brinny

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I was reading Luke 22 today, and there was verse 22:

"And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!"

Now the one who betrayed Jesus is Judas.

As i was meditating on this, this thought came to mind:

Did Judas commit the unforgivable sin?
 

Albion

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As i was meditating on this, this thought came to mind:

Did Judas commit the unforgivable sin?
I'd say no. The reason for the note of certainty in the verse would probably be because Judas' suicide was taken into account.
 
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Albion

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The question that is always asked is whether or not Judas could have been saved if, instead of committing suicide in his despair, he'd gone to Jesus and thrown himself onto the Lord's mercy, repenting of his sin of betraying him to the authorities and asking Jesus's forgiveness.
 
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dysert

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The question that is always asked is whether or not Judas could have been saved if, instead of committing suicide in his despair, he'd gone to Jesus and thrown himself onto the Lord's mercy, repenting of his sin of betraying him to the authorities and asking Jesus's forgiveness.
I think he would have been saved if he had done that. Instead, he's the perfect illustration of 2 Cor. 7:10, being consumed with the sorrow of the world.
 
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Albion

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I think he would have been saved if he had done that. Instead, he's the perfect illustration of 2 Cor. 7:10, being consumed with the sorrow of the world.

So, if we're right about that, his sin of betraying Christ can't be the unpardonable sin spoken of in scripture.
 
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com7fy8

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Hi, Brinny :) It is good to see you; God bless you :)

I believe the unforgivable sin has to do with how the evil people were claiming that the works of Jesus were not being done by the Holy Spirit, but by Satan's kingdom. Included in their such horrible and hateful and blasphemous stuff like that was how they loved money and the praise of humans. Also, they did not want Jesus to forgive people; so at the root of their blasphemy was unforgiveness, included.

Unforgiveness can keep a person from being forgiven > Mark 11:25.

So, I consider that blaspheming the Holy Spirit could be connected with love of money and unforgiveness and loving the praise of humans more than the approval of God.

Now . . . yes - - there are people who say that the real unforgivable sin is refusing the Holy Spirit to the point when the person dies without Jesus. Well, this, too, is refusing forgiveness, even if the person has not spoken in plain words against the Holy Spirit. And possibly the person who refuses Christ has been judging about who can be forgiven and who is not worth loving and forgiving. But love "hopes all things", we have in 1 Corinthians 13:7. The Holy Spirit has us having hope for any and all people, I consider from this scripture, Brinny.

So, included in Judas' problem, I would say, was he was not having hope and caring for any and all people. So, whether he in plain words spoke against the Holy Spirit or not, Brinny, he was against the Holy Spirit, by his nature. And our Apostle Paul says "we all" "were by nature children of wrath, just as the others," in Ephesians 2:1-3. So, the problem was not just if he did an actual blasphemy-speaking thing against the Holy Spirit, but how he was in his evil and selfish nature which could make him able to do that. Even if he did not, still he was of such a Satanic nature.

But even though we are children of God and we feel we would never speak against the Holy Spirit > still, there are things which we can get into, and which do grieve Him > our Apostle Paul does say >

"And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption." (Ephesians 4:30)

And in the next verse Paul gives a list of things which I understand can grieve the Holy Spirit, even if we do not actually blaspheme Him with words >

"Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice." (Ephesians 4:31)

And in the next verse, we have how the Holy Spirit will have us relating, instead . . . in God's own love >

"And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you." (Ephesians 4:32)

So, the Holy Spirit in us has us lovingly, tenderheartedly, forgiving one another - - - "even as God". So, it is good to not only be worrying about if we have blasphemed the Holy Spirit, but be busy with how the Holy Spirit has us lovingly forgiving, "even as God" :) The way our Father forgave us was not only that He gave us a clear record, but also He lovingly adopted us and is now sharing His very own love with us, "in our hearts" (Romans 5:5). So, we need to not only avoid speaking badly against His Holy Spirit, but also avoid being unforgiving, and instead be loving and tenderly caring for the ones we forgive, the way the Holy Spirit has us relating affectionately as family in Jesus :pray::groupray::prayer:
 
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Peter also "betrayed" the Lord but in a different way, as did all of the disciples.

Difference was Peter and the rest repented and returned to Jesus.

Judas expressed "sorrow", however it was a sorrow that did not lead to repentance.

When one repents, forgiveness is granted.
 
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Rick Otto

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I was reading Luke 22 today, and there was verse 22:

"And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!"

Now the one who betrayed Jesus is Judas.

As i was meditating on this, this thought came to mind:

Did Judas commit the unforgivable sin?
Maybe.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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I was reading Luke 22 today, and there was verse 22:

"And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!"

Now the one who betrayed Jesus is Judas.

As i was meditating on this, this thought came to mind:

Did Judas commit the unforgivable sin?
Not sure about him committing the unforgivable sin, but his name is also derived from the same word as "Judah" of which also the word "jew/jews" is from.

If I remember right, it was the Judean rulers that gave Jesus up to the Romans to be crucified.

John 19:
11 Jesus answered, "You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above;
for this reason he who delivered Me to you has the greater sin."
12 As a result of this Pilate made efforts to release Him, but the Jews cried out saying, "If you release this Man, you are no friend of Caesar;


http://www.herealittletherealittle.net/index.cfm?page_name=Lazarus
JESUS VS THE JUDEAN RULERS

..........While the significance of this seemingly pointless detail has been neglected by scholars throughout the centuries, you can be certain that it did not escape the notice of the Pharisees and scribes to which Yeshua was speaking. They thoroughly knew their history and were extremely proud of their heritage. Yeshua wanted those self-righteous Pharisees to know exactly who he was referring to with this parable.
This detail cements the identity of the rich man as the House of Judah, the Jews!............

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G2455&t=KJV
Number G2455 matches the Greek Ἰούδας (Ioudas), which occurs 42 times in 41 verses in the Greek concordance

The KJV translates Strongs G2455 in the following manner:
Judas (Iscariot) (22x), Juda (Son of Jacob) (7x), Judah (Son of Jacob) (1x), Judas (Son of Jacob) (2x), Judas (Brother of James) (3x), Jude (Brother of James) (1x), Judas Barsabas (3x), Juda (Ancestors of Jesus) (2x), misc (1x).

Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. Judah or Judas = "he shall be praised"
    1. the fourth son of Jacob
    2. Judas Iscariot, the apostle who betrayed Jesus

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G2453&t=KJV
Strong's Number G2453 matches the Greek Ἰουδαῖος (Ioudaios), which occurs 196 times in 187 verses in the Greek concordance

Ἰουδαῖος Ioudaîos, ee-oo-dah'-yos; from G2448 (in the sense of G2455 as a country); Judæan, i.e. belonging to Jehudah:—Jew(-ess), of Judæa.



.
 
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com7fy8 said in post 8:

I believe the unforgivable sin has to do with how the evil people were claiming that the works of Jesus were not being done by the Holy Spirit, but by Satan's kingdom.

That's right.

For blaspheming the Holy Spirit (Mark 3:29) means saying something against the Holy Spirit, which is unforgivable even if it is repented from (Mark 3:29), unlike all other blasphemies (Mark 3:28), such as blaspheming Jesus (saying something against Jesus), which is forgivable (like other sins) if it is repented from (Luke 12:10; cf. Luke 13:3, Hebrews 10:26-29).

An example of blaspheming the Holy Spirit (Mark 3:29) would be to say that a miracle performed by the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:28) was performed by an evil spirit (Mark 3:22,29-30). So it is possible for even a saved person to blaspheme the Holy Spirit, if, for example, he were to say that a Christian speaking in tongues today (by the Holy Spirit: 1 Corinthians 12:10b-11) is the work of an evil spirit (cf. 1 Corinthians 14:39b; 1 Thessalonians 5:19).

Regarding Judas, he may not have blasphemed the Holy Spirit, but he still ended up losing his salvation. For even though he started out as chosen/elect/saved/empowered like the other apostles (Luke 6:13-16, Mark 6:7-13, Matthew 19:28), he subsequently became a devil (John 6:70-71) who would ultimately become unsaved (Mark 14:21), because he wrongly employed his free will to begin to love money more than Jesus (John 12:3-6, Mark 14:3-11; cf. 1 Timothy 6:10, Matthew 6:24).

Also, he committed suicide (Matthew 27:5), which is self-murder. And "ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him" (1 John 3:15b).
 
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brinny

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The question that is always asked is whether or not Judas could have been saved if, instead of committing suicide in his despair, he'd gone to Jesus and thrown himself onto the Lord's mercy, repenting of his sin of betraying him to the authorities and asking Jesus's forgiveness.

THIS is what i was meditating on also......

he didn't SEEK Jesus to ask for forgiveness...

how tragic is THAT??!!
 
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Soyeong

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I was reading Luke 22 today, and there was verse 22:

"And truly the Son of man goeth, as it was determined: but woe unto that man by whom he is betrayed!"

Now the one who betrayed Jesus is Judas.

As i was meditating on this, this thought came to mind:

Did Judas commit the unforgivable sin?

I consider the unforgivable sin to be unbelief because it cuts someone off from their very means forgiveness. Another unforgivable sin is unforgiveness because if we don't forgive others, then God will not forgive us.
 
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brinny

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This may sound weird, but as i was just meditating on this, what came to mind for me is pride.

What else would keep Judas from going to Jesus to seek forgiveness?
 
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brinny

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That's right.

For blaspheming the Holy Spirit (Mark 3:29) means saying something against the Holy Spirit, which is unforgivable even if it is repented from (Mark 3:29), unlike all other blasphemies (Mark 3:28), such as blaspheming Jesus (saying something against Jesus), which is forgivable (like other sins) if it is repented from (Luke 12:10; cf. Luke 13:3, Hebrews 10:26-29).

An example of blaspheming the Holy Spirit (Mark 3:29) would be to say that a miracle performed by the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:28) was performed by an evil spirit (Mark 3:22,29-30). So it is possible for even a saved person to blaspheme the Holy Spirit, if, for example, he were to say that a Christian speaking in tongues today (by the Holy Spirit: 1 Corinthians 12:10b-11) is the work of an evil spirit (cf. 1 Corinthians 14:39b; 1 Thessalonians 5:19).

Regarding Judas, he may not have blasphemed the Holy Spirit, but he still ended up losing his salvation. For even though he started out as chosen/elect/saved/empowered like the other apostles (Luke 6:13-16, Mark 6:7-13, Matthew 19:28), he subsequently became a devil (John 6:70-71) who would ultimately become unsaved (Mark 14:21), because he wrongly employed his free will to begin to love money more than Jesus (John 12:3-6, Mark 14:3-11; cf. 1 Timothy 6:10, Matthew 6:24).

Also, he committed suicide (Matthew 27:5), which is self-murder. And "ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him" (1 John 3:15b).

Was he ever saved?
 
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brinny

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Peter also "betrayed" the Lord but in a different way, as did all of the disciples.

Difference was Peter and the rest repented and returned to Jesus.

Judas expressed "sorrow", however it was a sorrow that did not lead to repentance.

When one repents, forgiveness is granted.

THIS is exactly what i've been meditating on.....
 
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brinny

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Not sure about him committing the unforgivable sin, but his name is also derived from the same word as "Judah" of which also the word "jew/jews" is from.

If I remember right, it was the Judean rulers that gave Jesus up to the Romans to be crucified.

John 19:
11 Jesus answered, "You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above;
for this reason he who delivered Me to you has the greater sin."
12 As a result of this Pilate made efforts to release Him, but the Jews cried out saying, "If you release this Man, you are no friend of Caesar;


http://www.herealittletherealittle.net/index.cfm?page_name=Lazarus
JESUS VS THE JUDEAN RULERS

..........While the significance of this seemingly pointless detail has been neglected by scholars throughout the centuries, you can be certain that it did not escape the notice of the Pharisees and scribes to which Yeshua was speaking. They thoroughly knew their history and were extremely proud of their heritage. Yeshua wanted those self-righteous Pharisees to know exactly who he was referring to with this parable.
This detail cements the identity of the rich man as the House of Judah, the Jews!............

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G2455&t=KJV
Number G2455 matches the Greek Ἰούδας (Ioudas), which occurs 42 times in 41 verses in the Greek concordance

The KJV translates Strongs G2455 in the following manner:
Judas (Iscariot) (22x), Juda (Son of Jacob) (7x), Judah (Son of Jacob) (1x), Judas (Son of Jacob) (2x), Judas (Brother of James) (3x), Jude (Brother of James) (1x), Judas Barsabas (3x), Juda (Ancestors of Jesus) (2x), misc (1x).

Outline of Biblical Usage [?]
  1. Judah or Judas = "he shall be praised"
    1. the fourth son of Jacob
    2. Judas Iscariot, the apostle who betrayed Jesus

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/Lexicon/Lexicon.cfm?strongs=G2453&t=KJV
Strong's Number G2453 matches the Greek Ἰουδαῖος (Ioudaios), which occurs 196 times in 187 verses in the Greek concordance

Ἰουδαῖος Ioudaîos, ee-oo-dah'-yos; from G2448 (in the sense of G2455 as a country); Judæan, i.e. belonging to Jehudah:—Jew(-ess), of Judæa.



.

That's just it....

meditating on this very thing...

like what this unforgivable sin is, exactly...

lots to study on....

interesting info on the meaning of names :D
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Peter also "betrayed" the Lord but in a different way, as did all of the disciples.

Difference was Peter and the rest repented and returned to Jesus.

Judas expressed "sorrow", however it was a sorrow that did not lead to repentance.

When one repents, forgiveness is granted.
He may not have repented, but he was remorseful enough to hang himself after giving the money back to the corrupt murderous Judean rulers.
I still believe "JUDAS" was symbolic of the Judean rulers in that they gave Jesus up to be crucified and only then did Judas realize he had done a great wrong...IMHO.

http://biblehub.com/matthew/27-8.htm

Matt 27:
2 They bound Him, led Him away, and handed Him over to Pilate the governor.
3 When Judas, who had betrayed Him, saw that Jesus was condemned, he was filled with remorse and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the Chief Priests and Elders.

4 “I have sinned by betraying innocent blood,” he said.
“What is that to us?” they replied, “You bear the responsibility.”
5 So Judas threw the silver into the temple and left. Then he went away and hanged himself.
6 The chief priests picked up the pieces of silver and said, “It is unlawful to put this into the treasury, since it is blood” money.
7 After conferring together, they used the money to buy the potter’s field as a burial place for foreigners.

8 That is why it has been called the Field of Blood to this day.
9 Then what was spoken through Jeremiah the prophet was fulfilled: “They took the thirty pieces of silver, the price set on Him by the people of Israel,

Acts 1:

15 In those days Peter stood up among jthe brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said,
16 “Brothers, the Scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David concerning Judas, who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus.
17 For he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in nthis ministry.”
18 (Now this man acquired a field with the reward of his wickedness, and falling headlong he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out.
19 And it became known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the field was called in their own language Akeldama, that is, Field of Blood.)
20 “For it is written in the Book of Psalms,

“‘May his camp become desolate,
and let there be no one to dwell in it’;
and“‘Let another take his office.’


21 So one of the men who have accompanied us during all the time that the Lord Jesus went in and out among us.................................

https://carm.org/bible-difficulties/potters-field

Who bought the Potter's Field: Judas or the Jews?






.
 
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He may not have repented, but he was remorseful enough to hang himself after giving the money back to the corrupt murderous Judean rulers.
This is probably true, but we don't consider regret in itself to be repentance or an act of asking for forgiveness, nor do we consider 'just anything' that you might do as a result of regret to be morally acceptable.
 
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