Yes that is what I get as well. People who deny Christ...as well as them being defined as those who do not love one another. Because let's face it...if you love one another, you are going to share the Gospel with them
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Please read that chapter in context.2 Thessolonians 2:9-11
Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 And with all delusion of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
It is not true that all Christians are safe in their understanding. We all must be as the Berean's were and know the truth.
That is to believers. He is talking about how satan will come to deceive with miracles and wonders and some who do not seek after the truth in God's Word will be deceived. Because they did not love the truth.Please read that chapter in context.
Paul makes the distinction between those who refuse to love the truth versus those God has chosen from the beginning to be saved.
This is simply the unsaved followers of Satan who refuse to love the truth versus the saved children of God who do love the truth.
Paul is telling the church, that God has chosen them for salvation and not for destruction.
And the strong delusion that God sends on those followers of Satan, Paul teaches is centered at the time of the revealing of the Antichrist.
2 Thessalonians 2
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders,
10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie,
12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Paul next explains to the church that they are not like these above who will be deceived.
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
14 to which He called you by our gospel, for the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.
16 Now may our Lord Jesus Christ Himself, and our God and Father, who has loved us and given us everlasting consolation and good hope by grace,17 comfort your hearts and establish you in every good word and work.
What a strong and positive affirmation that His people have by God's grace and power, been chosen to be saved, and this from the beginning of time, and to obtain everlasting consolation in the Spirit because of His love for them, and will know the truth by God's grace alone of His Son to them, WHOM NO MAN CAN KNOW APART FROM THE GRACE OF GOD TO THEM WHICH SAVES THEM.
In Paul's first letter to them, he says this also as confirmation that God did NOT APPOINT US TO WRATH BUT TO OBTAIL SALVATION THROUGH OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST.
1 Thessalonians 5
8 But let us who are of the day be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet the hope of salvation.
9 For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, 10 who died for us, that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him.
11 Therefore comfort each other and edify one another, just as you also are doing.
The enemies of God despise His saving grace which enables us to believe in His Son and be saved. They add to the work of salvation Christ accomplished on the cross on behalf of the children of God for whom Christ died.
That is to believers. He is talking about how satan will come to deceive with miracles and wonders and some who do not seek after the truth in God's Word will be deceived. Because they did not love the truth.
God let satan touch Job.Your saying God sends delusion on to believers, that is totally false theology.
Jesus promise is that believers will be guided into the truth.
1 John 5:18
[ Knowing the True—Rejecting the False ] We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him.
Satan can not touch a born of God believer as regarding their salvation. Satan's deceptions will not deceive a truly born again believer as far as them denying the true Christ and embracing a lying false Christ. The elect wont be deceived. When Christ said deceive if possible, He is saying the deception is going to be tremendously powerful coming on the world. But His elect will be saved. Christians do not perish, they have eternal life.
You are entitled to have your own opinion in this present world/system wherein truth and error are allowed to coexist for the present time of evil. But a day is coming when wheat will be separated from chaff, and the wheat will be gathered into the barn of the Lord, but the chaff will be burned up and done away with.
Because Luther and Calvin used mere 'proof texts' to develop an entire, universal ideology of Christianity..
They were extremely well educated and utilized just as much information as the Church.
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God let satan touch Job.
God has said that it will happen. So know the truth of God's Word so you are not decieved.
2 Thessalonians 2 is contrasting the unsaved followers of the beast versus the saved followers of Christ.
In 1 John , the verse saying Satan can not touch the saved believer since they are born of God has to do with Satan can not destroy their eternal salvation in Christ. Satan can obtain permission from God to cause a saved person troubles, but also recall God told the devil he could not kill Job, Job's life was to be preserved. In the same way God will not allow Satan to take away the eternal life of a saved believer who is born of God.
Satan's followers are decieved and perish, Christ's followers Jesus says will know the truth, be set free from Sin and Satan and have eternal life.
Another way to think of God not allowing Satan to 'touch' them, has to do with contamination, Satan can not corrupt those born of God. Satan can not transfer His evil into their life making them also evil like him as they are born of God, Satan has no spiritual power or authority of any kind over them. That is why John the apostle says they do not sin, Satan has no power over those born of God.
We are translated out of the kingdom of darkness, into the kingdom of His dear Son. And of Satan Christ says he has no part in me.
Just because someone says they're a Christian, does not mean they actually are one. Those who are drawn away after the man of perdition i.e. the antichrist, may very well be those who say they are, but have never actually been born again, and added to the Kingdom.
I already said that passage is for followers of the beast and is also for the end time deception, read that scripture in context of the eschatological timeline, it is the time of the revealing of Antichrist on the world stage, not for us today.No it is not. It is saying that when the man of perdition comes that many will believe him and fall away from Christ because they did not believe the truth that is in the Word of God. This is for Christians, the falling away.
Satan cannot take away our eternal life in Christ, that is true.
But satan can affect and deceive and that's what he does. To anyone who is open to that deception. Christian or non-Christian.
You are really saying two different things:
* That satan cannot touch a Christian
* Satan cannot take away eternal life
Satan can influence anyone who can be influenced. That is why we are to keep our mind on spiritual things, because satan tries to affect us through our carnal minds and desires.
You really should not be mixing these two things. It is very confusing. You should state your case for each individually.
I'm really not going to buy into your Calvanistic beliefs. The standard Calvanistic response is 'they were never saved in the first place'. pfft.I already said that passage is for followers of the beast and is also for the end time deception, read that scripture in context of the eschatological timeline, it is the time of the revealing of Antichrist on the world stage, not for us today.
You must read this in context, note it says right there v8, the lawless one is that Antichrist.
v8 to the end here is ALL FUTURE, not yet happened.
8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming.
9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders,
10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie,
12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
This end time deception comes after the great apostasy of the 'church', but see they are apostates so are unbelievers, so are not born of God, so they are not ever been saved. All apostates have departed from the faith, but see in the church it can be said those who departed the faith never believed in Christ, they believed in something else, maybe a false Christ, maybe a false gospel. That this is referring to the end of the last days, Paul teaches us in the first few verses, saying the day of the Lord and our gathering to Him has not happened yet and will not happen until the Antichrist is revealed.
You got to fit scriptural themes in context and also compare scriptures to others to understand what this means. It is clear that those who depart the faith as John says were never of us, they are antichrists and they were in the church but not of the church. We read so many warnings to watch out for such apostates who are wolves in sheep's clothing, make no sense why people think these wolves were once His sheep.
So then you believe Christians can die and go to hell?I'm really not going to buy into your Calvanistic beliefs. The standard Calvanistic response is 'they were never saved in the first place'. pfft.
So then you believe Christians can die and go to hell?
I have no problem with that, however these apostates are not real genuine 'Christians'.Brother "Sdowney717",
Christians are always safe and secure because they by definition believe (Matthew 24:13). There are those however, who formerly believed but have fallen away (Matthew 24:10; Luke 8:13). There is a third group who never believed. Some in this group have gone through the motions but never truly trusted in Christ.
Keep the faith in Jesus.
In Christ!
What are you talking about? We were talking about Calvanism and that I'm not buying into that whole round-and-round of the elect, chosen and those who are not saved not being chosen stuff. What that does is creates the 'have's' and 'have not's' in Christianity. Worst theology ever.So then you believe Christians can die and go to hell?
Maybe read a little more thoroughly and re-read before answering.Your saying God sends delusion on to believers, that is totally false theology.