Do the horns/kings have to be on a head?

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[Douggg]

If we let the part in verse Daniel 11:36 be when the king has already resurrected and the world wonders after him, then why doesn't it mention the abomination of desolation, as that is when the great tribulation starts soon? Plus, Rev. 13 refers to the beast as speaking and so does Daniel 11:36.

Because you are supposed to figure out that the 1335 days, blessed are those who come to that day is the day that Jesus Returns. And then realize that the day the AOD is setup is on day 1875 from the beginning of the 7 years.

All these different time expressions fit together. Which the tool for fitting them together is flow chart timeline. If you tried doing that you would find that your scenario doesn't work.

In Revelation 13, the world is wondering after the beast because the head had been healed. I think where we could be differing if that I think that the image made of the beast is the abomination of desolation.

14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

So 1335 days from the time the image is made, Jesus Returns. On a 7 year timeline, Jesus returns on day 2520. 2520 - 1335 is day 1875 on the timeline. That's what I show on my chart below.

Daniel 11 only refers to him exalting himself, and also he has other gods in his own land.
I just don't see where the world is wondering over this king.
Nowhere does it seem as if they won't make war with him.
Daniel 12 seems as if the time such as was not is only starting within that chapter.

Daniel 11 is not a comprehensive explanation of all that takes place in the end times. What has to be done is take what it says in Daniel 11 and place what is given on a timeline flow chart - with the other events that are not in Daniel 11.

I explained that the battles in Daniel 11:40-45 is at the very end of the 7 years when the world becomes disenchanted with believing his earlier miracles and coming back to life as being proof of his being God. The world is awestruck by his coming back to life initially, but that honeymoon wears off as God's vials of wrath are poured out on the world, and the Antichrist-beast is powerless to stop them.

Doug

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[granpa]

its not so much a matter of rearranging things as it is a matter of overlapping things.

Its all about repeating patterns

 

[vinsight4u]

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[Douggg]

Do you see how Daniel 11:1 begins referring to Darius and how the one speaking to Daniel was to come in that time? Daniel is being told about what is in the book of truth. By verse 2, he seems to see the book himself.
Next you step through the various events as the future unfolds, as to how there would rise four kings in Persia up to the richest of them all - that would go against Greece - stir up -against the realm of Grecia.
Keep going and more of the steps as to the future events have been shown to Daniel from this book. Daniel 12:4 has him shut up the words and seal the book. as in - he had to close the book he was looking at that was showing what would come in the future
Daniel 12 refers to the time that would follow shortly after the abomination of desolation.

The abomination of desolation verse is not found right in front of this, unless we move the one - and place in 1290 days. Daniel 11:31 has the word "they" in it twice. This makes me wonder if we are to split these events listed there apart from each other.
daily sacrifice /slide in next 1290 days
then happens the abomination of desolation

Maybe the son of man is revealed - then later that Wicked is revealed.

The falling away comes before the son of perdition is revealed.
But -the restrainer ceases before that Wicked is revealed.

Hi vinsight4u, which comes first - the Antichrist's beast's 42 months rule or the setting up of the Abomination of Desolation?

Doug

 

[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[vinsight4u]

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[Douggg]

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[Douggg]

Daniel 11 shows the one that came as vile in verse 21 lasts beyond verse 30, because he must again battle the south for a latter time. This latter time is not like the one from earlier, or the second.
Daniel 11 up to verse 36- doesn't show another battle with the south.

v29
"At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter."
v30
"For the ships of Chittim shall come against him..."

Maybe by verse 40 the ships of Chittims have joined with him, or for some reason they can't get there, or aren't able to make him flee.

If you have Antiochus IV end as the king of the north time at verse 35, then that same king would be coming back in verse 36 for the end days.


fathers are mentioned in both of these verses

Daniel 11:24
Daniel 11:37-38

The ships of Chittum are the Romans, when the Romans forced Antiochus to turn back. Antiochus was on his way to remove the king of Egypt and capture Cyprus. From an article in wikipedia...

In 168 BC Antiochus led a second attack on Egypt and also sent a fleet to capture Cyprus. Before reaching Alexandria, his path was blocked by a single, old Roman ambassador named Gaius Popillus Laenas, who delivered a message from the Roman Senate directing Antiochus to withdraw his armies from Egypt and Cyprus, or consider themselves in a state of war with the Roman Republic. Antiochus said he would discuss it with his council, whereupon the Roman envoy drew a line in the sand around him and said, "Before you cross this circle I want you to give me a reply for the Roman Senate" – implying that Rome would declare war if the King stepped out of the circle without committing to leave Egypt immediately. Weighing his options, Antiochus decided to withdraw. Only then did Popillius agree to shake hands with him.

When Antiochus was forced to turn back by the Romans, he took out his anger on the Jews.

Antiochus is NOT the king verse in 36. The historic verses of the back and forth conflicts between the Ptolemy's and Seleucid s end in verse 32. Antiochus is dead, done, buried, and not coming back.

Verses 33 - 35 are transition verses from Antiochus's day to the end times, which includes 2000 years of Christianity.

Verse 36 is the end times Antichrist-beast, that is, the prophecy the angel was giving Daniel picks up in verse 36 as the Antichrist has entered the final 42 months of his career whereby he's claiming to be God.

The kings of the north and south, and news out of the east in verses 40-45 have nothing to do with the historic verses. The north and south are merely designated directions. The error most people make is that they read "king of the South" and "king of the North" in verses 40-45 and think those are the same kingdoms of the historic verses. But not so, considering that God will be drawing all nations into the area at that time.

The verses 40-45, king of the south and north, and kings of the east (implied in the verses).... are end-times kings over the 4 quadrants (north, south, east, west) of the entire world, with the Antichrist-beast being the king of the West.

That the Antichrist is the king of the west is from Daniel 8.

The little horn in Daniel 8:9...

9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land.

... grows strong to the south and east toward the pleasant land (Israel). That would put the little horn growing strong, coming in strength imo, toward Israel from a location North and West of Israel - which would be from Europe. King of the West.

That he comes from that direction and from the territory of one of the 4 breakup kingdoms, in my view he assembles his forces in Greece, intending to come to the rescue of Israel when Gog/Magog appears to make their attack. But he is a day late and a dollar short because Gog/Magog is destroyed by the time he arrives.... as the Prince who shall come.

Dan 8:23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.

Daniel 8:23 above ties to the Daniel 7. "Their kingdom" is the kingdom of the transgressors (not any of the 4 breakup kingdoms). The transgressors are those ten kings in Daniel 7 (the ten horns on the fourth beast) who will eventually align themselves with the Antichrist-beast, and when their kingdom comes to it fullness, i.e. the end times fourth kingdom, the little horn in Daniel 7 will come up among them.

"in the latter time of their kingdom(of the transgressors)" - Right now the EU has been in its development stages going from the EEC to the EU. The final configuration will be some sort of ten nation ruling body - that's when their kingdom has come to it's fullness of those ten kings. We are not there yet, but we are close.

When that ten kingdom ruling body forms, that is when the little horn, the king of fierce countenance, will make his appearance on the world stage.


Doug