How did they know Jesus was God?

[JoeP222w]

They knew that Jesus is God the same way we do today, by the revelation of the Holy Spirit and God transforming the heart of the individual.

Reference the disciples on the road to Emmaus in Luke 24. Jesus opened their eyes to the truth.

Luke 24:31 And their eyes were opened, and they recognized him. And he vanished from their sight.

 

[Greg J.]

Christians today have the benefit of so much history to confirm our faith that the Jesus that walked the earth 2000 years ago was God. If Jesus came today instead of 2000 years ago, how would you determine that a person that claimed to be God was really God? Certainly it has to be more than just a claim to be God, because many claimed this before Jesus came and many have done so even after he came. So how did Jesus convince people that he was the Messiah? I contend that Jesus followed OT convention, that two or more are needed to testify to what is true.

Here is my simple list of those that testified that Jesus was God.
1) Scripture, OT prophesies
2) Prophets/apostles John the Baptist, John the apostle and the others
3) Jesus' miracles, resurrection
4) Jesus' words, he taught with authority, he prophesied, he claimed to be God
5) God the Father
6) Good fruit

Any other ideas on how the world was changed and convinced that Jesus was God?

John 5:31 “If I[Jesus] testify about myself, my testimony is not true.
John 5:33 “You have sent to John and he has testified to the truth.
John 5:36 “I have testimony weightier than that of John. For the works that the Father has given me to finish—the very works that I am doing—testify that the Father has sent me.
John 5:37 And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form,
John 5:39 You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me,
Matthew 7:20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.

​

More food for thought. Is there any other religion or man that claimed to be God that has a tenth of the things that testify to their truth like that which Jesus had? Is this not proof that Christianity is the true religion of God?

Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. (John 14:11, 1984 NIV)

My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, so that your faith might not rest on men’s wisdom, but on God’s power. (1 Corinthians 2:4-5, 1984 NIV)

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. (John 14:11, 1984 NIV)

My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, so that your faith might not rest on men’s wisdom, but on God’s power. (1 Corinthians 2:4-5, 1984 NIV)

Miracles are a strong sign, but others have done miracles, so it is only one thing that testifies, and scripture says you need two or more.

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

How do you know Jesus was right in claiming to be God?
How do you know others that claimed to be God are wrong?

Scripture confirms this...faith means one accepts what scripture states.

Keep on ignoring the OP question along with half my post.

There was no NT in 30 AD. There was no scripture that says Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah.

Try again. How did the people listening to Jesus know he was the Messiah? How would they determine that others with the same claim were not the Messiah?

Can God's message not be taught to those that don't have faith?
Can any who does not have faith learn that Jesus was God?

Matthew 27:54 When the centurion and those with him who were guarding Jesus saw the earthquake and all that had happened, they were terrified, and exclaimed, “Surely he was the Son of God!”

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

There was no NT in 30 AD. There was no scripture that says Jesus of Nazareth was the Messiah.

Read the OT , TORAH, and NT.
Y'SHUA and many of the disciples , and some Jews TODAY, all proved Y'SHUA is MESSIAH from the TORAH, PROPHETS and PSALMS.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

Romans 1:4 says Christ was shown to be God by His Resurrection.

If you[r, I presume] Dad died and was in the grave for 4 days and the Pope came and raised him from the dead, would it be tough to believe?

Excellent point. However, in such a case, it would be tough to not believe in the Pope's power in such matters ('pull' with God, if nothing else).

In Jesus' case, there was no visible external intervention - no prayers or rituals of an Earthly or humanly perceivable nature - which resulted in Jesus's Resurrection. From all outward appearances, Jesus raised Himself.

Yes, later we hear from Paul that Jesus was raised by God (the Father, presumably). But since Jesus Christ is God (Second Person) that means in some sense He raised Himself.

All the miracles Jesus performed prior to His trail and death surely pointed to the truth of Jesus' nature. Several times, people spoke to Jesus saying something on the order of '... no one can do this sort of stuff unless one is of God'. Peter blurts it out in a private session with 'the group' (Matthew 16:16); one notes none of the other disciples argued with Peter or gave any indication they were not in agreement.

Paul points out, the Resurrection is the 'capper'.

And yes, I have some sympathy for Thomas. In truth, most everyone the Romans crucified stayed dead.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Be careful / don't / give credence to anyone raising the dead
when they are not abiding in Y'SHUA.(HIS POWER).

Missionaries to china, (and several posters on this forum)
have noted believers raising the dead once in a while.(in the last few years).

Missionaries to china (in the last 15 years) noted
that it is NOT JUST BELIEVERS RAISING THE DEAD AFTER 3 to 7 days in the morgue or hospital (really really dead).

Satan worshipers raise the dead every week there. (they far outnumber the followers of Y'SHUA in china.) .
And around the world.

The deceiver will have wonderful, spotless CREDENTIALS - ohh and ahh and "HEIL!" from all the churches and governments ..... (causing all the leaders of the nations to commit [spiritual] fornication (already done long time) ) ....

and will do miracles and healings and such.....
to deceive the whole world
and even the elect IF POSSIBLE !

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

Read the OT , TORAH, and NT.
Y'SHUA and many of the disciples , and some Jews TODAY, all proved Y'SHUA is MESSIAH from the TORAH, PROPHETS and PSALMS.

The OT taught of a Messiah coming in the future. It did not list his common name, who his parents were, what year he was to come. It did not identify the specific person Jesus as the Messiah. It identified characteristics and actions of the Messiah. More than just Jesus claimed to be the Messiah. Many thought him to make an earthly kingdom from this same scripture.

I will again ask the question, how would people in Jesus day know that he was the true Messiah spoken of in the OT?

If you think the OT so exact at identifying the specific person Jesus as the Messiah, can you reconcile Jesus' lack of a refuting that people knew where he was from, but they were to not know where the Messiah comes from?

John 7:27 But we know where this man is from; when the Messiah comes, no one will know where he is from.” 28 Then Jesus, still teaching in the temple courts, cried out, “Yes, you know me, and you know where I am from.​

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

Be careful / don't / give credence to anyone raising the dead
when they are not abiding in Y'SHUA.(HIS POWER).

Missionaries to china, (and several posters on this forum)
have noted believers raising the dead once in a while.(in the last few years).

Missionaries to china (in the last 15 years) noted
that it is NOT JUST BELIEVERS RAISING THE DEAD AFTER 3 to 7 days in the morgue or hospital (really really dead).

Satan worshipers raise the dead every week there. (they far outnumber the followers of Y'SHUA in china.) .
And around the world.

The deceiver will have wonderful, spotless CREDENTIALS - ohh and ahh and "HEIL!" from all the churches and governments ..... (causing all the leaders of the nations to commit [spiritual] fornication (already done long time) ) ....

and will do miracles and healings and such.....
to deceive the whole world
and even the elect IF POSSIBLE !

I don't know that Satan has true power to bring back one from the dead. I imagine he could raise up a spirit to act as an impostor though. Regardless, you state a miracle as not sufficient for determining if one is sent from God. So how would you, if in China, determine if one who raised a person from death was from God? I think just basing it on the "prophet" using Jesus' name as too simplistic.

Matthew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’​

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I don't know that Satan has true power to bring back one from the dead. I imagine he could raise up a spirit to act as an impostor though.

No. In africa and in china, people (dead bodies laying dead for several day, no heart beat etc)
are raised from the dead by witch doctors and pagans,
and continue from then just as
a person who has not died, whether for days, weeks or years,
...
whether they ever get saved is not reported.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

So how would you, if in China, determine if one who raised a person from death was from God?

It is most clear there. (they don't hide that they serve satan there - they are admitted satan worshipers / et al).
In the united states, it is best not to talk about.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

They knew that Jesus is God the same way we do today, by the revelation of the Holy Spirit and God transforming the heart of the individual.

Amein.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

28 Then Jesus, still teaching in the temple courts, cried out, “Yes, you know me, and you know where I am from.

compare:
28 Whereupon Jesus called out as He taught in the temple [a]">[a]porches], Do you know Me, and do you know where I am from? I have not come on My own authority and of My own accord and as self-appointed, but the One Who sent Me is true (real, genuine, steadfast); and Him you do not know!

29 I know Him [Myself] because I come from His [very] presence, and it was He [personally] Who sent Me.

30 Therefore they were eager to arrest Him, but no one laid a hand on Him, for His hour (time) had not yet come.

Footnotes:

1. John 7:28 Richard Trench, Synonyms of the New Testament.

Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)

28-29 Then Jesus, in the middle of his teaching, called out in the Temple, “So you know me and know where I have come from? But I have not come of my own accord; I am sent by one who is true and you do not know him! I do know him, because I come from him and he has sent me here.”

30-31 Then they attempted to arrest him, but actually no one laid a finger on him because the right moment had not yet come. Many of the crowd believed in him and kept on saying, “When Christ comes, is he going to show greater signs than this man?”
J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)

The New Testament in Modern English by J.B Phillips copyright ©
----------------------------------------------
(NOTE it is as a question in some)
---------------------------------------------
John 7:25-30Mounce Reverse-Interlinear New Testament (MOUNCE)
25 Then oun some tis of ek the ho people of Jerusalem Hierosolymitēs began to say legō, “ Is eimi not ou this houtos the man whom hos they are trying zēteō to kill apokteinō? 26 And kai look ide, he is speaking laleō boldly parrēsia and kai they are saying legō nothing oudeis to him autos. Is it possible mēpote that our ho rulers archōn know ginōskō for sure alēthōs that hoti this houtos man is eimi the ho Christ Christos? 27 Yet alla we know oida where this houtos man is eimi from pothen; when hotan the ho · de Christ Christos appears erchomai, no oudeis one will know ginōskō where pothen he is eimi from.” 28 Then oun Jesus Iēsous, as he was teaching didaskō in en the ho temple hieron, · ho cried out krazō, · kai saying legō, “ You know oida me kagō, and kai you know oida where pothen I am eimi from?
(looks better
at biblegateway format) >>
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+7:25-30&version=MOUNCE

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I will again ask the question, how would people in Jesus day know that he was the true Messiah spoken of in the OT?

Remember the woman at the well. (for several aspects).
She 'knew' and immediately went and told the whole town,
then
they came to see for themselves.
Then they knew because they saw for themselves.

Kind of like in some places in the world,
if someone comes to your house and says
come and see - there's a group of people who
live with GOD. (or who GOD lives with / or who have been with GOD/JESUS)

And you can trust them, or go see for yourself,
then know,
because the difference visually and in speech and in life
is observable.

 

[miknik5]

Miracles are a strong sign, but others have done miracles, so it is only one thing that testifies, and scripture says you need two or more.

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

Remember the woman at the well. (for several aspects).
She 'knew' and immediately went and told the whole town,
then
they came to see for themselves.
Then they knew because they saw for themselves.

Kind of like in some places in the world,
if someone comes to your house and says
come and see - there's a group of people who
live with GOD. (or who GOD lives with / or who have been with GOD/JESUS)

And you can trust them, or go see for yourself,
then know,
because the difference visually and in speech and in life
is observable.

John 4:17 “I have no husband,” she replied.
Jesus said to her, “You are right when you say you have no husband. 18 The fact is, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. What you have just said is quite true.”
19 “Sir,” the woman said, “I can see that you are a prophet.
​

What you skirt over in "she knew" is that Jesus demonstrated private knowledge of this woman's life, for it was something as she professed only a prophet would know. So you have indirectly answered my question with something that testified to Jesus being the Messiah.

But, understand she did not know without a sign and a claim.

 

[AnticipateHisComing]

compare:
28 Whereupon Jesus called out as He taught in the temple [a]">[a]porches], Do you know Me, and do you know where I am from? I have not come on My own authority and of My own accord and as self-appointed, but the One Who sent Me is true (real, genuine, steadfast); and Him you do not know!

29 I know Him [Myself] because I come from His [very] presence, and it was He [personally] Who sent Me.

30 Therefore they were eager to arrest Him, but no one laid a hand on Him, for His hour (time) had not yet come.

Footnotes:

1. John 7:28 Richard Trench, Synonyms of the New Testament.

Amplified Bible, Classic Edition (AMPC)

28-29 Then Jesus, in the middle of his teaching, called out in the Temple, “So you know me and know where I have come from? But I have not come of my own accord; I am sent by one who is true and you do not know him! I do know him, because I come from him and he has sent me here.”

30-31 Then they attempted to arrest him, but actually no one laid a finger on him because the right moment had not yet come. Many of the crowd believed in him and kept on saying, “When Christ comes, is he going to show greater signs than this man?”
J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)

The New Testament in Modern English by J.B Phillips copyright ©
----------------------------------------------
(NOTE it is as a question in some)
---------------------------------------------
John 7:25-30Mounce Reverse-Interlinear New Testament (MOUNCE)
25 Then oun some tis of ek the ho people of Jerusalem Hierosolymitēs began to say legō, “ Is eimi not ou this houtos the man whom hos they are trying zēteō to kill apokteinō? 26 And kai look ide, he is speaking laleō boldly parrēsia and kai they are saying legō nothing oudeis to him autos. Is it possible mēpote that our ho rulers archōn know ginōskō for sure alēthōs that hoti this houtos man is eimi the ho Christ Christos? 27 Yet alla we know oida where this houtos man is eimi from pothen; when hotan the ho · de Christ Christos appears erchomai, no oudeis one will know ginōskō where pothen he is eimi from.” 28 Then oun Jesus Iēsous, as he was teaching didaskō in en the ho temple hieron, · ho cried out krazō, · kai saying legō, “ You know oida me kagō, and kai you know oida where pothen I am eimi from?
(looks better
at biblegateway format) >>
https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=John+7:25-30&version=MOUNCE

Translations make no difference to my point that OT scripture was not clear enough such that those knowledgeable in scripture still had doubts that Jesus was the Messiah.

Further, can you explain why Jesus did not refute or correct their understanding of scripture that they would not know where the Messiah came from? Jesus elsewhere was very quick in correcting questions to him based on incorrect understandings of scripture.

 

[stephen583]

Certainly all the above posts correctly argue from a biblical standpoint Jesus was the Son of God. No question about that.

For those interested in an independent source of corroboration, I suggest they investigate the reports of the Roman historian Josephus. The Romans for all their bad attributes, were arguably fastidious record keepers and serious historians.

The Romans knew who Jesus was. They knew about the OT prophecies that foretold his coming, and that Jesus of Nazareth had fulfilled those prophecies. The notion Jesus was considered by the Romans to be just one of many Messiah figures they had to deal with amounts to historical revisionism.

Based on the miracles he performed, those which occurred at the instant of his death (darkening of the skies and an earthquake in Jerusalem), and the miracles that occurred afterwards, Josephus rightly concludes Jesus could not have possibly been a mere mortal man.

 

[Quid est Veritas?]

Certainly all the above posts correctly argue from a biblical standpoint Jesus was the Son of God. No question about that.

For those interested in an independent source of corroboration, I suggest they investigate the reports of the Roman historian Josephus. The Romans for all their bad attributes, were arguably fastidious record keepers and serious historians.

The Romans knew who Jesus was. They knew about the OT prophecies that foretold his coming, and that Jesus of Nazareth had fulfilled those prophecies. The notion Jesus was considered by the Romans to be just one of many Messiah figures they had to deal with amounts to historical revisionism.

Based on the miracles he performed, those which occurred at the instant of his death (darkening of the skies and an earthquake in Jerusalem), and the miracles that occurred afterwards, Josephus rightly concludes Jesus could not have possibly been a mere mortal man.

Firstly, Josephus was a Jew who gained favour with Vespasian after surrendering during the First Revolt. The Romans themselves did not know much about Jewish beliefs, most notably Pompey thought there would be an idol in the holy of holies of the temple when he desecrated it during his eastern campaigns.

Josephus mentions Jesus in two passages:

"About this time there lived Jesus, a wise man, if indeed one ought to call him a man. For he was one who performed surprising deeds and was a teacher of such people as accept the truth gladly. He won over many Jews and many of the Greeks. He was the Christ. And when, upon the accusation of the principal men among us, Pilate had condemned him to a cross, those who had first come to love him did not cease. He appeared to them spending a third day restored to life, for the prophets of God had foretold these things and a thousand other marvels about him. And the tribe of the Christians, so called after him, has still to this day not disappeared." - Flavius Josephus, Antiquities of the Jews.

The second merely references Jesus when talking of his brother James, so is not a direct report of Jesus.

So Josephus did not directly say what miracles were performed. There is also a question mark over the full authenticity of this passage as it is discordant with the Jewish nature of the rest of the work. Most historians think there was a legitimate reference to Jesus and his Crucifixion under Pilate, but think the report of his resurrection and being 'more than a man' was likely added by Christian copiers at a later date, about the 4th century.

 

[Quid est Veritas?]

Certainly all the above posts correctly argue from a biblical standpoint Jesus was the Son of God. No question about that.

For those interested in an independent source of corroboration, I suggest they investigate the reports of the Roman historian Josephus. The Romans for all their bad attributes, were arguably fastidious record keepers and serious historians.

The Romans knew who Jesus was. They knew about the OT prophecies that foretold his coming, and that Jesus of Nazareth had fulfilled those prophecies. The notion Jesus was considered by the Romans to be just one of many Messiah figures they had to deal with amounts to historical revisionism.

Based on the miracles he performed, those which occurred at the instant of his death (darkening of the skies and an earthquake in Jerusalem), and the miracles that occurred afterwards, Josephus rightly concludes Jesus could not have possibly been a mere mortal man.

Josephus also mentions a belief held by some Greeks, Egyptians and Romans that the Jews kept a donkey head in the Holy of Holies. This can be found in his work Against Apion.

"Apion hath the impudence to pretend that "the Jews placed an ass's head in their holy place;" and he affirms that this was discovered when Antiochus Epiphanes spoiled our temple, and found that ass's head there made of gold, and worth a great deal of money. To this my first answer shall be this, that had there been any such thing among us, an Egyptian ought by no means to have thrown it in our teeth, since an ass is not a more contemptible animal than furones and goats, and other such creatures, which among them are gods."

Some even suggested that the God of the Jews was the evil Set of Egyptian mythology. There was a lot of incorrect and biased information out there in the Greco-Roman world, which was part of the reason Josephus set about writing his histories.