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Divorce

Discussion in 'Baptists' started by trentlogain2, Dec 5, 2009.

  1. trentlogain2

    trentlogain2 New Member

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    Is it ever okay with God for two people to divorce? Please base all answers on The Bible. Thanks and God bless!
     
  2. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Moderator

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  3. mlqurgw

    mlqurgw New Member

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    OK, no. Forgivable, Yes. My wife and I have been married for 36 years because divorce was never an option. Paul does seem to give reasons such as adultery and abandonment by an unbelieving spouse as reasons to separate but I am not convinced he is condoning divorce as an option. Having said that I do not lay a burden of guilt on those who do divorce. The Gospel is about forgiveness not finger pointing. That is why I council those who about to marry not to if there is anything at all about the other person they can't live with. Making a lifelong vow of commitment ought never to be entered into with an option of getting out of it. When divorce is not an option you must do the hard work required to make a marriage work.
     
  4. van_s

    van_s Newbie

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    :amen::thumbsup::clap:
     
  5. Randomaster

    Randomaster Junior Member

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    The answer to that comes from the fact that marriage is supposed to be for the glorification of God, in other words supposed to be holy. So ONLY in the case of adultry/fornication, which is the exact thing that destroys the holiness of marriage, is divorce allowed, and then the proper paperwork must be followed. Deuteronomy 24:1-6 specifically lays out God's requirements with divorce and subsequent marriages. Matthew 5:31-32 and Mark 10:1-12 add Jesus's further clarification to the prior laws.

    Hopefully that answers your questions about divorce! I pray that you may continue to have your questions answered through fellowship and study of the Lord's Word and His Ways! Praise be to our Heavenly Father!
     
  6. PrincetonGuy

    PrincetonGuy Veteran

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    The easiest way to learn what the Bible teaches about divorce and remarriage is to begin with Luke’s gospel where he wrote:

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”

    This is the Biblical standard and teaching. There are no exceptions or complications to the teaching.

    Mark is more wordy on this issue, which is uncommon for Mark who typically liked to be more brief:

    Mark 10:2. Some Pharisees came up to Jesus, testing Him, and began to question Him whether it was lawful for a man to divorce a wife.
    3. And He answered and said to them, “What did Moses command you?”
    4. They said, “Moses permitted a man TO WRITE A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY.”
    5. But Jesus said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment.
    6. “But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE.
    7. “FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER,
    8. AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh.
    9. “What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
    10. In the house the disciples began questioning Him about this again.
    11. And He *said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her;
    12. and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery.”

    Notice especially vv. 11-12:

    11. And He *said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her;
    12. and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery.”

    As in Luke 16, there are no exceptions—it is cut and dried.

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”


    Paul, in his First Epistle to the Corinthians expressed the same teaching in this manner:

    1 Cor. 7:10. But to the married I give instructions, not I, but the Lord, that the wife should not leave her husband
    11. (but if she does leave, she must remain unmarried, or else be reconciled to her husband), and that the husband should not divorce his wife.

    Mark, Luke and Paul all agree—remarriage to a different spouse after divorce is adultery; there are NO exceptions.

    When we read the discussion in the Matt. 19:3-12, however, we run into a problem:

    Matt. 19:3. Some Pharisees came to Jesus, testing Him and asking, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any reason at all?”
    4. And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
    5. and said, ‘FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH’?
    6. “So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
    7. They *said to Him, “Why then did Moses command to GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY?”
    8. He *said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way.
    9. “And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”
    10. The disciples *said to Him, “If the relationship of the man with his wife is like this, it is better not to marry.”
    11. But He said to them, “Not all men can accept this statement, but only those to whom it has been given.
    12. “For there are eunuchs who were born that way from their mother's womb; and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men; and there are also eunuchs who made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to accept this, let him accept it.”

    In Matt. 19:3-12, we find a group of Pharisees attempting to trap Jesus into taking sides in a theological debate and stir up strife by asking Jesus to take a side in the Hillel-Shammai dispute that was raging at the time. The very popular and theologically liberal Rabbi Hillel taught that it was lawful for a Jewish man to divorce his wife for any cause whatsoever; the far less popular and theologically conservative Rabbi Shammai taught that it was lawful for a Jewish man to divorce his wife only if she had committed adultery against him. Notice that Matt. 19:9 includes an exception clause, “except for immorality.”

    The exception clause in Matt. 19:9 has a very large amount of early manuscript support (although with a number of variations); therefore most New Testament translators translate from a Greek text that includes the exception clause. However, the large majority of scholars of the synoptic gospels believe that the exception clause could not have been a part of the teaching of Jesus because it directly contradicts the teaching of Jesus, not only as found in Mark, Luke, and Paul, but also in the rest of Matthew. Indeed, if the exception clause is genuine, Matt. 19:9 cannot be harmonized with Matt. 19:8,

    8. He *said to them, "Because of your hardness of heart Moses permitted you to divorce your wives; but from the beginning it has not been this way.
    9. “And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.” (NASB, 1995)

    Whenever Jesus introduces his teaching with the words, “I say to you” (there are more than 50 occurrences in Matthew’s Gospel alone), He is introducing a new teaching that goes beyond the commonly accepted rabbinic teachings of his day. If the exception clause is genuine, in verse 9 Jesus is not introducing a new teaching, He is falling into the Pharisees’ trap by taking Shammai’s side in the debate! Therefore, the verse should read,

    9. “And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery.”

    Compare Luke 16:18,

    18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”

    And not only that, if the exception clause is genuine, in verse 9 Jesus is contradicting what he had just said in verses 4-6.

    4. And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
    5. and said, ‘FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH’?
    6. “So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”


    This three-word exception clause has given birth to countless thousands of theological and legal debates, and it is probably a very early addition (before the oldest known manuscripts of Mathew’s gospel were written) made to the gospel that does not belong there. It may have resulted from a scribe reading a similar phrase earlier in Matthew’s gospel and believing that it also belonged in Matt. 19:9,

    Matt. 5:31. “It was said, 'WHOEVER SENDS HIS WIFE AWAY, LET HIM GIVE HER A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE';
    32. but I say to you that everyone who divorces his wife, except for the reason of unchastity, makes her commit adultery; and whoever marries a divorced woman commits adultery.”

    We find the exception clause here in verse 32, but notice why it is included here—if a man divorces his wife he makes her commit adultery except for the cases where she has already done so. (Continued below)
     
  7. PrincetonGuy

    PrincetonGuy Veteran

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    (Continued from above)
    How can we be sure that the exception clause does not belong in Matt. 19:9? We cannot be certain, but its addition to that verse totally changes the relevance of the clause and allows for an adulterous marriage to take place. Further evidence that it does not belong in Matt. 19:9 is found in the immediately preceding verses and in the following verse:

    Matt. 19:10. The disciples *said to Him, “If the relationship of the man with his wife is like this, it is better not to marry.”

    His disciples were clearly shocked by what Jesus was teaching; and they were shocked because what Jesus was teaching was totally new to them. The Jewish leaders of the day were divided over the issue—some of them arguing that divorce was allowed for any reason and others were arguing that it was allowed only in the case where the wife had committed adultery (women were not allowed to divorce their husbands)—but Jesus was teaching that husbands could not divorce their wives even if they committed adultery!

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”

    And, of course, if the exception clause is genuine, we have Matthew not only directly contradicting Mark, Luke, and Paul—but also what he himself had just written in vv. 3-8 of the same chapter.

    We find Paul applying this Biblical truth in Romans 7:

    1. Or do you not know, brethren (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law has jurisdiction over a person as long as he lives?
    2. For the married woman is bound by law to her husband while he is living; but if her husband dies, she is released from the law concerning the husband.
    3. So then, if while her husband is living she is joined to another man, she shall be called an adulteress; but if her husband dies, she is free from the law, so that she is not an adulteress though she is joined to another man.
    4. Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

    Just as a woman is free to remarry ONLY after the death of her husband, a potential member of the body of Christ is free to become the bride of Christ ONLY after the death of her (the church and its members are always spoken of in the feminine gender since Christ is the groom) husband, that is, “the old man,” the “old nature,” “the old self.” If her husband is still alive, and she becomes a “Christian,” she is committing adultery with Christ. The Christian’s former self was under the Law and all of its demands and penalties, but when that former self is crucified with Christ and is dead and buried (Rom. 6), that former self is no longer under the Law and the “new man” is married to Christ and is a new creation,

    2 Cor. 5:17. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new. (NKJV)

    Gal. 2:20. “I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.”

    Only upon the death of one’s spouse is one free to remarry; both in the physical realm and the spiritual realm.

    (All Scripture quotations are from the NASB, 1995)
     
  8. DD2008

    DD2008 New Member

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    Here are some different views on it.

    Here is John Macarthur's position:

    Whats your view of divorce and remarriage?

    Here is John Piper's position:

    Divorce & Remarriage: A Position Paper :: Desiring God Christian Resource Library

    Here is Al Mohler's article "A Christian Vision of Marriage and the Family:

    A Christian Vision of Marriage and Family - AlbertMohler.com

    I personally am comfortable that the scriptures teach that adultery (Matt 5:32) or abandonment by an unbelieving spouse (1 Cor 7:15) frees the believeing / faithful spouse from the bonds of marriage.
     
  9. dies-l

    dies-l Guest

    Another divorce thread; I am expecting the same array of opinions on the topic. My thought: Divorce is never ideal, and it is always a product of sin. But, it is a foolish misapplication of Scripture to say that a divorced and remarried person is committing adultery each time he or she is intimate with the new spouse. God's grace even covers divorce, so this legalism is misplaced.
     
  10. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Moderator

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    dies-l, Matthew 19, specifically Jesus's own words tell us that:

    "I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, and marries another woman commits adultery."

    There are no other exceptions in this. Paul tells us not to be yoked with unbelievers, so marriage to one should never be an issue in the first place. Therefore, it is not just divorce that is the resounding issue, but why you get divorced.
     
  11. mlqurgw

    mlqurgw New Member

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    Lets not forget that God never divorces His people even though they continually commit adultery against Him. Read the book of Hosea.
     
  12. desmalia

    desmalia sounds like somebody's got a case of the mondays

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    Right. Though just one note: there are times that people become believers while already married already to unbelievers. That's what happened with my parents, actually.
     
  13. PrincetonGuy

    PrincetonGuy Veteran

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    Which teaching is really the teaching of Jesus,

    Matt. 19:9. “And I say to you, whoever divorces his wife, except for immorality, and marries another woman commits adultery.”

    or

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”

    Consider for a moment these two statements:

    Every cookie in the cookie jar is whole and unbroken.

    There is one broken cookie in the cookie jar.

    These two statements are mutually contradictory because only one of them can be true. Precisely the same thing is true of Luke 16:18. If everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, there can be no exceptions. None of the cookies are broken, not a single one of them.

    If the three word exception clause is genuine Scripture, rather than an early addition to the text, Matthew is directly contradicting not only Luke, Mark, and Paul, but also what he himself had just written in vv. 3-8 of the same chapter (see posts 6 and 8 above).

    The teaching that divorce and remarriage is permissible in the case of adultery hinges solely upon a highly dubious exception clause in only one verse in the entire New Testament, an exception clause that has Matthew directly contradicting the rest of Scripture and has Jesus falling right into the trap set for Him by the Pharisees (see posts 6 and 8 above).

    Are today’s modern celebrity preachers and teachers being faithful to the Word of God; or are they being faithful to man’s doctrine of political correctness? Have they not caused the divorce rate among evangelical Christians in the United States to escalate from 5% in 1960 to 51% today? Are they being faithful to the Word of God; or are they tickling the ears of people in difficult situations? Are their followers truly seeking the will of God in His word; or are they actually seeking an excuse to follow through with their own sinful desires?

    2 Tim. 4:3. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires,
    4. and will turn away their ears from the truth and will turn aside to myths.

    (All Scriptures are from the NASB, 1995)
     
  14. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Moderator

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    You're missing the whole point, sir. It is the act of remarriage that causes the sin of adultery, not divorce.

    It is assumed by many that if you get divorced it is okay to remarry, but this is not the case at all.
     
  15. PrincetonGuy

    PrincetonGuy Veteran

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    No, you have misunderstood my posts. Here is my position,

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.” (NASB, 1995)
     
  16. 98cwitr

    98cwitr Lord forgive me Staff Member Moderator

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    yeah, so don't remarry, it's pretty plain and simple.
     
  17. ChristianMama84

    ChristianMama84 Hi! I'm Dawn

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    I agree with this 100%. My husband and I have only been married 5 years and there were times I wanted to divorce, but it was always for selfish reasons. I'm glad I have such a wonderful, Christian husband who still stood by me and wouldn't allow it.
     
  18. DeaconDean

    DeaconDean γέγονα χαλκὸς, κύμβαλον ἀλαλάζον

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    I disagree!

    God divorced Himself from Israel acccording to Jeremiah:

    "And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also." -Jer. 3:8 (KJV)

    Did God lie or did Jeremiah here?

    God Bless

    Till all are one.
     
  19. AngryKoala

    AngryKoala Junior Member

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    Hum. What do you think about 1 Timothy 5:9-16?

    ESV: "Let a widow be enrolled if she is not less than sixty years of age, having been the wife of one husband, and having a reputation for good works: if she has brought up children, has shown hospitality, has washed the feet of the saints, has cared for the afflicted, and has devoted herself to every good work. But refuse to enroll younger widows, for when their passions draw them away from Christ, they desire to marry and so incur condemnation for having abandoned their former faith. Besides that, they learn to be idlers, going about from house to house, and not only idlers, but also gossips and busybodies, saying what they should not. So I would have younger widows marry, bear children, manage their households, and give the adversary no occasion for slander. For some have already strayed after Satan. If any believing woman has relatives who are widows, let her care for them. Let the church not be burdened, so that it may care for those who are truly widows."
     
  20. PrincetonGuy

    PrincetonGuy Veteran

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    Jer. 3:8. “And I saw that for all the adulteries of faithless Israel, I had sent her away and given her a writ of divorce, yet her treacherous sister Judah did not fear; but she went and was a harlot also.”

    Matt. 19:3. Some Pharisees came to Jesus, testing Him and asking, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife for any reason at all?”
    4. And He answered and said, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,
    5. and said, ‘FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH’?
    6. “So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”

    Mark 10:2. Some Pharisees came up to Jesus, testing Him, and began to question Him whether it was lawful for a man to divorce a wife.
    3. And He answered and said to them, “What did Moses command you?”
    4. They said, “Moses permitted a man TO WRITE A CERTIFICATE OF DIVORCE AND SEND her AWAY.”
    5. But Jesus said to them, “Because of your hardness of heart he wrote you this commandment.
    6. “But from the beginning of creation, God MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE.
    7. “FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER,
    8. AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh.
    9. “What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
    10. In the house the disciples began questioning Him about this again.
    11. And He *said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another woman commits adultery against her;
    12. and if she herself divorces her husband and marries another man, she is committing adultery.”

    God and Israel never “became one flesh,” hence God was able to divorce Israel. Therefore, Jeremiah 3:8 is irrelevant to the discussion of divorce between a man and a woman.

    Luke 16:18. “Everyone who divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery, and he who marries one who is divorced from a husband commits adultery.”

    (All quotations from the Scriptures are from the NASB, 1995)