Death Penalty

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ElviraRio

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The death penalty is true justice and cannot be undone for G-d's laws are infinitely better then ours for He is G-d.
I am not gonna pretend to know how you MJ’s come up w/ your doctrines, but we from the Original Christian Church are no longer under the law of Moses.

Are you saying that the states which currently do not have the death penalty are disobeying God? That sounds a little bloodthirsty to me and foamingatthemouth-ish.
 
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Fish and Bread

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Exodus 20:13 "You shall not murder."

Exodus 21:12 "One who strikes a man, so that he dies, shall surely be put to death."

The death penalty is true justice and cannot be undone for G-d's laws are infinitely better then ours for He is G-d.

Christians believe that law is no longer in effect. Jesus taught that "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is no longer applicable. I wouldn't even think Jews would mind, because most Jews I know do not consider what's in the Torah to be a basis for universal human law, but rather a code that applicable only to the chosen people of Israel.
 
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Tanakh

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Christians believe that law is no longer in effect. Jesus taught that "an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth" is no longer applicable. I wouldn't even think Jews would mind, because most Jews I know do not consider what's in the Torah to be a basis for universal human law, but rather a code that applicable only to the chosen people of Israel.

The instruction not to murder was one of the 7 laws of Noah, which is for all humanity, and therefore the death penalty in murder cases must be carried out by gentiles as well.
 
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Tanakh

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I am not gonna pretend to know how you MJ’s come up w/ your doctrines, but we from the Original Christian Church are no longer under the law of Moses.

Are you saying that the states which currently do not have the death penalty are disobeying God? That sounds a little bloodthirsty to me and foamingatthemouth-ish.

MJ? :scratch:

Are you saying that the states which do not have the death penalty are disobeying God?

Yes!
 
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Tanakh

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Oh so you’re a real Jew and not a wannabe Jewish person like those Messianic Jews. Cool. So. Is it a doctrinal teaching in Judaism that a society must have a death penalty and are all Jews bound by this belief? Are there any anti death penalty Jewish people? I have more but that's it for now.

G-d made a covenant with Noah after the great flood in which all of humanity would be bound to.

The 7 Noahide laws:

1. Do not murder
2. Do not steal
3. Do not worship false gods
4. Do not practice sexual immorality
5. Do not eat the limb of an animal before it is killed
6. Do not curse G-d
7. Set up courts and bring offenders to justice

These laws are required for everyone regardless and if one follows these 7 laws in their daily life then they are righteous and have a share in the world to come.

There are anti-death penalty Jews but most are liberal/secularists and therefore usually base their anti-death penalty belief on secular terms such as the cost (in the U.S.) to carry out a death sentence. However, the Torah and thus Jewish law makes it clear that the world is supposed to follow the law regarding the death penalty for if it can be proved with out a doubt that the crime was committed and that it was premeditated then the death penalty must be enforced by a court of law. Granted the religious laws go in many direction for different scenarios but this is just a basic layout.
 
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Tanakh

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well we Christians practice the ten commandments. I don't know about Noahchide laws, but wasn't the law which the death sentence for murdering was under the law of Moses?

Under Christian law the "old law" no longer applies so that is something you Christians will have to come to terms with yet G-d states that His law (the Torah) is FOREVER!

With the 10 Commandments more or less overlapping the Noahide laws it would be good to follow either yet the Noahide laws cover one thing that the 10 Commandments do not and that is the instruction to set up a court of justice.
 
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geocajun

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The instruction not to murder was one of the 7 laws of Noah, which is for all humanity, and therefore the death penalty in murder cases must be carried out by gentiles as well.
The instruction not to murder was, but not the penalty for doing it.
 
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geocajun

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The 7th law of setting up courts of justice makes the death penalty applicable in murder cases.
To be clear, we don't believe that as Christians. I understand that you do as a [talmudic theology believing] Jew, and that's fine, but it isn't something we hold true as Christians.
We believe the Decalogue was the eternal law meant for all, and really a divine insight into the natural law, but we do not hold the Noahide laws, or any of the mitzot (apart from the decalogue), as being binding on Christians.
 
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The Madcap

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The Death Penalty...hmm. I'll give my thoughts on this. First off, whether or not God or the Bible says it's okay is not a safe way to determine whether or not it's right. Instead of simply believing in something "just 'cus my god says so" doesn't really work if you're trying to come to a good conclusion because it's based on an unproved premise, and rather than simply citing random scriptures, try using actually logical reasoning. Now, let's move on. First off, I don't think it works as a deterrent. Looking at the past 20 years, states that use the death penalty have a higher murder rate than states that don't. Obviously the purpose of it being an efficient deterrent is a failure. Secondly, it has killed innocent people. Some people say that this is a flaw that has to be ignored, but I don't think so. If it kills one innocent person, I think that's horrible. Another statement I often hear is "Some people just don't deserve to live"...Okay, Jesus. Who died and made you King of the Universe? Honestly, I just don't think there is a good reason for it. Some people will simply just say "An eye for an eye", but yeah, clever wordplay proves nothing. I've never heard a good reason why it should be used, and I have heard good reasons why it shouldn't. I don't think it should be used.
 
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Tanakh

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The Death Penalty...hmm. I'll give my thoughts on this. First off, whether or not God or the Bible says it's okay is not a safe way to determine whether or not it's right. Instead of simply believing in something "just 'cus my god says so" doesn't really work if you're trying to come to a good conclusion because it's based on an unproved premise, and rather than simply citing random scriptures, try using actually logical reasoning. Now, let's move on. First off, I don't think it works as a deterrent. Looking at the past 20 years, states that use the death penalty have a higher murder rate than states that don't. Obviously the purpose of it being an efficient deterrent is a failure. Secondly, it has killed innocent people. Some people say that this is a flaw that has to be ignored, but I don't think so. If it kills one innocent person, I think that's horrible. Another statement I often hear is "Some people just don't deserve to live"...Okay, Jesus. Who died and made you King of the Universe? Honestly, I just don't think there is a good reason for it. Some people will simply just say "An eye for an eye", but yeah, clever wordplay proves nothing. I've never heard a good reason why it should be used, and I have heard good reasons why it shouldn't. I don't think it should be used.

Lethal injection is not exactly a good "deterrent" to begin with because you feel hardly any pain. The point of implementing the death penalty is not simply for deterring a crime from being done again but to make it very clear that there is a fine line between good and evil and when one crosses that line there is a penalty to be paid.
 
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The Madcap

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Lethal injection is not exactly a good "deterrent" to begin with because you feel hardly any pain.
Lethal injection can often times be very painful and unpleasant. Not everyone responds exactly the same to it.
The point of implementing the death penalty is not simply for deterring a crime from being done again
Horrible logic. By that logic, one must also kill robbers, people who drive past the speed limit, pot smokers, jaywalkers, etc. so that they "won't do the crime again".
but to make it very clear that there is a fine line between good and evil and when one crosses that line there is a penalty to be paid.
Who says the death penalty is the only conceivable punishment?
 
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Tanakh

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Lethal injection can often times be very painful and unpleasant. Not everyone responds exactly the same to it.Horrible logic. By that logic, one must also kill robbers, people who drive past the speed limit, pot smokers, jaywalkers, etc. so that they "won't do the crime again".Who says the death penalty is the only conceivable punishment?
Theft does not merit the death penalty but a harsh punishment nonetheless. The logic of killing those who kill is just. Of course the death penalty is not the only punishment however it is the only one worthy of a murderer.
 
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