a fuzzy feeling that people verbalize using their own words. It is God speaking HIS ACTUAL WORDS in a dream or vision, which the prophet accurately relayed. It was authoritative and infallible.

maybe or maybe not. Dont know what other churches do.

And people did not receive it 'by faith'. It was given to whomever the Holy Spirit determined (1 Cor 12:11).

I said:

...why wouldn't God give me dreams, visions and prophecy?
(Or you for that matter, except this stuff works "by faith").

This stuff all does work by faith. You can have faith that He's spoken
or you can worry that you're hearing voices. You can have faith that
God still speaks to His own, or you can deny that He does and .. He
probably won't. Why would He speak to someone who disbelieves..

 

[swordsman1]

What was the purpose of the gifts (that you say ceased), according to Scripture?

Same as all the gifts...to serve others (1 Peter 4:10).

You can have faith that
God still speaks to His own, or you can deny that He does and .. He
probably won't. Why would He speak to someone who disbelieves..

Receiving a gift is not determined by whether you have the faith to believe in it. It is determined by the will of the Holy Spirit only (1 Cor 12:11). Your faith has nothing to do with it.

 

[sunlover1]

Same as all the gifts...to serve others (1 Peter 4:10).

Amen. and we STILL need to be able to do those things for the world
and for each other... in fact, we get attacked by the kingdom of darkness
and we NEED power to stand against it.
People haven't changed, they still hurt, they still need to HEAR what God
has to say to them "personally", they need more than the written word,
I'm sorry. I mean no disrespect and if i have been offensive please forgive
me, but i have to say the truth. SO many still need to be healed, they
need teachers, prophets.. and people still need miracles!

Receiving a gift is not determined by whether you have the faith to believe in it. It is determined by the will of the Holy Spirit only (1 Cor 12:11).

Amen, but you need faith to WIELD it.
You must have faith that His Word is true or you won't step out with your
healing gift or speak up when He wants to speak a prophesy to someone
THROUGH you...
Why? because folks might tell you the kind of things I've been told here...
Takes faith! What if I pray for someone and they're not healed?
Well at least you tried! lol
And if GOD speaks to you, telling you to do it (heal), saying that
He will heal them, .. this ^ is how FAITh comes by HEARING and
hearing by the word of God. (One way )
When I hear my Father TELL me He's doing something, well how
can I not have faith that it's going to come to pass? lol And that kind
of faith, faith that needs no evidence... is mountain moving faith.

Your faith has nothing to do with it.

We disagree here [/QUOTE]

 

[Ronald]

The idea the God talks back to us when we pray has become so accepted that it's difficult to challenge, but is it true or a cliché?

Not for Simon Cowell! It's accepted because it's real. Reconciliation is being joined with God. He forgives our sins and dwells in us. When God is living in you, He influences, guides, chastises, comforts, teaches, counsels, speaks, bears witness to us, makes promises, loves us, fellowships with us, sanctifies us, justifies us, convicts us of sin and edifies us. I'd say that is a form of communication - the best! But hey, I get it, sometimes it seems He doesn't answer our prayers or the answer is NO! Sometimes it's years before He answers but when it happens, there is no mistaking it. Sometimes it's through experiences. He gives us understanding piece by piece and so you can't expect to get it all quickly. We must go through life to learn and usually His lessons are the experiences we learn from. When I first became a Christian, I had a lot of questions and He would answer them through a friend, His word, or I'd turn the radio on and listen to a sermon and there it was. I asked Him a question once and a week later I met a pastor by chance on a shuttle who told me the answer. God works through all of us in many ways. So it's not an audible voice but it is unmistakably Him.

 

[swordsman1]

People haven't changed, they still hurt, they still need to HEAR what God has to say to them "personally",

They can hear what God has to say to them personally for today...through the bible. God's word is LIVING and ACTIVE (Heb 4:12), not dead letters on a page.

they need more than the written word,

No they don't need more than the written word. The bible is all the revelation we need:

2 Tim 3:16 "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work."​

The bible doesn't just partially equip us, it thoroughly equips us. Not just for some good work, but for every good work. To say otherwise is to deny what God has promised.

 

[sunlover1]

When I asked what PURPOSE the gifts serve(d), you responded:

Same as all the gifts...to serve others (1 Peter 4:10).

And I agreed:

Amen. and we STILL need to be able to do those things for the world
and for each other... in fact, we get attacked by the kingdom of darkness
and we NEED power to stand against it.
People haven't changed, they still hurt, they still need to HEAR what God
has to say to them "personally", they need more than the written word,
I'm sorry. I mean no disrespect and if i have been offensive please forgive
me, but i have to say the truth. SO many still need to be healed, they
need teachers, prophets.. and people still need miracles!

But now you say:

They can hear what God has to say to them personally for today...through the bible. God's word is LIVING and ACTIVE (Heb 4:12), not dead letters on a page.

So if they needed the gifts before, what's changed?
That is the question. God's word being active and
alive means that it DOES what it says it will DO+++

No they don't need more than the written word.

Of course they do!

The bible is all the revelation we need:

Absurd.
I'm in the process of moving. Sure, I can use MY brain, MY experiences
and powers of deduction and "find" a place. But why would I do that when
I can ask God, and HE can show me that the place that SEEMS gorgeous
and perfect and cost effective etc, is actually the place that has the mold
problem hidden in the walls which will lead to illness and eventually eat
up all of my life savings (you get the idea)
No, the Bible isn't all of the revelation we need for power for living.

2 Tim 3:16 "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work."​

Indeed, and I am thoroughly equipped for every good work, but I need my SHEPERD to
LEAD me.. that's what Shepherds are for.

The bible doesn't just partially equip us, it thoroughly equips us. Not just for some good work, but for every good work. To say otherwise is to deny what God has promised.

it's 'equipped me" FOR .. the WORK
of the ministry, (this is the context of
that passage see Eph 4)

We still need to hear His voice
We still need gift of healing
We still need gift of miracles
We still need gift of faith
And the Scripture is how I found out,

 

[swordsman1]

So if they needed the gifts before, what's changed?

Not sure I follow you. Do you mean with regard to the gift of prophecy? They got the completed canon. That's what changed.

I'm in the process of moving. Sure, I can use MY brain, MY experiences
and powers of deduction and "find" a place. But why would I do that when
I can ask God, and HE can show me that the place that SEEMS gorgeous
and perfect and cost effective etc, is actually the place that has the mold
problem hidden in the walls which will lead to illness and eventually eat
up all of my life savings (you get the idea)
No, the Bible isn't all of the revelation we need for power for living.

Now this is getting silly. You need a revelation from God to tell you if a house has got hidden problems?!! What's wrong with getting a home inspector? Do you seek a revelation from God for practically every decision in life? Do you ask him what to have for dinner tomorrow? Do you ask him what color socks to put on in the morning? And when an impression or something pops into your head, that's the answer - "God told me....". Naive in the extreme, and totally unbiblical. Not to say dangerous.

God gave us a capacity for logic, decision-making, assessment, and intelligence. He expects us to use them. Do I, as an adult, have to ask my parents if I can buy some new clothes or not?

it's 'equipped me" FOR .. the WORK
of the ministry, (this is the context of
that passage see Eph 4)

No it is not just some good work, like ministry. It is for every good work. All the principles we need for successfully living the Christian life are contained in scripture. We just have to apply them. For all the other decisions in life such as what to have for dinner, he expects us to use our common sense.

2 Peter 1:3 “His divine power has given us everything we need for life and godliness through our knowledge of Him who called us by his own glory and goodness.”​

 

[sunlover1]

Not sure I follow you. Do you mean with regard to the gift of prophecy? They got the completed canon. That's what changed.

No, i'm talking about ALL of the gifts.
My point is, if the were to help PEOPLE,
well then they're still needed, and if they're
needed, our God provides.

Now this is getting silly. You need a revelation from God to tell you if a house has got hidden problems?!! What's wrong with getting a home inspector?

Can a home inspector tell me that the perv next door is going to try to rape me?
It's not silly, it's biblical
“In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.”

Do you seek a revelation from God for practically every decision in life?

INDEED! If I lack wisdom about a thing.

Do you ask him what color socks to put on in the morning? And when an impression or something pops into your head, that's the answer - "God told me....". Naive in the extreme, and totally unbiblical. Not to say dangerous.

Not to mention a total strawman...

God gave us a capacity for logic, decision-making, assessment, and intelligence. He expects us to use them. Do I, as an adult, have to ask my parents if I can buy some new clothes or not?

No, but I'm His child, and He says to ask (James 1:5)
I don't ask my earthly parents for guidance, but it's not
a bad idea, they've much more experience than I do

No it is not just some good work, like ministry. It is for every good work.

Well the commentators felt that in context, it refers to the work of the ministry, as stated
in Eph 4. I tend to agree with this, but certainly Scripture is much more than that too!
Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible
...Thoroughly furnished unto all good works, or "every good work"; particularly to the work of the ministry, which is a good one; and to every part and branch of it, ...

Jameson Faucett Brown Bible Commentary
17. man of God—(See on [2505]1Ti 6:11).
perfect, throughly furnished—Greek, "thoroughly perfected," and so "perfect." The man of God is perfectly accoutred out of Scripture for his work, whether he be a minister (compare 2Ti 4:2 with 2Ti 3:16) or a spiritual layman. No oral tradition is needed to be added.

Pulpit Commentary:
As regards the question whetherthe man of God is restricted in its meaning to the minister of Christ, or comprehends all Christians, two things seem to decide in favour of the former: the one that "the man of God" is in the Old Testament invariably applied to prophets in the immediate service of God (see 1 Timothy 6:11, note); the other that in 1 Timothy 6:11 it undoubtedly refers to Timothy in his character of chief pastor of the Church, and that here too the whole force of the description of the uses and excellence of Holy Scripture is brought to bear upon the exhortations in ver. 14, "Continue thou in the things which thou hast heard," addressed to Timothy as the Bishop of the Ephesian Church (see, too, ch. 4:1-5, where it is abundantly clear that all that precedes was intended to bear directly upon Timothy's faithful and vigorous discharge of his office as an evangelist).

All the principles we need for successfully living the Christian life are contained in scripture.

yes, and if we're confused about those we ASK the Author and He TELLS us

We just have to apply them. For all the other decisions in life such as what to have for dinner, he expects us to use our common sense.

I mentioned big decisions, and He says to ASK HIM.
James 1:5
If you need wisdom, ask our generous God,
and he will give it to you.
He will not rebuke you for asking.

 

[swordsman1]

Well the commentators felt that in context, it refers to the work of the ministry, as stated
in Eph 4. I tend to agree with this, but certainly Scripture is much more than that too!
Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible
...Thoroughly furnished unto all good works, or "every good work"; particularly to the work of the ministry, which is a good one; and to every part and branch of it, ...

Jameson Faucett Brown Bible Commentary
17. man of God—(See on [2505]1Ti 6:11).
perfect, throughly furnished—Greek, "thoroughly perfected," and so "perfect." The man of God is perfectly accoutred out of Scripture for his work, whether he be a minister (compare 2Ti 4:2 with 2Ti 3:16) or a spiritual layman. No oral tradition is needed to be added.

Pulpit Commentary:
As regards the question whetherthe man of God is restricted in its meaning to the minister of Christ, or comprehends all Christians, two things seem to decide in favour of the former: the one that "the man of God" is in the Old Testament invariably applied to prophets in the immediate service of God (see 1 Timothy 6:11, note); the other that in 1 Timothy 6:11 it undoubtedly refers to Timothy in his character of chief pastor of the Church, and that here too the whole force of the description of the uses and excellence of Holy Scripture is brought to bear upon the exhortations in ver. 14, "Continue thou in the things which thou hast heard," addressed to Timothy as the Bishop of the Ephesian Church (see, too, ch. 4:1-5, where it is abundantly clear that all that precedes was intended to bear directly upon Timothy's faithful and vigorous discharge of his office as an evangelist).

I'd agree with Gill - scripture equips for every good work; "particularly" (but not exclusively) for ministry. And JFB - it equips not just ministers but also laymen. In the Pulpit Commentary there are two additional commentaries from other authors:

"That the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work."

1. The design is the perfection of the believer in life and service. The description supplies the man of God with all due appliances for this end. They help to make us perfect in knowledge, faith, and holiness, as well as to furnish us with wisdom and guidance in all holy service.

2. Inference to be drawn from the design of Scripture. It is a perfect, a plain, a sufficient rule of faith and life, in answer to Roman Catholics. If it can make wise to salvation, perfect the man of God, and furnish him for all holy work, then there is no need for tradition to supplement its imaginary defects.—T.C.​

And

"That the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work." The man of God is man according to the Divine idea. Many excellences go to make the complete man, intellectual, emotional, practical. God desires to see the complete man; and he has given the Bible for that end. The completeness thought of is that of man as a worker, producing good thoughts, good words, good actions. God desires to see the completely furnished worker, and he has given the Bible for that end. It is true that we come very far short of the Divine ideal of our humanity; the reason will be found to be that we neglect the help provided for us. We do not consult God, but our own prejudiced thoughts. Let us go back to the Bible, to be convicted of our error, and corrected, and severely exercised toward the complete man.—R.F.​

yes, and if we're confused about those we ASK the Author and He TELLS us

We shouldn't be confused if we search and study the bible diligently. All the necessary principles sufficient to lead complete Christian lives are there. If something is obviously not covered (eg deciding which car to buy) we use common sense or get advice from wiser people. Not do something unbiblical and dangerous like waiting for impressions to pop into your head, believing it is a revelation from God. That is worse than flipping a coin.

I mentioned big decisions, and He says to ASK HIM.
James 1:5
If you need wisdom, ask our generous God,
and he will give it to you.
He will not rebuke you for asking.

Yes. Pray for wisdom. Then we can boldly make a decision using 'sanctified common sense'.

 

[sunlover1]

I'd agree with Gill - scripture equips for every good work; "particularly" (but not exclusively) for ministry. And JFB - it equips not just ministers but also laymen. In the Pulpit Commentary there are two additional commentaries from other authors:

"That the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work."

1. The design is the perfection of the believer in life and service. The description supplies the man of God with all due appliances for this end. They help to make us perfect in knowledge, faith, and holiness, as well as to furnish us with wisdom and guidance in all holy service.

2. Inference to be drawn from the design of Scripture. It is a perfect, a plain, a sufficient rule of faith and life, in answer to Roman Catholics. If it can make wise to salvation, perfect the man of God, and furnish him for all holy work, then there is no need for tradition to supplement its imaginary defects.—T.C.​

And

"That the man of God may be complete, furnished completely unto every good work." The man of God is man according to the Divine idea. Many excellences go to make the complete man, intellectual, emotional, practical. God desires to see the complete man; and he has given the Bible for that end. The completeness thought of is that of man as a worker, producing good thoughts, good words, good actions. God desires to see the completely furnished worker, and he has given the Bible for that end. It is true that we come very far short of the Divine ideal of our humanity; the reason will be found to be that we neglect the help provided for us. We do not consult God, but our own prejudiced thoughts. Let us go back to the Bible, to be convicted of our error, and corrected, and severely exercised toward the complete man.—R.F.​

​

And I hope you'll consider the rest of the commentators views as well.
Overwhelmingly in favor of that being pretty much as I originally said it was.

We shouldn't be confused if we search and study the bible diligently.

Oh shoot, even the disciples got confused hearing it from His Lips lol.
And then God would "explain" it to Him. He still does that!
Remember, if any lack wisdom.. they should ask GOD!

All the necessary principles sufficient to lead complete Christian lives are there. If something is obviously not covered (eg deciding which car to buy) we use common sense or get advice from wiser people.

Or the wisest of all, our Father!
I assumed everyone asked God the Father for help with Scripture, for help when making
a big decision, for help in times of trouble.. etc.

Not do something unbiblical and dangerous like waiting for impressions to pop into your head, believing it is a revelation from God. That is worse than flipping a coin.

Strawman.
Not suggesting such a thing.

Yes. Pray for wisdom. Then we can boldly make a decision using 'sanctified common sense'.

And either way, all things work together for our good!

 

[swordsman1]

And I hope you'll consider the rest of the commentators views as well.
Overwhelmingly in favor of that being pretty much as I originally said it was.

Are you referring to the two other commentators in the Pulpit Commentary? I don't think they support your view at all. Scripture thoroughly equips us all for every good work, not just those in ministry.

"The design is the perfection of the believer in life and service.... to furnish us with wisdom and guidance in all holy service....It is a perfect, a plain, a sufficient rule of faith and life......it can..perfect the man of God, and furnish him for all holy work"

"God desires to see the complete man; and he has given the Bible for that end....producing good thoughts, good words, good actions.....We do not consult God, but our own prejudiced thoughts. Let us go back to the Bible...."​

Oh shoot, even the disciples got confused hearing it from His Lips lol.
And then God would "explain" it to Him. He still does that!

The disciples were not confused after Pentecost and the Holy Spirit was given. They became the wisest humans on the planet. They wrote the New Testament! And there is no need for us to be confused if we study what they wrote.

Remember, if any lack wisdom.. they should ask GOD!

Absolutely. Ask for wisdom. And He will give it to us.

Or the wisest of all, our Father!
I assumed everyone asked God the Father for help with Scripture, for help when making
a big decision, for help in times of trouble.. etc.

No, we get help from human counselors as well...

Proverbs 12:15. "The way of fools seems right to them, but the wise listen to advice."

Proverbs 15:22 "Plans fail for lack of counsel, but with many advisers they succeed."

Prov. 24:5-6 "A wise man is strong, And a man of knowledge increases power. For by wise guidance you will wage war, And in abundance of counselors there is victory." ​

Strawman.
Not suggesting such a thing.

Could have fooled me.

 

[sunlover1]

The disciples were not confused after Pentecost and the Holy Spirit was given. They became the wisest humans on the planet.

Is this something from the Bible that I've missed?
Please advise!

​

​

 

[swordsman1]

Is this something from the Bible that I've missed?
Please advise!

John 14:26 "But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you."

Acts 1:8 "But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”

Acts 4:13 "Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were uneducated, common men, they were astonished. And they recognized that they had been with Jesus."

Acts 4:33 "With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all"

Acts 16:4 "As they traveled from town to town, they delivered the decisions reached by the apostles and elders in Jerusalem for the people to obey."

1 Cor 3:10 "By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder"

1 Cor 12:28 "And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second..."​

They were not weak confused disciples any longer. They became the bold leaders of the Christian faith, whose teaching we follow.

 

[sunlover1]

John 14:26 "But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you."​

Doesn't say that they were the wisest men on the planet.

Acts 1:8 "But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”

This says that they'll receive power.. be witnesses.
We all have that same Spirit.

Acts 4:13 "Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were uneducated, common men, they were astonished. And they recognized that they had been with Jesus."

It says that they were BOLD, not wisest men alive, not incapable of becoming confused.

Acts 4:33 "With great power the apostles continued to testify to the resurrection of the Lord Jesus. And God’s grace was so powerfully at work in them all"

Great power!
God's grace!
but still mere mortals

They were not weak confused disciples any longer.
They became the bold leaders of the Christian faith,
whose teaching we follow.

Yes they were endued with power from on High, and so
are we! We too have that same Spirit.

You said that they were "not confused after Pentecost and the Holy Spirit was given. They became the wisest humans on the planet."
That's simply not true. They continued to sin, make mistakes, etc.
They were greatly used of God, but they were mere mortals.

 

[swordsman1]

The point is the disciples were no longer weak and confused. They became mature Christians. They didn't seek a revelation for every decision they had to make. And that was in the age when, in the absence of the New Testament, new revelation was commonplace. They were wise enough to make them on their own.

When the disciples needed to replace Judas they didn't seek a revelation. They used reasoning and common sense and narrowed it down to two men. Even when they were completely undecided about which of the two to choose, they still didn't seek a revelation, but with prayer decided to cast lots.

When the apostles were finding the workload too much they didn't seek a revelation to solve the problem. They discussed the matter, and used their own wisdom to choose seven deacons (Acts 6:1-6).

When Peter returned to Jerusalem to tell the other apostles about the Holy Spirit falling on the gentiles, they didn't seek a revelation but followed Peter's logic and decided among themselves to accept the gentiles.

When they heard the case for the gentiles not having to convert to Judaism, they didn't seek a revelation. Instead they reasoned together (Acts 15:6), consulted the scriptures (Acts 15:15-17), and made a decision (Acts 15:19–20).

There are numerous other examples where they made decisions without seeking a revelation. We should follow their example.

 

[sunlover1]

The point is the disciples were no longer weak and confused. They became mature Christians.

And mature Christians receive counsel and instruction from God
I will instruct you and teach you in the way which you should go;
I will counsel you with My eye upon you. Do not be as the horse or
as the mule which have no understanding, Whose trappings include
bit and bridle to hold them in check, Otherwise they will not come
near to you.

They didn't seek a revelation for every decision they had to make.

I don't know what they did or did not seek, and neither do you.

They were wise enough to make them on their own.

Wise men are instructed by God:

And your ears shall hear a word behind you, saying,
“This is the way, walk in it,” when you turn to the right
or when you turn to the left.

Let the wise hear and increase in learning,
and the one who understands obtain guidance, ...

I will instruct you and teach you in the way you should go;
I will counsel you with my eye upon you.

And the Lord will guide you continually and satisfy your
desire in scorched places and make your bones strong;
and you shall be like a watered garden, like a spring of
water, whose waters do not fail.

We all need God's instruction/direction.
Even the disciples did.

When the disciples needed to replace Judas they didn't seek a revelation. They used reasoning and common sense and narrowed it down to two men. Even when they were completely undecided about which of the two to choose, they still didn't seek a revelation, but with prayer decided to cast lots.

"WITH PRAYER"
They sought God.
For what? For instruction/help/guidance/direction
call it whatever you like.

When the apostles were finding the workload too much they didn't seek a revelation to solve the problem. They discussed the matter, and used their own wisdom to choose seven deacons

And indeed, I do that very same thing.
I just figure junk out myself.
But i can't figure EVERYthing out,
in that case, I go to the Father for HIS
guidance

When Peter returned to Jerusalem to tell the other apostles about the Holy Spirit falling on the gentiles, they didn't seek a revelation but followed Peter's logic and decided among themselves to accept the gentiles.

When they heard the case for the gentiles not having to convert to Judaism, they didn't seek a revelation. Instead they reasoned together (Acts 15:6), consulted the scriptures (Acts 15:15-17), and made a decision (Acts 15:19–20).

There are numerous other examples where they made decisions without seeking a revelation. We should follow their example.

There's nothing wrong with asking God for help when you need it.

 

[swordsman1]

And mature Christians receive counsel and instruction from God
I will instruct you and teach you in the way which you should go;
I will counsel you with My eye upon you. Do not be as the horse or
as the mule which have no understanding, Whose trappings include
bit and bridle to hold them in check, Otherwise they will not come
near to you.

And what is the biblical means of attaining His counsel and instruction? Not impressions popping into our heads that's for sure. How about..

Isaiah 8:20 "Consult God's instruction and the testimony of warning. If anyone does not speak according to this word, they have no light of dawn."

2 Tim 3.16 "All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness"

Colossians 3:16 "Let the word of Christ richly dwell within you, with all wisdom teaching and admonishing one another"​

There's nothing wrong with asking God for help when you need it.

Indeed. Nothing wrong with praying for guidance if you need it. It is the unbiblical methods by which you think He supplies that guidance that is the problem.

 

[sunlover1]

And what is the biblical means of attaining His counsel and instruction? Not impressions popping into our heads that's for sure.

not what anyone has said, so this is a straw man.

​

Indeed. Nothing wrong with praying for guidance if you need it. It is the unbiblical methods by which you think He supplies that guidance that is the problem.

No, there's no problem. God can lead us by whatever means He chooses,
he's not limited to your narrow understanding.
Thanks for the discussion.
We've covered everything