How do you PRAY in TONGUES?

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Ark100

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So true. I just feel a bit sorry and really upset for people who listen to the ignorant ones say the things they say. I know a lot of people dissuade, and discourage people this way in real life out there.

Its so ignorant, and i cannot even believe what I just read by 'grayangel'

The Holy Spirit lays it heavily on my heart, and I know what that guy said is SO wrong. I JUST pray the Lord will minister the truth to him before he starts deceiving people ignorantly.
 
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GrayAngel

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So true. I just feel a bit sorry and really upset for people who listen to the ignorant ones say the things they say. I know a lot of people dissuade, and discourage people this way in real life out there.

Its so ignorant, and i cannot even believe what I just read by 'grayangel'

The Holy Spirit lays it heavily on my heart, and I know what that guy said is SO wrong. I JUST pray the Lord will minister the truth to him before he starts deceiving people ignorantly.

You just KNOW it huh? Well, too bad scripture agrees with what the "Holy Spirit" (or in reality, your personal feelings and preferences) is telling you. If you want the truth, let's talk scripture and stop with the baseless accusations of ignorance. I'm 95% sure I'm a lot more knowledgeable than most of you give me credit for. But heck, even if I was a world renowned Bible scholar, there'd still be arrogant people who'd claim I'm ignorant because I don't agree with them.

Point number 1#: Do all Christians speak in tongues? Answer: No. Evidence:

1 Corinthians 12:12-31 - Just as a body, though one, has many parts, but all its many parts form one body, so it is with Christ. For we were all baptized by one Spirit so as to form one body—whether Jews or Gentiles, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink. Even so the body is not made up of one part but of many.

Now if the foot should say, “Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. And if the ear should say, “Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body,” it would not for that reason stop being part of the body. If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? But in fact God has placed the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. If they were all one part, where would the body be? As it is, there are many parts, but one body.

The eye cannot say to the hand, “I don’t need you!” And the head cannot say to the feet, “I don’t need you!” On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has put the body together, giving greater honor to the parts that lacked it, so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.

Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. And God has placed in the church first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, of helping, of guidance, and of different kinds of tongues. Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret? Now eagerly desire the greater gifts.


2# - What is the purpose of the gift of tongues? Answer: For the purpose of ministering to the unbelievers. Evidence:

1 Corinthians 14:21-25 - In the Law it is written:

“With other tongues
and through the lips of foreigners
I will speak to this people,
but even then they will not listen to me,
says the Lord.”

Tongues, then, are a sign, not for believers but for unbelievers; prophecy, however, is not for unbelievers but for believers. So if the whole church comes together and everyone speaks in tongues, and inquirers or unbelievers come in, will they not say that you are out of your mind? But if an unbeliever or an inquirer comes in while everyone is prophesying, they are convicted of sin and are brought under judgment by all, as the secrets of their hearts are laid bare. So they will fall down and worship God, exclaiming, “God is really among you!”


See that little part where Paul says unbelievers walking in to a congregation speaking in tongues would think they're mad and leave? Yeah. That's what exactly happens. Even I would want to turn and leave when I see people doing that, and I grew up around it.

And if you're still in doubt of the true purpose of the gift, here's Paul saying that speaking in tongues without an interpreter is pointless:

v. 6-9 - Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction? Even in the case of lifeless things that make sounds, such as the pipe or harp, how will anyone know what tune is being played unless there is a distinction in the notes? Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air.

i.e. babbling stupidly.

3# - How does Paul say the gift of tongues should be used? Answer: Sparingly, and only if there is an interpreter.

1 Corinthians 14:27-28 - If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and to God.

Starting to think I'm not the ignorant one among us...?

Now just for fun, let's tackle that one verse people love to take out of context.

1 Corinthians 13:1 - If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal.

Sounds like Paul is saying that we can speak in the languages of tongues, right? That means when I say "Uwah wika lokoko chowakila" it really means something!

Wrong. Read the whole paragraph:

1 Corinthians 13:1-3 - If I speak in the tongues of men or of angels, but do not have love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. If I have the gift of prophecy and can fathom all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have a faith that can move mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. If I give all I possess to the poor and give over my body to hardship that I may boast, but do not have love, I gain nothing.

Paul is not saying that it is possible to speak in the tongues of angels. You can tell from the structure of this paragraph that he's creating the most exaggerated scenario he can think of. He's saying if he could not only speak in every human tongue but also the tongues of heaven, if he lacked love then he would have nothing. We can no more easily speak in the tongues of angels (assuming they exist, which Paul didn't say either) than we can "fathom all mysteries and all knowledge."
 
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GrayAngel

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Gentleness, kindness, and patience can be a choice we make.

Speaking in tongues isn't a choice.

This thread needs better choices.

Peace
Mercy
Grace
Light
Truth
Spirit
Love
God be with you all.

When there was a group saying that new converts must be circumcised, wasn't it Paul who said he wished that "they would go the whole way and emasculate themselves?"

Paul didn't like it when scripture was being messed around with, and neither do I, nor should any Christian. The proper interpretation of scripture, when it is clearly available as it is on this topic, should be guarded aggressively.

Of course, it is always preferable to remain as civil as possible (and avoid getting the topic locked), but certain people wouldn't allow that.
 
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briareos

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Gray

Starting to think I'm not the ignorant one among us...?
No... you aren't displaying anything anyone here isn't tired of responding to. This thread is 11 pages long everyone else got tired of arguing about this and some of us got reprimanded for talking the way you are... a while back.

and as far as I can tell you've only made 2 posts in this thread... no one allowed or refused you anything nor did they obligate what appears to be your initial post to be as selfish as it was. I could call you all sorts of names and laugh at you too if I wanted to but I won't.
 
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GrayAngel

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Gray

No... you aren't displaying anything anyone here isn't tired of responding to. This thread is 11 pages long everyone else got tired of arguing about this and some of us got reprimanded for talking the way you are... a while back.

and as far as I can tell you've only made 2 posts in this thread... no one allowed or refused you anything nor did they obligate what appears to be your initial post to be as selfish as it was. I could call you all sorts of names and laugh at you too if I wanted to but I won't.

If it's selfish to present the word of God unadulterated by personal opinion and bias, that's definitely me. But it seems all you people are capable of are taking unjustified cheap shots at me, so...whatever. People unwilling to learn will never change.

I love it when people start saying things like "You're so wrong, I can't even bother to write a well-thought-out response." Or when they put quotations around my name like they're being clever. If there's ever a sure sign you've won an argument, it's when the only thing left in their arsenal is to attempt to belittle you. The only thing missing is for someone to point out my young age, a factor they'd consider positive if I were on their side.
 
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You are completely misinformed. That verse does not describe speaking in tongues. If you are interested in the truth, then listen to what many Christians have been telling you. But if you'd rather go on believing in a lie, then go on and ignore us.

The verse you referenced says that the Holy Spirit will intercede for us. You assume this means it will cause us to babble nonsensible sounds that God will understand, but that's not what scripture says. What it says is that when we are stressed out, and we don't even know what to ask for, the Holy Spirit knows what we need.

Here we go again.. ^^, another who doesn't experienced it and judging that it is not.. ^^,

Excuse me Sir, many here on our CHURCH and many who speak in tongues experienced it.. ^^, they can't control their tongue, they just move and it feels like their tongue will came out through their mouth.. ^^, the words just flow, their not in control, their experiences was the HOLY SPIRIT is the ONE PRAYING they don't know what their DOING nor SAYING... BOOM!!! ^^,

Sorry but you are the misinformed. ^^, Because I don't have to make you believe in me. It is just between us and GOD,

our experiences RIGHT?

It is based on EXPERIENCE not on what you CLAIM to say because of the VERSE.. ^^, hayyyy over and over again..............



EXPERIENCED it FIRST..

GUYS how many times I've POSTED this?

"EXPERIENCE it FIRST Rom8:26?"

HAHA ^^,



You, my friend are way off limit and so wrong in many ways, its not even worth a long response.
I hope you are not preaching all the above to people? I really hope so, because its so ignorant, judgemental and utterly wrong. I hope the Lord will minister to you


Maybe ignore HIM?
He doesn't HOLD the TRUTH.
The way he REPLY and
the WAY he JUDGE the GIFT

He say as if HE has the GIFT
but I can say he JUST INTERPRETED
it, not BASED on HIS EXPERIENCE.

Hayyy T__T So sad to know that...

Yes it is right.. Just PRAY for
THOSE who DIDN't KNOW THE TRUTH
just judging the TRUTH.. hehe :)


Point number 1#: Do all Christians speak in tongues? Answer: No. Evidence:

1 Corinthians 12:12-31 - [/i]

Nice POINT there. But EVERYONE who BELIEVES can SPEAK in TONGUES.. ^^, Sorry SIR..

Mark 16:17
17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;


Sir before you POST make sure, YOUR SURE ^^,

Know WHY many CHRISTIANS don't have the GIFT of TONGUES???

James 4:2
2 You do not have because you do not ask God.


^^,

2# - What is the purpose of the gift of tongues? Answer: For the purpose of ministering to the unbelievers. Evidence:

Again SIR, HOPE you are READING THIS

"Sir before you POST make sure, YOUR SURE ^^,"

1 Corinthians 14:4
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves,

You sure that it is the ONLY PURPOSEEEEE????

WHATTTTT???? ^^,


AGAIN.

1 Corinthians 14:4
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves,

3# - How does Paul say the gift of tongues should be used? Answer: Sparingly, and only if there is an interpreter.


1 Corinthians 14:14
14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful.

Paul says the HE PRAY in the SPIRIT .. Do you AGREE?? ^^,

So, let us take a look at what PAUL said in this VERSE.. ^^,,

Ephesians 6:18
18 And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests.

Hmm.. ^^, Lalalalala


Then. Let us take a look at what verse you said.. Hihihi ^^,

1 Corinthians 14:27-28 - If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and to God.


If we should pray in tongues if there is only an INTERPRETER then PAUL would have not said that KEEP QUIET in THE CHURCH ^^,

He would probably say DO NOT SPEAK IN TONGUES...

Hmm.. You think GRAY??? ^^,


PLEASE be CAREFUL before you POST THANKS! ^^,
 
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GrayAngel

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Nice POINT there. But EVERYONE who BELIEVES can SPEAK in TONGUES.. ^^, Sorry SIR..

Mark 16:17
17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues;


Sir before you POST make sure, YOUR SURE ^^,

Know WHY many CHRISTIANS don't have the GIFT of TONGUES???

James 4:2
2 You do not have because you do not ask God.


^^,

I hope you don't mind my asking, but is English your first language?

Once again, you're ADDING to the verse what you would LIKE to see there. The verse you're reading says that these are the things that will be seen among those who believe, NOT that EVERYONE who believes will be able to do these things. It also says in the following verse that they will drink deadly poison and not be harmed. Can you do that?

Another important thing to note is that in chapter 16, verses 9-20 do not exist in the earliest manuscripts, meaning that they were likely added in later. So even if your verse said what you think it says, isn't real scripture anyway.

Mark 16 NIV - Jesus Has Risen - When the Sabbath was - Bible Gateway

As for James 4:2, I don't have a Lamborghini, either. Is that because I didn't ask for it?

Again SIR, HOPE you are READING THIS

"Sir before you POST make sure, YOUR SURE ^^,"

1 Corinthians 14:4
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves,

You sure that it is the ONLY PURPOSEEEEE????

WHATTTTT???? ^^,


AGAIN.

1 Corinthians 14:4
4 Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves,

Like all people who misquote scripture, you're quite good at cherry picking. If you'd read the verse IN CONTEXT maybe you'd learn something.

1 Corinthians 14:1-19 - Follow the way of love and eagerly desire gifts of the Spirit, especially prophecy. For anyone who speaks in a tongue does not speak to people but to God. Indeed, no one understands them; they utter mysteries by the Spirit. But the one who prophesies speaks to people for their strengthening, encouraging and comfort. Anyone who speaks in a tongue edifies themselves, but the one who prophesies edifies the church. I would like every one of you to speak in tongues, but I would rather have you prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be edified.

Now, brothers and sisters, if I come to you and speak in tongues, what good will I be to you, unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or word of instruction? Even in the case of lifeless things that make sounds, such as the pipe or harp, how will anyone know what tune is being played unless there is a distinction in the notes? Again, if the trumpet does not sound a clear call, who will get ready for battle? So it is with you. Unless you speak intelligible words with your tongue, how will anyone know what you are saying? You will just be speaking into the air. Undoubtedly there are all sorts of languages in the world, yet none of them is without meaning. If then I do not grasp the meaning of what someone is saying, I am a foreigner to the speaker, and the speaker is a foreigner to me. So it is with you. Since you are eager for gifts of the Spirit, try to excel in those that build up the church.

For this reason the one who speaks in a tongue should pray that they may interpret what they say. For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. So what shall I do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my understanding; I will sing with my spirit, but I will also sing with my understanding. Otherwise when you are praising God in the Spirit, how can someone else, who is now put in the position of an inquirer, say “Amen” to your thanksgiving, since they do not know what you are saying? You are giving thanks well enough, but no one else is edified.

I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. But in the church I would rather speak five intelligible words to instruct others than ten thousand words in a tongue.


That little snippet that you chose out of this means one thing. Paul is talking DOWN the usefulness of the gift of tongues, saying that it only edifies yourself, makes your faith increase, whereas he'd rather you edify the church. He is not saying that self-edification is the purpose of speaking in tongues.

1 Corinthians 14:14
14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful.

Paul says the HE PRAY in the SPIRIT .. Do you AGREE?? ^^,

So, let us take a look at what PAUL said in this VERSE.. ^^,,

Ephesians 6:18
18 And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests.

Hmm.. ^^, Lalalalala

If you had any idea what that verse was saying, you'd realize how much you just hurt your case.

1 Corinthians 14:13-17 - For this reason the one who speaks in a tongue should pray that they may interpret what they say. For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. So what shall I do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will also pray with my understanding; I will sing with my spirit, but I will also sing with my understanding. Otherwise when you are praising God in the Spirit, how can someone else, who is now put in the position of an inquirer, say “Amen” to your thanksgiving, since they do not know what you are saying? You are giving thanks well enough, but no one else is edified.

He's saying that if he's praying in the spirit, his mind does not benefit (it's "unfruitful") unless he has an interpreter. It is pointless.

Then. Let us take a look at what verse you said.. Hihihi ^^,

If we should pray in tongues if there is only an INTERPRETER then PAUL would have not said that KEEP QUIET in THE CHURCH ^^,

He would probably say DO NOT SPEAK IN TONGUES...

Hmm.. You think GRAY??? ^^,


PLEASE be CAREFUL before you POST THANKS! ^^,

Whether or not English is your first language, I know you're not stupid. Paul said very clearly, no more than two or three should speak in tongues in one meeting, or not at all if there is no interpreter. He left no elbow room for squirming at of this one.

1 Corinthians 14:7-28 - If anyone speaks in a tongue, two—or at the most three—should speak, one at a time, and someone must interpret. If there is no interpreter, the speaker should keep quiet in the church and speak to himself and to God.

Paul clearly did not want free-for-all screaming mumblers taking over the church service. They were to do what they were there to do in an organized manner, and if no one was around to interpret they wouldn't waste their time with useless gibber gabber.
 
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CounselorForChrist

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Well the truth is in the bible and people can choose to believe it however they want. You won't go to hell for it but I am sure God will ask you about it.

Whats sad is some people are litearlly arguing and judging others. I hear "iggnorant" being thrown around and other things that make it sound like the person is saying the other person isn't a real christian. Which is against forum rules. So sad.
 
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Hammster

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MOD HAT ON

If only we had a place where people could come and ask for advice and there would be no debating.

Oh, wait.

I see what y'all did there.

Closed to review the multiple violations.

ETA. The thread will be staying closed. Take it to the debate forums.

MOD HAT OFF
 
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