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Entropy disproves Darwin

Discussion in 'Creation & Evolution' started by ondaball, Nov 18, 2007.

  1. ondaball

    ondaball Guest

    Every time, in the past 6.25 years on different 'Net forums, that I start a thread @ this, some idiot always says that babies disprove it

    Babies are NOT left alone - they are fed, watered, changed, washed etc etc

    Each species of life was Designer-made by the Most Briliant Brain in the Universe

    So here's details to explain to your teachers & lecturers, on Monday, why true education is academic freedom of thought, not atheistic brainwashing

    ProgettoCosmo - Thermodynamics disproves Darwin

    [SIZE=-1]That contradicts entropy. Moreover Neo-Darwinism pretends species evolves ..... until arriving to quantum particles and events for disproving neo-Darwinism. ...[/SIZE]

    Evolutionary theory has two major claims. First it supports the hypothesis of abiogenesis (origin of life from matter alone); secondly it supports the hypothesis of Darwinian macroevolution (transformation of all species from a common ancestry), via random mutation and natural selection. We will try to explain simply how laws of thermodynamics and entropy deny these major claims of evolutionary theory...

    [SIZE=-1]progettocosmo.altervista.org/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=85 - Similar pages[/SIZE]


    BrothersJudd Blog: SOME LIKE IT HOT (via Tom Corcoran):

    [SIZE=-1]Darwinism, on the other hand, has to be consistent with it [entropy] and isn't. ... the fact that order arises in violation of entropy disproves ...[/SIZE]

    It is a well-known prediction of the second law that, in a closed system, every type of order is unstable and must eventually decrease, as everything tends toward more probable (more random) states. Not only will carbon and temperature distributions become more disordered (more uniform), but the performance of all electronic devices will deteriorate, not improve. Natural forces, such as corrosion, erosion, fire and explosions, do not create order, they destroy it...

    [SIZE=-1]brothersjuddblog.com/archives/2005/12/some_like_it_ho.html - Similar pages[/SIZE]
     
  2. gamespotter10

    gamespotter10 Veteran

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    now all you have to do is explain how entropy disproves evolution.
    Let me explain why evolution isn't impossible.
    Evolution requires only 4 things. these are:
    Natural selection
    Reproduction
    Mutation
    and Time
    ALL of these have been observed.
     
  3. Nitron

    Nitron HIKES CAN TAKE A WALK

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    You are really getting the second law wrong. It has nothing to do with "order". It states that all systems will tend towards entropy- the evening out of all tempertaure.
     
  4. ondaball

    ondaball Guest

  5. CACTUSJACKmankin

    CACTUSJACKmankin Scientist

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    the second law is about energy. what is the energy that drives evolution? the food that keeps organisms alive long enough to reproduce. The under tropic scheme of any ecosystem, the organisms that feed off of the primary producers use only 10% of the available energy in their food and predators get only 10% of that. Therefore evolution follows the second law of thermodynamics. the 2nd law is one of the most fundimental laws in physics, evolution could never have become the backbone of biology if it violated it.
     
  6. Vene

    Vene In memory of ChordatesLegacy

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    Meh. Somehow I think we have a poster who ignores the sun.

    Just like here
     
  7. flatworm

    flatworm Veteran

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    The second law of thermodynamics can be stated in many ways. Here are two familiar ones:

    1) In an isolated system, entropy can never decrease.

    2) It is impossible to create a cycle has as its only effects the removal of heat from a single reservoir and the production of positive work.

    Evolution requires neither.

    Also notice that neither mentions intelligence. There's a reason for that- intelligence is irrelevant to it. No matter how smart you are you will not be able to create an isolated system where entropy decreases, or a cycle that removes heat from a reservoir and produces positive work (and nothing else).

    Creationists will try to tell you that the 2nd law requires that order never increase by blind processes. I would like to say they are simply ignorant but with the easy availability of sound scientific references on the subject the truth is inescapable: they are lying.

    In the natural world, entropy decreases spontaneously all the time in non-isolated systems. If you place a glass of water outside in the winter, the glass loses entropy to its environment as it cools. The formation of snowflakes is another classic example. Here's how it works.

    The entropy change due to heat exchange at a constant temperature is:

    ΔS = ΔH/T

    Where S is entropy, H is enthalpy (heat), and T is the constant temperature. So, if it's -10 Centigrade outside (263 Kelvin), and you put your glass of water outside, as it freezes (0 Centigrade or 273 Kelvin) you have

    ΔSwater = ΔHwater/273

    and

    ΔSenv = ΔHenv/263

    So, let's say the water loses 1000 J of heat to its environment. We then have:

    ΔHwater = -1000 J

    Which is negative by convention because the heat is being lost. The first law of thermodynamics requires that

    ΔHenv = -ΔHwater

    so

    ΔHenv = 1000 J

    Which is positive (heat gain) balancing out the heat lost by the water. That gives us :

    ΔSwater = -1000/273 = -3.66 J/K

    and

    ΔSenv = 1000/263 = 3.80 J/K

    Notice that the entropy of the water has well and truly decreased, but the combined entropy of the water and its environment has actually increased.

    Now, since life forms and the earth as a whole are not isolated systems, you can easily see why entropy is no problem at all for evolution. The creationists have lied to you. Try not to let them fool you in the future.
     
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