Happiness in Heaven while Loved Ones Fry in Hell?

[Der Alte]

A reference isn't a name. It's where your quotes came from, as in chapter & verse, i.e. the book, chapter, section, paragraph line of the author's quote. Your quotes didn't even provide a link to a website. I suppose you just copied it from some site that left out all references.

This is ridiculous. You demanding someone provide "chapter & verse, i.e. the book, chapter, section, paragraph line of the author's quote" earlier,, you posted a long quote from Ramelli in post #822.
http://www.christianforums.com/thre...nes-fry-in-hell.7961825/page-42#post-70044708
She mentioned what several ECF and a few scholars allegedly believed but not a single "chapter & verse, i.e. the book, chapter, section, paragraph line of the author's quote"

 

[miknik5]

Your POV is absolutely not the context though. This man did build on the foundation of Jesus Christ, he was a believer, he was born again.

and yet at the end he will have to pass through the fires of purification? Why? I thought the work was being done NOW so that those who are HIS legitimate children who are being laundered
And pruned and purified and refined will stand before HIM on that day SPOTLESS: body, soul and spirit?

Scripture disagrees with your opinion.
1CO 3:11 For no other foundation can any one lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any one builds on/(Gr.epoikodomeo)the foundation with
Who is this 'any one' in context? It's the Christian who will be judged and SAVED by FIRE. And the words "BUILDS UPON" are consistent with the definition of the Greek word.
Strong's #2026 epoikodomeo:to build upon ie (fig) to rear up

the words "pay careful attention to THE FOUNDATION as per Haggai 2, Ezra 3 and Zechsriah 4 should have helped to deter those believers from adding to the FOUNDATION

But of course this thread was discussing unbelievers and a different type of fire

So whatever milk-toasted mis-translation you're quoting as 'added to the foundation', is simply not the Greek.
And what is dealt with in these "SAVING FIRES" of judgment, is the works which are of the devil, or the flesh, or of an unrenewed soul. And Christians abound in work for these saving fires.

christians abound in these types of works? Well they were supposed to bring all their works into THE LIGHT now and while they are alive
As to unbelievers, then whose works are they abounding in?

And what is their hope for salvation?

We think there is confusion with the term HELL ETERNAL...we fully understand judgment by "SAVING as by FIRE". A term which has nothing to do with 'blood of FORGIVENESS'. But that's another trail of truth missed with 'mono vision' of ETERNAL HELLers.

so Pharoah and his flock are fine! Their houses weren't marked by the blood but they will NOW be saved?

He is 'building on the FOUNDATION' he's standing on, but what he builds on that foundation is the garbage which must be burned up/off before he can be allowed in....the kingdom/life of God in the hereafter. IOW your whole post proves nothing contrary to our UR beliefs.[/QUOTE]

what do you make of this truth: God has transferred us out of the kingdom of darkness into the kingdom of Light in His Son whom HE loves

 

[Lazarus Short]

What would they have to do (while it is still the year of GOD's favor) in order for them not to die in their sins

Repent and begin to produce some of the fruits of the Spirit.

 

[miknik5]

No not at all, there are many enemies of the cross. And a gospel from the pit of hell would qualify as one IMO. So what's the fruit of YOUR GOSPEL? The fruit of ours is GOD 'ultimately' WINS all, Devil 'ultimately' keeps none. Jesus has "the keys of hell and death" and Jesus isn't locking people up....He's setting them free.

And why did our former pastor express bewilderment at how I'd brought more people into his church than almost anyone in the whole congregation? How could I do that without 'scaring the hell out of them with eternal hell'? The same way Paul did, who never mentioned it once in writing 1/3 of the NT. Well, I say he never mentioned it, but that's not really true. YOUR false profit scribes couldn't translate HADES as hell this 'one time' because then it would have admitted that CHRISTIANS were getting out of it. But I'm sure you know what verse I'm speaking of and have dealt with it....right?

Oh, almost forgot, and why did I bring so many to pastor's congregation? Because I wanted to be a participant in working WITH GOD to accomplish HIS WILL and his COUNSEL.

ROM 10:14 But how are men to call upon him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without a preacher?

FWI "a preacher" certainly isn't talking about 'your pastor'.

Then there is no book of LIFE!

 

[miknik5]

Repent and begin to produce some of the fruits of the Spirit.

Repent and produce fruit?

Showing themselves to be?

And yet apart from HIM what fruit can a branch produce if it is apart from HIM?

 

[Lazarus Short]

Then there is no book of LIFE!

How does that follow on from Jesus having keys and freeing people? The Book of Life contains the names of those who are saved at that point in time, or that is my understanding.

 

[Lazarus Short]

Repent and produce fruit?

Showing themselves to be?

And yet apart from HIM what fruit can a branch produce if it is apart from HIM?

That is where repentance comes in.

 

[miknik5]

Keep in mind what John the Baptist said: Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world. (John 1:29). A search thru the rest of the NT will reveal other purposes, such as Him giving us more abundant lives.

and John the Baptist also said to those who did not repent and were not baptized: who told you to flee from the COMING WRATH as well as further defining the LORD's work as such: HE will baptize with the HOLY SPIRIT and with fire, His winnowing fork is in his hands and HE will gather HIS wheat into HIS BARN but burn up the chaff with unquenchable Fire

 

[miknik5]

How does that follow on from Jesus having keys and freeing people? The Book of Life contains the names of those who are saved at that point in time, or that is my understanding.

It doesn't follow Hillsage's all will ultimately be saved "gospel"which is why I responded as such. Since we do know by the word that those names that were NOT found in the Book of LIFE were cast into the lake of fire where the false prophet and beast had been thrown many many many many years prior. Those two didn't rise in the final judgement. What leads us to believe that those who join the false prophet beast and Satan will ever rise to live again after the final judgement?

 

[miknik5]

That is where repentance comes in.

Repent and believe

Some don't
You are aware of that correct?

Which is why their feet aren't even on THE FOUNDATION to begin with.

 

[Radrook]

It takes a special mentality to approve of this!

 

[Lazarus Short]

It doesn't follow Hillsage's all will ultimately be saved "gospel"which is why I responded as such. Since we do know by the word that those names that were NOT found in the Book of LIFE were cast into the lake of fire where the false prophet and beast had been thrown many many many many years prior. Those two didn't rise in the final judgement. What leads us to believe that those who join the false prophet beast and Satan will ever rise to live again after the final judgement?

"Gospel" means Good News, does it not? Is it Good News only for those who believe? If some/most of humanity go to Hell, it means Bad News. However, I can find not a shred of evidence that the Damnationist Hell exists - all I see is slanted and biased translation and interpretation. God never created it, prescribed it, or threatened with it. It is an invention of Theology. I ask again:

If anyone is still dead and/or in Hell, how can Death (the last enemy) ever be defeated? But the Bible says it will.

If anyone is still dead and/or in Hell, how can God ever become All in all? But the Bible says He will.

 

[Lazarus Short]

Repent and believe

Some don't
You are aware of that correct?

Which is why their feet aren't even on THE FOUNDATION to begin with.

You are entirely right, as far as you say. Pardon me for asking, but...where in the Bible does it say that our chances are cut off at physical death? Does nothing change after resurrection? It makes as much sense to me to say that our eternal fate is fixed at death as it does to say that our life's path is influenced by where the stars are at our birth. Anyway, I have found no statement of it in the Bible.

 

[miknik5]

I'm sorry. Good News means good news!

If they do not see it as Good News it is not GOD's fault. HE was not secretive about it

God's Word and Promise, as well as the condemnation are clearly spoken in John 3:16 through John 3:21

 

[miknik5]

"Gospel" means Good News, does it not? Is it Good News only for those who believe? If some/most of humanity go to Hell, it means Bad News. However, I can find not a shred of evidence that the Damnationist Hell exists - all I see is slanted and biased translation and interpretation. God never created it, prescribed it, or threatened with it. It is an invention of Theology. I ask again:

If anyone is still dead and/or in Hell, how can Death (the last enemy) ever be defeated? But the Bible says it will.

If anyone is still dead and/or in Hell, how can God ever become All in all? But the Bible says He will.

Please go back and reread. When All things have been accomplished, when all that is subject to THE SON is made subject to THE SON than will the SOM return the kingdom to The Father so that GOD may be All...in All

Christ said, I came not to bring peace but division.

Are all subject to Christ?
There are enemies of The Cross...there are Tares...there are those who hated Him without a cause

 

[miknik5]

Please also read Romans 10

 

[Hillsage]

I met one who said that if nobody went to hell, then she had avoided all those beautiful opportunities to have good time in vain.

Which simply reveals a 'heart issue'. They didn't come to the God of love for a loving relationship. They came to escape a fire torturing tyrant. And all the love talk is just a religious platitude.

 

[Hillsage]

Was it for our glory or HIS?

It was for His glory and your view would limit his glory. Our view maximizes his glory.

REV 15:4 Who shall not fear and glorify thy name, O Lord? For thou alone art holy. All nations shall come and worship thee, for thy judgments have been revealed."

You think the goal of His judgments are venting eternal wrath and torture. Out belief is his judgments are for teaching righteousness.

ISA 26:9 ....For when thy judgments are in the earth, the inhabitants of the world learn righteousness.

 

[Radrook]

Which simply reveals a 'heart issue'. They didn't come to the God of loving for a loving relationship. They came to escape a fire torturing tyrant. And all the love talk is just a religious platitude.

After she left in a huff of fury we discussed that statement at length and wondered why she would suddenly reveal such a thing.
Up to that point she had been saying that anything which the lord chose to do with her was alright with her. That people who burned forever deserved it because they had chosen not to listen. Then, suddenly, as if from nowhere, that sudden statement! weird!

 

[Hillsage]

The difference between the works wrought of the kingdom of LIGHT in THE SON from the works wrought of "another kingdom and father'"

The point of the scripture isn't to differentiate that there are two sources of 'kingdom works'. The point is the works of the devil's kingdom will be destroyed by the Son of Light.