Discussion Have you been given the Holy Spirit?

[ToBeLoved]

Well any deliberate sin committed by a Child of God is blaspheming the Holy Spirit, and can’t be forgiven.

That is not what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is. Incorrect again.

 

[Johnlove1]

That is not what blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is. Incorrect again.

Are you God, that makes your opinion right?

You need to discredit scripture to keep your understanding of forgiveness of sin right.

Need to ignore much of scripture to make yourself feel righteous if you sin?

Scripture that says a Child of God does not sin has to be ignored by people that can’t stop sinning, and want to believe he or she is righteous, and holy.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Are you God, that makes your opinion right?

You need to discredit scripture to keep your understanding of forgiveness of sin right.

Need to ignore much of scripture to make yourself feel righteous if you sin?

Scripture that says a Child of God does not sin has to be ignored by people that can’t stop sinning, and want to believe he or she is righteous, and holy.

Because the Bible talks about blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. So I know that your definition is not right.

Also, I do not need to discredit scripture to keep my understanding of forgiveness of sin. This is a standard belief held by 95% of Christians. You are in the tiny, tiny group who uses scripture to say that they do not sin. It is you who is using scripture to make your theology right.

Seems like you are now trying to turn the situation around by saying I am doing what you have in fact been doing. I can't think of the word for someone who does that...

 

[Johnlove1]

Because the Bible talks about blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. So I know that your definition is not right.

Also, I do not need to discredit scripture to keep my understanding of forgiveness of sin. This is a standard belief held by 95% of Christians. You are in the tiny, tiny group who uses scripture to say that they do not sin. It is you who is using scripture to make your theology right.

Seems like you are now trying to turn the situation around by saying I am doing what you have in fact been doing. I can't think of the word for someone who does that...

Can you explain how one can sin, and also be a Child of God?


Scripture says a Child of God can’t sin.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s”


Those are not my words.


There is much more scripture that tells us a Christian/Child of God can’t sin.

(1 John 3:8) “Whoever lives sinfully belongs to the devil, since thedevilhas been a sinner from the beginning. This was the purpose of the appearing of the Son of God, to undo the work of the devil.”

(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are

in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”

(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”


Yes I know that almost all of the Christians Church has bought the lie that Satan has taught about sin.

God is using me to tell the Church it has been following Satan’s lie.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Seems like you are now trying to turn the situation around by saying I am doing what you have in fact been doing. I can't think of the word for someone who does that...

Not trying to enter the fray, here, but I believe this is the word:

projection: the unconscious transfer of one's own desires or emotions to another person.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Can you explain how one can sin, and also be a Child of God?


Scripture says a Child of God can’t sin.


(1 John 3:9-10) “No one who has been begotten by God sins; because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God. In this way we distinguish the children of God from the children of the devil: anybody not living a holy life and not loving his brother is no child of God’s”


Those are not my words.


There is much more scripture that tells us a Christian/Child of God can’t sin.

(1 John 3:8) “Whoever lives sinfully belongs to the devil, since thedevilhas been a sinner from the beginning. This was the purpose of the appearing of the Son of God, to undo the work of the devil.”

(1 John 2:6) “But if anyone obeys his word, God’s love is truly made complete in him. This is how we know we are

in him: Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did”

(1 John 3:5-6) “Now you know that he appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen him or known him.”


Yes I know that almost all of the Christians Church has bought the lie that Satan has taught about sin.

God is using me to tell the Church it has been following Satan’s lie.

You are not changing the topic again. The people who have taken the time to hold a conversation with you have answered your questions, but you do not seem to be good enough to do the same. Isn't that misleading? To hold a conversation based on a give and take knowing that all you want to do is come here to give your opinion? That seems to be something someone does who sins.

 

[Johnlove1]

You are not changing the topic again. The people who have taken the time to hold a conversation with you have answered your questions, but you do not seem to be good enough to do the same. Isn't that misleading? To hold a conversation based on a give and take knowing that all you want to do is come here to give your opinion? That seems to be something someone does who sins.

Is that true, show me?

 

[hislegacy]

Is that true, show me?

That is relatively easy, just re-read your threads, but read the replies that you have been given, because it seems your are either ignoring them, or just not reading them all together.

I know - you want an example, glad you asked. You wrote:

(1 Corinthians 12:27-30) “Now you together are Christ’s body; but each of you is a different part of it. In the Church, God has given the first place to apostles, the second to prophets, the third to teachers; after them, miracles, and after them the gift of healing; helpers, good leaders, those with many languages. Are all of them apostles, or all of them prophets, or all of them teachers? Do all speak strange languages, and all interpret them?”

To which I replied and asked:

Why did you change scripture?

It reads

27 Now you are the body of Christ, and members individually. 28 And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues. 29 Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Are all workers of miracles? 30 Do all have gifts of healings? Do all speak with tongues? Do all interpret?

You never said why you changed the scripture?

I also asked repeatedly which is more accurate, you or scripture and you never replied.

Want to answer both of those questions?

No straw man here - just plain questions needing an answer.

 

[hislegacy]

Then if you would care to entertain another plain example see your other thread

Also show me in scripture where it says one who has been given the Holy Spirit means that it is an indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

.

I did answer you. I SAID ANYONE with the INDWELLING HOLY SPIRIT IS ONE of Christ's own.

What part of that do you not understand?

The HOLY SPIRIT testifies with OUR SPIRIT that we are Christ's own. Get that?

John 14:17

even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.

Titus 3:5
he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

Romans 8:15-17
For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God, 17 and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.

1 Corinthians 2:12
Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God.

So you now are throwing stones?
You did not answer my question about the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. Can’t find scripture that says it is an indwelling can you?

Are those good enough examples you asked for?

 

[hislegacy]

Do you still sin? You know that if you do that you are of the devil.


Assuming that you do sin, then there is no way I can discuss anything with you who is of the devil.


The devil will not accept the truth.


(1 John 3:8) “Whoever lives sinfully belongs to the devil, since thedevilhas been a sinner from the beginning. This was the purpose of the appearing of the Son of God, to undo the work of the devil.”

Your assumption is of the flesh and is in great error - which is a sin in itself - bearing false witness.

As I sit, I am sinless, ask Jesus, He will testify of such, for it it His blood that has made me sinless.

So we can discuss anything now.

 

[Johnlove1]

Your assumption is of the flesh and is in great error - which is a sin in itself - bearing false witness.

As I sit, I am sinless, ask Jesus, He will testify of such, for it it His blood that has made me sinless.

So we can discuss anything now.

Don’t give me that you are sinless because of Jesus blood.

I ask you do you keep God’s Commandments, and that includes do you commit any wrong doings?

 

[hislegacy]

Don’t give me that you are sinless because of Jesus blood.

I ask you do you keep God’s Commandments, and that includes do you commit any wrong doings?

Like bearing false witness?

Will you repent of your sin?

Again, if you speak to Jesus, He knows me by name and will answer your questions - who better to hear from

 

[Johnlove1]

Like bearing false witness?

Will you repent of your sin?

Again, if you speak to Jesus, He knows me by name and will answer your questions - who better to hear from

Jesus proclaimed me clean many years ago, and he has kept me clean.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Like bearing false witness?

Will you repent of your sin?

Again, if you speak to Jesus, He knows me by name and will answer your questions - who better to hear from

If someone bears false witness they are sinning and disobeying the 10 Commandments. Look like 'someone' is in trouble with his own theology. Let's see if he answers.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Jesus proclaimed me clean many years ago, and he has kept me clean.

Not true. I know my brother who you have said is of the devil and not one of God's own. You'll be lucky if he doesn't report you to the mod's for that.

That's bearing false witness. That's a sin. Jesus told the Pharisee's that what bothered him most is that they were hypocrites. Saying one thing and doing another.

 

[hislegacy]

Jesus proclaimed me clean many years ago, and he has kept me clean.

Then you just missed it didn't you - you bore false witness of me.

Will you repent or apologize?

As I've said three times now, ask Jesus, He knows me by name and can testify that I am not lying, but sinless.

You are calling me, a part of the Body of Christ, of the devil - how can that be, what will Jesus have to say about such things.

 

[hislegacy]

You ask for examples -

I provide the examples from your own posts and you say I am of the devil.

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

Jesus proclaimed me clean many years ago, and he has kept me clean.

You seem to ascribe to the Holiness Movement. Would that be correct?

 

[Gideons300]

I would like to enter this fray, not as another combatant, but to possibly build a bridge of explanation.

You see, John is correct in this regard. The scriptures say exactly what he is espousing. 1st John is a booger to get through without wincing, so we have trained ourselves to stop reading at 1 John 1:8 where we are told that if any man say he has no sin, he is a liar. "Ok! Enough 1st John!" LOL. We never read the context of what John is saying. Simply that if any man says he has no need for forgiveness for he is already sinless, you betcha, he IS a liar.

John, however, never meant that verse to be used against holiness, for immediately after, he says that he wills that we sin not! So.... if we actually do what he wants, for us to stop sinning, we are now liars? Was he mental, or are we misunderstanding?

Not enough ammo? Just read the next few chapters of 1st John with an honest heart. Out loud is best. See if you can come out of it unbloodied. Do not try to explain away, or dodge that gravity of what is being said. God hates sin and his plan is to get it out of us.... all sin. He wants us holy and He will do the work, but we must know this. We are about to be awoken to the fact we are in danger with sin in our lives and it is destroying our witness and blocking us from agape love flowing onto us and out of us. Please note, when I refer to sin, I am talking disobedience....the willful, 'I know it is wrong but I am just weak' type of sin. That must go. That is the razor edge between salvation and damnation. We are now entering the valley of decision, guys. Like it or not, this is what God tells us. He that sins has not yet come to know God, not in the way God is desiring. So John, thank you for reminding us of that long lost truth.

But brother, here is the deal. The truths shared in 1st John reveal a void in our modern day theology.... what do we do after we are saved? How do we stop sinning? What exercises do we do? What teaching do we need to not fall for satan's devices? Do you know what we, the church in all her wisdom, have concluded, what seems the current flavor of the month in our 'take' on the Christian message. What is it in a nutshell?

You did not do anything to get saved. You can do nothing to stay saved. For that matter, you can do nothing period. God is going to do what God is going to do, so lay back, relax, and soak in how good God is to let you do your own thing and know that even if you mess up, even willfully, knowing it to be wrong, it means NOTHING. You are saved so stop giving ear to any who say we have a scriptural based responsibility to seek to walk free of sin.

Did I sum it up fairly accurately? I truly mean no ill here. Let's face it. By and large, and praise God for the exceptions, we as a church have no desire for holiness. Our hearts are not broken for our failures... no.... our disobedience. We are living like the Paul of Romans 7, but not wailing like he did for deliverance from that shame and death-like behavior. In truth, we have made the very word 'holiness' legalistic sounding, smacking of works. We have accepted defeat, and because of our flesh, walking in full obedience is impossible. So we are told to rest short of the promised land, for it is a mirage till the day we die.

Do you not realize that who you address are simply sheep who are lost, trying their best to keep their heads above water, and you hand them a golden anchor? The real issue is that they have not been taught HOW to overcome. The potential is there. I am a horticulturist. In an acorn, all that the oak is, its potential, is hidden in the seed. In each of us destined for heaven, the new nature, Christ in you, is there. What does it need to grow? Rain. Trust me, many you now seem bent on frustrating and angering will soon blossom like worms coming out butterflies. God is revealing the truth of our new nature as we speak, and awakening His own to how to walk as an overcomer. Do not discourage. It is not love's best.

We all are in this together. In this amazing time, God is about to awaken us to who we really are and ask us to..... no, no... cause us to put off our old man, our self nature, and then stand fast in the faith that the old us is DEAD when satan comes tempting. His declared will for us is that we become established in the faith. and just as we are told in the word, the glorious result is that we will, each of us, even the weakest, will to their own amazement, overcome the world, the flesh and the devil.

You are chastening seeds for not possessing fruit. The seeds need water. Being correct in theology is wonderful, but is a low second fiddle to if the nature, the character of God's loving kindness seen in our own hearts? Not sinning is the beginning, not the end. It is the doorway into abiding, and for that we need a miracle, and before faith can be aroused in sheep, hope must first be birthed. To beat people over the head with truth that is out of season can make a great message.... and one every true believer WILL walk in.... something men dig in their heels NOT to listen. Not because deep inside them they would not love it to be true, but because as of yet, they simply have no hope of it ever being attainable.

All that is about to change.

Live, bones, live

Blessings to all

Gideon

Thanks for listening,

Gids

 

[Johnlove1]

You seem to ascribe to the Holiness Movement. Would that be correct?

NO!