How do I respectfully teach an ex feminist to live more biblically?

[RedPonyDriver]

If women scare you because of feminism, I think it's you that has the problem, not feminism.

 

[Neostarwcc]

If women scare you because of feminism, I think it's you that has the problem, not feminism.

I'm not going to continue to feed the fire or give you the satisfaction of telling you exactly why I was scared. Either have something constructive to say about what's SUPPOSED to be discussed here or please go to one of the apparently many anti feminist threads. I'm not debating Feminism in this thread anymore.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Whatever ..

 

[HannahT]

mmbattlestar

Sounds like you have brought into a couple of stereotypes, and that scared you.

Christianity is suppose to teach believers about the bible. Movements like feminism - or any other one - won't. They speak about their cause. That's it. The bible teachings don't even come up. Your talking apples and oranges here.

No doubt there were some - what were they called again...OH yeah militant feminists - man haters and all that jazz. At times they were the vocal ones too. Yet, not even majority of women followed suit. You seem to be under the impression that they did. You were sold a bill of goods. I grew up watching the 1960's movement, and militants were few and far between even then in regular life. lol not the news, etc.

Find a way to become confident as a man - and your masculinity - and there really isn't much to be afraid of. Your point of view of feminism, and the stereotypes that you felt were fact - is what made things to haywire. God gives you everything you need, and he tells us NOT to FEAR! He is in our corner, and watching over us. Consuming fear is not a burden he asks you to take on. Jesus spoke of this too.

I remember when my brother was looking online - a couple of years after his wife was killed in a car accident - for men's groups. He had his groups in church, but he also wanted something else I guess. He came across some sites that downright appalled him. It might have been ME that told him about them, because I read a general mission statement. (Shrugs) I don't remember. He was blown away at the viewpoints they had about women. They were all gold diggers, only after your resources, will call the police and you will immediately go jail, etc. He was outraged at their attitudes even if they had a small grain of truth here and there. The overall message he snarked was the 'woman haters club' from Little Rascals all GROWN UP! They were downright toxic he said, and he still from time to time sees this group in the news.

He stated if I let that go to my head I never would have married, dated or anything else. I mean why?! Women are the enemy - the reason of the world's ruin! Yikers - people talk about women being drama queens, gossips, and nags. lol!

At any rate - if I listened to those men's groups that my brother ran into? I would be afraid of men in general. Wouldn't have anything to do with them. Yet, I know so many good men of character I would never group them together in a pot. That's not to say there aren't monsters out there too. Those you remove from your life. There are plenty left that aren't.

Jesus went against the grain as far as treatment of women - is why they say what they do. People were shocked at how he approached them without the cultural boundaries - not all the time, but you read about them in the bible. The woman at the well - was pretty much shunned from society. He had no problem taking water, and speaking to her. It was taboo at the time. That's just one example.

Your fear will run your life if you don't find a way to get control of it. Don't allow your mind to play games with you, and tell you that you can't. God says you can. God has in mind what he wishes you to be, and you will grow if you allow him.

Being rude to those that are responding to you will only allow yourself to keep all that contempt inside, and it will eat you alive. That - not faith - will rule your life. Remember humility, and not responding with wrath is also within scripture. It's required of all of us, and not dependent on anyone, their actions, their words, or their movements that they wish to participate in. lol it isn't the easiest part of scripture to follow, but it is still IN there in numerous places. It shows us how to show grace - and give it too. It gives us peace of mind, and heart.

 

[Neostarwcc]

Technically, I AM following God's path. That's why I came to these message boards for help, God told me to be here and lead me here. That's why I even tried helping my wife in the first place and that's why my wife is listening to me now. God also taught me that I've been treating my wife wrong and that I should change. While you may be right on the rude part, I only treated people the way I was being treated Luke 6:31.

Call me crazy if you want, But I've seen the truth. I went from barely Christian to a full fledged Atheist. Until one day I repented all of my sins and submitted myself to Jesus as my lord and savior. I begged him to cleanse me of my sins and I begged him to show me evidence that God really did exist. That night I saw the truth in my dreams. That night, I went up into the sky. That night, I saw a great big white light. That night, I saw the holy spirit enter inside me, and I felt happiness like I had never felt before and that I could not even describe to you and I felt my sins be washed away. That night, I saw the Silhouette of Jesus and that night, I was born again and I never EVER doubted the existence of God ever again. He had shown me the evidence that I needed to become faithful to him.

I've had many dreams since where angels have appeared to me. God has answered my prayers and God has given me my wife and my happiness.

God also lead me to the point where feminism is wrong which is why I've been openly discussing it on these boards. He also lead me into making several posts on here. So, to say that I'm wrong when I'm only following the path that the Lord commanded me to take is kind of offensive to me. Especially when people said "That is the problem, you cannot tell your wife what to do" God instructed me to do so. I just didn't do it in the respectful way he wanted and I made a mistake. Which, is also why I seemingly lashed out in anger.

That being said, I do apologize for losing my temper. But, I am only human. I am only a sinful human who makes many, many mistakes that the Lord is slowly guiding me into correcting. So that when I die, I can serve him in heaven. And if that is so wrong, I don't want to be right.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Was it God, bad pizza or Satan? Remember, Satan masquerades as an angel of light to decieve the brethern. You have been told and shown over and over where your views are incorrect by both men and women and you refuse their counsel. THAT is acting against biblical counsel. You must look at the WHOLE of scripture which had been pointed out to you over and over. I wash my hands of you as you are so stiff necked that you will not listen and learn.

 

[Neostarwcc]

So you're saying that Satan is capable of replicating that happiness? That Satan can replicate the holy spirit, and then form himself into the silhouette of Jesus without me noticing? That I repented my sins to Satan? And have been repenting my sins to Satan this entire time?

That Satan sent angels to me after prayer?

That, my entire views of scripture have been put upon me by Satan?

I am willing to listen to you. I always DID listen to you. But, I just find it extremely hard to believe.

Also, a majority of the people in this thread HAVE been trying to help and support me. Always notice, the only people that have been not and the people who have been against me following God's path were somehow feminists...

I HAVE listened to everyone in this thread, even if I acted in anger against some of them. And I am actively putting several of the suggestions into motion.

 

[Te're'sa]

This thread isn't really doing what you created it for anymore.

 

[HannahT]

While you may be right on the rude part, I only treated people the way I was being treated Luke 6:31.

31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

- that is what the verse says. It doesn't say if someone is ugly to me I can treat them ugly too. You treat people as you would wish to be treated. I think you may have misread that - it happens!

I'm not sure what you feel you are struggling with then - or why you started the thread. You said she was an EX Feminist. So, discussing feminism when she isn't one anymore? It's confusing.

I'd be JUST as confused if she came here and started a thread stating my EX Atheist husband needs to be taught to live more biblical. I mean since you are a Christian now. Then she goes on to list all the traits or stereotypes of the Atheist - which you no longer are - and so it no longer applies. Yet, she tries to tell us that is why she is afraid.

It tells me you don't forgive the past, and maybe are struggling with letting that go. That is human too. Maybe ask God to help you get over that part so you will be the husband YOU and SHE know you can be.

If you wanted to debate feminism - by all means plenty of people will do that for you. Yet, why now? It has nothing to do with the here and now.

The way you describe things in relation to your wife seems like coercion - not biblical instruction. I would think you don't speak to her like that in real life. The bible does show how we can guide people, but unless we are in a parent/child dynamic you don't 'tell them what to do'. You guide them, and God woo's them. Faith in our Lord allows us to know that he will take the wheel. lol that's NOT to say our guiding job is DONE! Yet, you have to allow him to do the HEAVY lifting!

Sounds like you have a lack of forgiveness towards her past, and that is a nut you need to crack...and get on with your life. You don't need to tell the world about the 'evils' about feminism. Your plate is full at home with a NEW kind of dynamic. Right?!

 

[HannahT]

So you're saying that Satan is capable of replicating that happiness? That Satan can replicate the holy spirit, and then form himself into the silhouette of Jesus without me noticing? That I repented my sins to Satan? And have been repenting my sins to Satan this entire time?

That Satan sent angels to me after prayer?

That, my entire views of scripture have been put upon me by Satan?

I am willing to listen to you. I always DID listen to you. But, I just find it extremely hard to believe.

Also, a majority of the people in this thread HAVE been trying to help and support me. Always notice, the only people that have been not and the people who have been against me following God's path were somehow feminists...

I HAVE listened to everyone in this thread, even if I acted in anger against some of them. And I am actively putting several of the suggestions into motion.

That is NOT what RedDriverPony said.

Remember, Satan masquerades as an angel of light to decieve the brethern.

That is spoke about in the bible. Satan Deceives. He manipulates. He lies.

The bible also speaks about false teachers - no doubt they masquerade too. Thus the description.

Don't take that to literal - as in all of your experiences are evil or what not. Legalism doesn't help. It's not that black and white. Yet, Satan could be trying to place a evil wedge between you and your wife - via her past as you see it. Would Satan not do that?

Yet, if you were ONCE an Atheist? Who better to attack to get them BACK on the other side? God puts LOVE in your heart, and yet you speak of hate. Contempt. Anger. Does God place those thoughts there? Nonsense - NO! There is only Righteous anger! Remember ALL Christians are constantly approached by the same things. lol that's why Christianity isn't such a cake walk! Good thing we have JESUS! We fall and he picks us UP again...of course as humans RINSE and REPEAT - Thank you Jesus! We will always be sinners.

You have been told and shown over and over where your views are incorrect by both men and women and you refuse their counsel. THAT is acting against biblical counsel.

The bible does speak of counsel. You have rebuffed many.

That doesn't mean you have to take the WHOLE of the counsel, but you do need to look for the endearing nuggets of knowledge and wisdom. Even people that we don't care for in their style of communication at times DO have good points! Don't find yourself so defensive that you can't hear it. lol its not easy, but it MUST be done!

You must look at the WHOLE of scripture which had been pointed out to you over and over.

Good point. Remember that verse you used with me the last time?

Let's ONLY look at part of the chapter in which you drew that from.

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. 29 If someone slaps you on one cheek, turn to them the other also. If someone takes your coat, do not withhold your shirt from them. 30 Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. 31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that.

Doesn't sound easy does it? It's not - as you know. It certainly isn't saying if someone treats me ugly - I can treat them the same WAY! In fact it says quite the opposite.

Yet, a always good reminder when someone is ugly. lol I read it again and again!

If you only nice to those that are nice to you? What credit is that for you? Anyone does that!

The bible asks us to go BEYOND it, and ABOVE it.

It's Satan that tells us the opposite.

 

[Dan Bert]

The first feminist was called Lilith. Because of her rebellion to the order of God she was cast out of the garden and became the demon of darkness and of Creatures of the night. And her name is also desolation.

So God took a rib from Eve...created for him and HELP-MEET....not his boss. This made Adam the mother and father of Eve...and also her husband and brother..That Eve would Love honor and obey her husband. There came a time when Eve thought she knew more than Adam and became deceived and Adam listened to Eve and chose to go into the Fall with her...

That is why God at the fall set the order...saying that Adam (man) should rule over Eve and that her desires should be to her husbands. (Aligned with her husband). To receive the honor in heaven to be called a daughter of Sara...who called her husband Abraham ...My lord. They must do the same on the earth. A prophecy for our times...from the Mouth of God by Isaiah.

Isaiah 3:12 - As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause [thee] to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.

Women throughout the ages have enlarged the mouth of hell..because they meddled in things they had no right to do. For example..Sarah did not wait on the promises of the Lord concerning having a son....seeing she was old...so she gave her servant Agar to Abraham to father a son for her. And Abraham did as she bid and Ishmael was born...the Originator of the Arab nations...who have been the scourge of the world for the last 1500 years.

I am not scared or intimidated by strong women. I know that the women of today have been deceived by Satan and by his inspired philosophies. Women today have become haughty, rebellious and un-ruly. This is due because the way Satan constructed society. They do not see when this society fall...and mechanical things cease to exist...that things will have to revert as it was in the beginning. God made man bigger and stronger than women...so that they would be able to do the hard labors required for the survival of the family.

Again as for you feminist...God will take your supports away...and you will see how you have been deceived by Satan...and why you could not find true happiness and joy that were yours by inheritance.

You adopted children because you had not the faith of the Ancients who also were childless into their old age. And even though these received only one child...but what a child it was...For Elizabeth it was John the Baptist,,,,Mary was also born of aged parents so were many prophets and holy men of the bible..

We are to overcome the world. And live according to how God said we should. To do otherwise is to fail to inherit the promises. God allows us at this time to do it our way...but there shall be penalties to it.

Dan

First, welcome to Christian Forums and the Married Couples forum!


First thing - when a husband tells a woman about "her place", it is not a good feeling at all. If you hold to that marriage model, a pastor or marriage counselor should have discussed that beforehand. That said, you are now married, yet in a place where you both disagree with the roles of men and women. Be careful about telling a woman what "her place" is. I consider my husband to be the spiritual head of our house - but he has NEVER told me what "my place" is as a wife. If you state things in a demeaning way, intentionally or unintentionally, it makes sense that she would take offense. I don't know how you phrased it, but it sounds like it may not have been phrased properly based on the rest of your post.



So the tarot cards and witchcraft are not right; I'll give you that much. On what way was she disrespectful? Do you mean that she didn't see men as the heads of the house and that women and men weren't equal?



Careful here - don't judge someone else's salvation!



You say she dropped out of university. Did you ask her to do that?? Is that what you told her she needed to do to respect you? Have you considered that some of us struggle with keeping house, and it may not be intentional? Also, consider that you both should work on that and that a "woman's place" isn't necessarily cooking / cleaning / raising children. Even in a marriage following the male leadership model doesn't mean that a woman is necessarily the main person responsible for that. It's good that she is not practicing witchcraft. That said, you shouldn't be "instructing her". Be a leader, yes. Encourage her, yes. Love her more than your own life - YES. Instructing her...well, be careful with that.


I think I will likely be one of the more mild responses here, and even I feel defensive for your wife when reading this. A wife should respect her husband, but you shouldn't demand it. You should love her more than yourself and consider what is best for her needs as well.

Why do you feel the need to control the finances? Where does it scripturally say that is the man's job? Even the scriptures describing "a good wife" shows her running the household and keeping tabs on the workers of the home. It implies hat this would include managing money in it as well. A healthy marriage considers what each other is best at, and divies out the duties that way. This is applicable to all marriages, including ones that follow the model of the husband being the spiritual head.


Wow. Yea, it sounds like you don't treat her with respect. I am reminded how blessed I am to have my husband. I struggle with cleaning, but my husband is encouraging. He sees my improvements and thanks me for all I do. He takes care of his own mess and helps with joint cleaning. In this same manner, I help him with learning about cutting back on spending money and being more economical. I also encourage him in this. The same thing happens in various areas of our marriage.

Ultimately, I respect him wholeheartedly and I will trust his decisions. That said, he recognizes my strengths and wants me to make decisions in areas that are my strengths. If he vetoed it, I would follow his lead. In over a year of marriage, he has never exercised that choice, despite me being willing to accept his lead.

I'll reiterate about the cleaning: when you struggle with that, it isn't an easy transition. If we try and get better, it helps to have encouragement, not someone saying we aren't doing enough. If you get frustrated with how something is looking cleanliness-wise, consider suggesting that you both take some time to clean things up together. Thank her when she does better. Don't disparage her for not being perfect immediately.

Love her more than yourself. Be willing to have your own self die for her. My pastor said in our marriage sermon - You (pointing to me) submit. You (pointing to my husband) die. That is the only way a husband spiritual head model works. You put her needs before yours. She trusts and respects you willingly. You acknowledge her strengths and encourage her. She acknowledges her weaknesses and works on them. The same applies the opposite direction.

Consider how a husband should act according to the Biblical model you are following. Fix the way you are supposed to act, and I believe her response will adjust as well.

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Where is Lilith in the bible?

 

[Dan Bert]

"I only treated people as I was treated" This is of the law of Retaliation...and it belonged in the laws of Moses. You are not justified in the eyes of God unless you are able to live the whole law of Moses. And that is the trap....no man is able to live the whole law of Moses. in the New Testament it is written that the law of Moses was to be only a schoolteacher unto Christ (Teachings of Jesus)

Jesus taught opposite to this law...He said to turn the other cheek..that is how we overcome the world...by learning to fight spiritually the forces of evil. Not only are we to turn the other cheek..we are to pray for them who miss-treat and miss use us. Nothing is an accident God sends them our way for us to improve and learn more patience, build more faith and to trust more in God.

dan.

31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

- that is what the verse says. It doesn't say if someone is ugly to me I can treat them ugly too. You treat people as you would wish to be treated. I think you may have misread that - it happens!

I'm not sure what you feel you are struggling with then - or why you started the thread. You said she was an EX Feminist. So, discussing feminism when she isn't one anymore? It's confusing.

I'd be JUST as confused if she came here and started a thread stating my EX Atheist husband needs to be taught to live more biblical. I mean since you are a Christian now. Then she goes on to list all the traits or stereotypes of the Atheist - which you no longer are - and so it no longer applies. Yet, she tries to tell us that is why she is afraid.

It tells me you don't forgive the past, and maybe are struggling with letting that go. That is human too. Maybe ask God to help you get over that part so you will be the husband YOU and SHE know you can be.

If you wanted to debate feminism - by all means plenty of people will do that for you. Yet, why now? It has nothing to do with the here and now.

The way you describe things in relation to your wife seems like coercion - not biblical instruction. I would think you don't speak to her like that in real life. The bible does show how we can guide people, but unless we are in a parent/child dynamic you don't 'tell them what to do'. You guide them, and God woo's them. Faith in our Lord allows us to know that he will take the wheel. lol that's NOT to say our guiding job is DONE! Yet, you have to allow him to do the HEAVY lifting!

Sounds like you have a lack of forgiveness towards her past, and that is a nut you need to crack...and get on with your life. You don't need to tell the world about the 'evils' about feminism. Your plate is full at home with a NEW kind of dynamic. Right?!

 

[HannahT]

He is taking scripture out of context RedPonyDriver. Anyone can do that.

 

[Dan Bert]

She is mentioned in passing by Isaiah. Just like the words Watchers are not mentioned in the bible very often. It is obvious the ancients had access to knowledge and writings that the world at large do not have today. The books of Enoch has been restored to us...and so we have a little bit more on watchers. There are teachings that come from God which is reserved only to them who are really thirsting and hungering for more. Only to these will the mysteries be given to.

dan

Where is Lilith in the bible?

 

[HannahT]

Where in Isaiah - in passing?

She is Jewish Folklore!

 

[RedPonyDriver]

Sorry dude...not playing the gnostic game. I checked a variety of translations and "lilith" only appears in one translation and not as a proper name. Try again and show me where it is used as a proper name. The translations use "night watcher", "night bird" and "night monster". Nothing about a human woman.

 

[All4Christ]

The first feminist was called Lilith. Because of her rebellion to the order of God she was cast out of the garden and became the demon of darkness and of Creatures of the night. And her name is also desolation.

So God took a rib from Eve...created for him and HELP-MEET....not his boss. This made Adam the mother and father of Eve...and also her husband and brother..That Eve would Love honor and obey her husband. There came a time when Eve thought she knew more than Adam and became deceived and Adam listened to Eve and chose to go into the Fall with her...

That is why God at the fall set the order...saying that Adam (man) should rule over Eve and that her desires should be to her husbands. (Aligned with her husband). To receive the honor in heaven to be called a daughter of Sara...who called her husband Abraham ...My lord. They must do the same on the earth. A prophecy for our times...from the Mouth of God by Isaiah.

Isaiah 3:12 - As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them. O my people, they which lead thee cause [thee] to err, and destroy the way of thy paths.

Women throughout the ages have enlarged the mouth of hell..because they meddled in things they had no right to do. For example..Sarah did not wait on the promises of the Lord concerning having a son....seeing she was old...so she gave her servant Agar to Abraham to father a son for her. And Abraham did as she bid and Ishmael was born...the Originator of the Arab nations...who have been the scourge of the world for the last 1500 years.

I am not scared or intimidated by strong women. I know that the women of today have been deceived by Satan and by his inspired philosophies. Women today have become haughty, rebellious and un-ruly. This is due because the way Satan constructed society. They do not see when this society fall...and mechanical things cease to exist...that things will have to revert as it was in the beginning. God made man bigger and stronger than women...so that they would be able to do the hard labors required for the survival of the family.

Again as for you feminist...God will take your supports away...and you will see how you have been deceived by Satan...and why you could not find true happiness and joy that were yours by inheritance.

You adopted children because you had not the faith of the Ancients who also were childless into their old age. And even though these received only one child...but what a child it was...For Elizabeth it was John the Baptist,,,,Mary was also born of aged parents so were many prophets and holy men of the bible..

We are to overcome the world. And live according to how God said we should. To do otherwise is to fail to inherit the promises. God allows us at this time to do it our way...but there shall be penalties to it.

Dan

Ok...

Nothing you said relates to my response. I'm not even a feminist! (Depending on the definition at least). I am a woman who follows the model of my husband being the head of the household. That doesn't mean he rules over me though. That also is MY choice. It's not a statement saying we aren't equal though. My husband doesn't lord over me.

You say that over the sages, women enlarged the mouth of Hell (??). Consider this: it was a woman (Mary) who obeyed the will of God and through her obedience bore our Savior. Through Christ's love, we are redeemed. God used a woman to fulfill his will in that.

And where did I say I adopted children???

 

[Dan Bert]

Ok...

Nothing you said relates to my response. I'm not even a feminist! (Depending on the definition at least). I am a woman who follows the model of my husband being the head of the household. That doesn't mean he rules over me though. That also is MY choice. It's not a statement saying we aren't equal though. My husband doesn't lord over me.

You say that over the sages, women enlarged the mouth of Hell (??). Consider this: it was a woman (Mary) who obeyed the will of God and through her obedience bore our Savior. Through Christ's love, we are redeemed. God used a woman to fulfill his will in that.

And where did I say I adopted children???

Where in Isaiah - in passing?

She is Jewish Folklore!

 

[HannahT]

(???)

Quoting two people means what? I'm confused.