1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a friendly forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting after you have posted 20 posts and have received 5 likes.
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Evolution and Santa Claus/ /Commonalities of Illusions

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by John MacNeil, Nov 6, 2002.

  1. John MacNeil

    John MacNeil New Member

    Messages:
    133
    Likes Received:
    0
    Santa, that jolly old fellow who lavishly distributes gifts to all the world's children, is a concept that was built on a real person's goodwill. The story of Mr.Claus has a history in several cultures and he always was presented as a benefactor of goodwill and boundless joy! While the spirit of Santa was born of goodwill, the presentation of Santa has been kidnapped by the merchants and they flog his representation, and his reputation, shamelessly in their pursuit of easy money. The whole idea of Christmas is being subjugated by merchants, which is to say Big Business, in an attempt to turn it into a crass orgy of greed in which climate they make fully a third of their yearly profits. The spirit of friendliness and love that should permeate the season is gradually being overshadowed by corporate lust for profit, as is evidenced by the ever earlier start to the holiday buying season, which now has the corporations and merchants setting up their Christmas displays before Halloween.

    Natural Selection, the scientific observation that species breed and pass on their better traits to their offspring, thereby, over extended periods of time and through succeeding generations, improving the efficiency of the species and the liklihood that succeeding generations would be better adapted to their environment and hence would be more likely to have a favorable survival rate, has been distorted by some people to make their Evolution Theory. They have, for corporate and political reasons, denied the existence of all evidence that casts doubt on their evolution theory, even though such evidence is in abundance and evidence for evolution is non-existant. The proponents of evolution, for personal and professional profit, advocate for their theory even though they know it is wrong and that it is, in the long term, detrimental to the formative thought of young people and to society in general.

    The two theory began with altruistic motives, Santa Claus with spreading joy among the poor children, and natural selection with describing nature for science. The fact that both of them have been misused, and, indeed, abused, is a sorry commentary on the morals of society that they would let things advance to such a sorry state.

    The one, Santa, seems like a harmless lie that is told to children in countries where conspicuous consumption is now the norm. A problem it creates is that the way it is marketed it turns children into mindless consumers of much that they don't need and it ingrains that consuming behavior into them and makes it all but inevitable that they will pass on that behavior to their children. If all children in the world shared in such goodwill and wealth, then perhaps it wouldn't be so harmful.

    The young people who are indoctrinated with the make-believe theory of evolution, which is willfully expanded from the recorded scientific observations of natural selection, will believe in that theory as they believed in Santa Claus, even though there is no direct evidence to prove the theory. The corporate/science controls the belief in the theory by directing funding to favorable projects and complient researchers. They control the publishers and decide what will be written in text books and they thereby control the minds of the populace by controlling what they are allowed to learn. The ultimate aim is the same for controlling Santa Claus. And that aim is money and power.

    Christmas and corporate/science are two of the largest grossing cash cows that the manipulators possess. In both, money is not the only objective. A corollary to the money is control of society, and that may be as important to the greedy people as the money, for it leaves the mainstream population susceptible to other manipulations. The big problem with such societal manipulations is that it doesn't allow science to advance apace of it's collective human knowledge, but it retards it and, as it's main focus, has it investigating lines of inquiry that are predetermined to return scant knowledge.
     
  2. Chris†opher Paul

    Chris†opher Paul Based on a True Story

    Messages:
    10,760
    Likes Received:
    0
    How do these people make money off of evolution?
     
  3. sampo

    sampo Think for yourself!!

    Messages:
    408
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Atheist
    The funny thing is, with a little word substitution, the tale takes on a whole new (and far more applicable) meaning. Allow me to demonstrate....

    Fundamentalism and Creation science are two of the largest grossing cash cows that the manipulators possess. In both, money is not the only objective. A corollary to the money is control of society, and that may be as important to the greedy people as the money, for it leaves the mainstream population susceptible to other manipulations. The big problem with such societal manipulations is that it doesn't allow science to advance apace of it's collective human knowledge, but it retards it and, as it's main focus, has it investigating lines of inquiry that are predetermined to return scant knowledge.
     
  4. LiveFreeOrDie

    LiveFreeOrDie Science Officer

    Messages:
    980
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm with souljah on this one. How do they make money off of evolution, John?
     
  5. Chris H

    Chris H New Member

    Messages:
    239
    Likes Received:
    0
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Politics:
    US-Democrat
    Faith:
    Agnostic
    John, would you please post some serious evidence so we may have an in depth conversation?

    Chris
     
  6. Smilin

    Smilin Spirit of the Wolf

    Messages:
    6,568
    Likes Received:
    91
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Faith:
    Atheist
    now I'VE SEEN EVERYTHING....blame it all on SANTIE CLAWS...

    Okay...time to break out my Physics argument for the existance of Santie...

    /me rummages through his barrell of useless mathematical theorums.....hang on....
     
  7. Smilin

    Smilin Spirit of the Wolf

    Messages:
    6,568
    Likes Received:
    91
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Faith:
    Atheist
    I'd agree with the money that's made off of the YEC movement.  Just go to the Christians book store and see how many are cashing in.
     
  8. Smilin

    Smilin Spirit of the Wolf

    Messages:
    6,568
    Likes Received:
    91
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Faith:
    Atheist
    My theory would be that if you take a dollar bill...wait long enough (several billion years...it will eventually turn into a nice retirement stassh)

     

     :D :D

    (humor break people)
     
  9. WinAce

    WinAce Just an old legend...

    Messages:
    1,092
    Likes Received:
    44
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Politics:
    US-Others
    Faith:
    Atheist
  10. sampo

    sampo Think for yourself!!

    Messages:
    408
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Atheist
    Bee-yoo-ti-ful!

    [applauseapplauseapplause]
     
  11. Late_Cretaceous

    Late_Cretaceous <font color="#880000" ></font&g

    Messages:
    1,969
    Likes Received:
    93
    Faith:
    Catholic
    But, but.....   Santa Claus is real.  I know he is.  I once sat on his lap.
     
  12. chickenman

    chickenman evil unamerican

    Messages:
    1,406
    Likes Received:
    0
    hahahahahahaha
    ahahah
    aha

    oh boy

    macneil, I'm willing to bet that what you know about biology, evolution and the biotechnology industry could comfortably fit on the back of a postage stamp
     
  13. Morat

    Morat Untitled One

    Messages:
    2,737
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Atheist
      Well, he's shown he doesn't know what a 'species' is.

     
     
  14. John MacNeil

    John MacNeil New Member

    Messages:
    133
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Christmas season is glaringly apparent to everyone in the societies that practice the commercialization of Christ's birth through the manufactured illusion of Santa Claus delivering to children their most dreamed of desires. The appurtenances seem to be everywhere with their out of season greenness and their primary colored lights casting their glow around the outlines of windows and doors. The hectic crowds in stores vying to buy the product that is the latest manufactured craze are evidence of the money being leeched from the consumers by the corporate machinery. What is less evident is the shift away from the feelings of caring for those with less to the satisfying of one's own personal desires. This crassness is displayed most eloquently, and appropriately, in the new movie "Santa Clause 2", which opened on Halloween, and in which the only people in the movie who get presents are the adults and every one of them who gets a present gets exactly what they always wanted.

    In the corporate/science world the money is not so obviously displayed, but it is nonetheless evident. Books on evolution are abundant. There are several hundred in the library and there are new ones being published all the time. Magazines which publish evolution articles are also abundant and the people who work on the books and magazines, in the writing or production or selling of them, do so as full time jobs. There are museums and science institutes which also deal with evolution, in the displaying, acquiring, or researching. There are teachers and professors who pass on the evolution belief to millions of student, each of which require text books and notebooks and all the other tools for the course. Virtually every child who goes to school or university will be exposed to evolution theory and they will be spending money on it. The government finances research and that is more money coming out of citizen's pockets to finance the theory. The people who work full time at writing, publishing, teaching or researching evolution number in the hundreds of thousand and they work year round. The money for their time and the products they produce and the tools they require ultimately comes from the consumer, and while it is not so obvious, it is consistent.

    The people who grow up in the conspicuous consumptive atmosphere that Christmas has become develop, in most cases, a lifelong tendancy to indulge their loved ones desires during the holiday season. The corporate machine encourages this tendancy to over spend by extending credit, thereby insuring that the money keeps rolling in until way after Christmas. This constant ebb and flow of money, and the worry it creates in some people and the satisfaction it creates in others, erodes the true message of Christmas and devalues it.

    The people who endorse the evolution theory do so at the expense of all other theory that might try to explain our ecological organization. They won't entertain any evidence that contradicts their pet theory, even though contradictory evidence is abundant. By making people, especialy students, who are most susceptible, learn only the evolution theory, they are retarding their conceptual development by forcing them to learn a theory that has no scientific explanation for how we, the modern humans on this planet, came to be as we are. Without giving people an explanation that describes the evolvement from Neanderthal to Cro-Magnon, or however they believe the change took place, they force the students of their theory to stop their thought inquiry when they run out of realism to think about. From there the evolutionists tell them that the changes happened over a long period of time and not to worry about it but to just believe it because they say so.

    This attitude and approach to indoctrinating students stunts their investigative thought by compelling them to stop thinking about how the conversion to modern human from the ape-like predecessor took place and forces them to remain with a foggy understanding of how the natural selective process worked to make us. They are forced to gloss over that whole process and just believe. To reinforce that indoctrination, the evolutionists are purposely pitted against the believers in religion, as if to say that "you're either for us, or you're against us", a common refrain from the less intelligent organizers of anything. The people who learn only of the belief in evolution, without being allowed to examine the evidence critically, for fear of being labeled a 'non-conformist' or of being classified as an independent thinker, are not the only retarding of science that occurs. The whole spectrum of science is slowed down by having people thinking of theories that have no future and for which there is no evidence. This dead-end thinking makes the students less emotionally attached to the pure motives of science and more attached to a corporate view of science and that makes them less intellectually able.
     
  15. sampo

    sampo Think for yourself!!

    Messages:
    408
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Atheist
    John

    Do you celebrate Christmas? Do you put up a tree? Do you give and recieve presents?

    Just curious.
     
  16. LiveFreeOrDie

    LiveFreeOrDie Science Officer

    Messages:
    980
    Likes Received:
    0
    Does anyone have some troll repellent?
     
  17. sampo

    sampo Think for yourself!!

    Messages:
    408
    Likes Received:
    1
    Faith:
    Atheist
    I have some, but I have found that they have developed an immunity to my can of "Reason and Logic".

    Go figger.
     
  18. ifriit

    ifriit PRABOB!

    Messages:
    984
    Likes Received:
    8
    Hmm. I think I can sum up Mr. MacNeil's position in a sentence:

    Scientists are conspiriing against my position.

    Sorry, John, but I've got to say that I sincerely doubt your sanity at this point.
     
  19. JohnR7

    JohnR7 New Member

    Messages:
    25,314
    Likes Received:
    134
    Marital Status:
    Married
    Faith:
    Pentecostal
    There was a Saint Nicholas, who was Bishop of Myra in the 4 th century bc. He was beloved for his kindness and the gifts that he would give to kids. It was reported in the orphanage that they would hang up their socks and he would give them a little gift of candy or fruit. If they were naughty then he would give them a peice of coal, to through into the fire.

    The Dutch veneration of 'Sinter Klaus' was brought to North America with the Dutch settlers in the 1620's and eventually became the story of Santa Claus that everyone knows. In the early 1820's Clement Moore wrote a poem about a Santa Clause that is close to the story that is being told today.

    If you go to the dollar store, they usually have both charactors there, the origional Saint Nicholas, with the darker red robe. And the fiction charactor with the red looking outfit.
     
  20. lucaspa

    lucaspa Legend

    Messages:
    14,608
    Likes Received:
    185
    Gender:
    Male
    Marital Status:
    Private
    Faith:
    Methodist
    Better yet, see what Demski has to say about publishing in the scientific literature:  http://chronicle.com/free/v48/i17/17a00801.htm

    "Baylor's Mr. Dembski also has little interest in publicizing his research through traditional means. "I've just gotten kind of blasé about submitting things to journals where you often wait two years to get things into print," he says. "And I find I can actually get the turnaround faster by writing a book and getting the ideas expressed there. My books sell well. I get a royalty. And the material gets read more." " [emphasis mine]

     
     
Loading...