Hi Lismore,
lismore said:
This is probably what Paul means when he says tongues of angels. But then do all believers not have the Holy Spirit, so would it not be available to be understood?
Yep, that's exactly so. Hence, my difficulties. I will digress
lismore said:
If you could perhaps share a little of your experiences with this I could understand a little better where you're coming from.
I have had limited experience with Pentecostals and charismatics(AOG).
I have been told that the baptism of the Spirit will manifest itself in tongues. I believe, that quite differently from that assertion, that the baptism of the Holy Spirit occurs at the moment of salvation, and in fact, performs the regeneration of the previously dead spirit, endowing it with eternal life.
This belief regarding tongues as THE manifestation of the baptism of the Holy Spirit implies that anyone who has not spoken in tongues has not been baptised by the Spirit, and the end result of the inferences is that unless you have "recieved the Holy Ghost and spoken in tongues" then you are not a genuine Christian. That's not even close to what the Bible teaches, yet many folks believe that in practice, if not in word.
There is, paranthetically, a difference between living by the Spirit, and walking by the Spirit.
The interaction with one of my high school friends, who was AOG and his father was the pastor, led me to understand his belief. Perhaps it is not indicative of all AOG, I don't really know. At any rate, as I previously posted, this church believes that tongues are a heavenly language unintelligable to anyone without the Holy Spirit empowering them. They teach that even as the individual is speaking in tongues, he has no idea what he is saying. (That's not quite decently and in order, IMHO) The entire doctrine seems to be hinged on the verse you quoted, with the reference to "the tongues of angels." No other case, or basis for this belief, is offered.
My significant problem with both of these patterns of belief is that they tend to focus on the emotionalism of being filled with the Spirit. We are emotional creatures, and I know that when God has worked powerfully in one's life, it is an emotional event, but I have seen people crave the emotion without the greater substance and fruit that the Bible teaches is the fruit of the Spirit.
So that's a quick summary. I tried to be brief, and I appreciate your patience and gentleness, just so you know.