Ever-virgin Mary

[CelticRebel]

I would like Orthodoxy to be in every part of this world, and the arabic countries return to Orthodoxy, to the Christianism they once had, but some things aren't in our possibilities. Don't worry, Someone is taking care of the situation!

If I or any others out here in the hinterlands wanted to be Orthodox, we would not be able to.

 

[CelticRebel]

So would I. Want to help?

I wish church planting was one of my gifts, but it isn't. I couldn't start a church, of any denomination or persuasion.

 

[Jesus4Madrid]

I wish church planting was one of my gifts, but it isn't. I couldn't start a church, of any denomination or persuasion.

Sometimes it's just a matter of showing interest and then showing up.

 

[~Anastasia~]

Many priests have recommended contacting a parish priest for oversight, then beginning reader's services. Anyone can do that. Sometimes it starts with a single family. Priests catechize in any way they can - long distance if necessary. Others help with lodging, transportation when they can. Priests visit to conduct liturgies if they can.

It may take time, and depends on others getting interested, but it's been done before.

Church planting doesn't have to follow a particular scheme.

 

[CelticRebel]

Many priests have recommended contacting a parish priest for oversight, then beginning reader's services. Anyone can do that. Sometimes it starts with a single family. Priests catechize in any way they can - long distance if necessary. Others help with lodging, transportation when they can. Priests visit to conduct liturgies if they can.

It may take time, and depends on others getting interested, but it's been done before.

Church planting doesn't have to follow a particular scheme.

I have only myself. No one in my family is interested -- in starting a church of any kind.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I have only myself. No one in my family is interested -- in starting a church of any kind.

well, first you gotta be Orthodox yourself. I was a little Orthodox island in my family until I got married. after my wedding, my father approached me and asked me if he could help out at St Tikhon's over the summer (which is something he never would have asked me a few years ago). now I know that this does not mean my father would convert, but it does show that the door is opening, even if slightly.

 

[dzheremi]

I had to move 1,200 miles away from my home to attend the Church which I was interested in. Even in today's world, sometimes rewards require substantial effort. It is not enough merely to want something to be some way other than how it currently is. I am not a church-planter, either, but then neither were the people who started our parish here, which is the only Oriental Orthodox church I am aware of in the entire state. Sometimes one has to do what they can to make things happen, even if it takes a long time. When I first came here, the people were still worshiping in a private home, as they had for 15 years or so. Now we have a tiny room in an industrial block of the office district, but darn it, it's ours!

Everyone wants everything to be easy. Me too. But our Lord sent His disciples out into the world, and we are to follow their example, which requires getting off our butts. This whole "preach the gospel at all times; sometimes use words" thing from our Catholic friends is just a way to spiritualize being lazy and overly confident in ones own shining example.

 

[CelticRebel]

I had to move 1,200 miles away from my home to attend the Church which I was interested in. Even in today's world, sometimes rewards require substantial effort. It is not enough merely to want something to be some way other than how it currently is. I am not a church-planter, either, but then neither were the people who started our parish here, which is the only Oriental Orthodox church I am aware of in the entire state. Sometimes one has to do what they can to make things happen, even if it takes a long time. When I first came here, the people were still worshiping in a private home, as they had for 15 years or so. Now we have a tiny room in an industrial block of the office district, but darn it, it's ours!

Everyone wants everything to be easy. Me too. But our Lord sent His disciples out into the world, and we are to follow their example, which requires getting off our butts. This whole "preach the gospel at all times; sometimes use words" thing from our Catholic friends is just a way to spiritualize being lazy and overly confident in ones own shining example.

I am happy for you; that's great!

Nothing's ever been easy for me, and I don't expect it to be. If it was, I might think something was wrong.

 

[All4Christ]

after my wedding, my father approached me and asked me if he could help out at St Tikhon's over the summer (which is something he never would have asked me a few years ago). now I know that this does not mean my father would convert, but it does show that the door is opening, even if slightly.

That is wonderful to hear (and encouraging)!

 

[Wanderlust Pilgrim]

I didn't know it wasn't considered true to any non-Orthodox. That's weird.

 

[CelticRebel]

I didn't know it wasn't considered true to any non-Orthodox. That's weird.

I don't understand what you're talking about.

 

[Wanderlust Pilgrim]

I don't understand what you're talking about.

Alright, as a way of explaination, I was unaware ALL Christians didn't believe in the ever-virginity of the blessed lady Theotokos, and further, I thought it was an inherent part of the Christian faith in general. You know since there's like this Bible thing, idontknow.

 

[All4Christ]

Alright, as a way of explaination, I was unaware ALL Christians didn't believe in the ever-virginity of the blessed lady Theotokos, and further, I thought it was an inherent part of the Christian faith in general. You know since there's like this Bible thing, idontknow.

Yea, Catholics and most high-Church Protestants still believe in the ever-virginity of Mary, but many of the other Protestants believe that she was a virgin when Christ was born, but consummated her marriage after his birth.

 

[Wanderlust Pilgrim]

Yea, Catholics and most high-Church Protestants still believe in the ever-virginity of Mary, but many of the other Protestants believe that she was a virgin when Christ was born, but consummated her marriage after his birth.

But why? Marriage, particularly, in the Middle East, doesn't always mean love or sex, it could very well be some guy helping lady out like a widower or slave girl or whatever.

 

[ArmyMatt]

But why? Marriage, particularly, in the Middle East, doesn't always mean love or sex, it could very well be some guy helping lady out like a widower or slave girl or whatever.

it's a misread of the "until" in Luke's Gospel

 

[All4Christ]

But why? Marriage, particularly, in the Middle East, doesn't always mean love or sex, it could very well be some guy helping lady out like a widower or slave girl or whatever.

I agree with you! Most Protestants who do not believe in the Theotoko's ever-virginity believe in the Sola Scriptura doctrine. In the west, the norm is for a marriage to mean love and sex (along with commitment). To not consummate a marriage is very outside the norm. Since Sola Scriptura precludes extra-Biblical sources, even contemporary sources to the Bible, many interpret a verse in the Bible to mean that she didn't consummate the marriage until after Christ was born. We interpret it differently, as our view is based on the historic context (such as what you said regarding marriages at the time) and the tradition of the Church.

EDIT: Short answer - see ArmyMatt's answer

 

[rusmeister]

it's a misread of the "until" in Luke's Gospel

Or was that Matthew's Gospel?

 

[ArmyMatt]

Or was that Matthew's Gospel?

oops, yep, Matthew's. thanks rus!