David Daleiden Doubles Down

[SepiaAndDust]

I doubt he'll be found guilty of attempting to buy the body parts. The law probably has a purpose clause which means they have to prove that he actually was trying to purchase the parts. We all know he had no actual intention to buy the parts and that it was a ruse to get the videos. The fake ID is a problem for him as there is no way to get around that. Either he had one and used it or he didn't. The video taping is another matter. Each state has its own laws regarding that and investigative journalism freedom of the press may come into play here. It will be interesting to see the arguments in defense of those actions. He may be found guilty in some states while not in others. I have a sneaking suspicion that he'll do some jail time in the end.

What I find interesting is the hypocrisy in prosecuting this case. There are,plenty of similar types of cases out there where people were taped without their consent in the name of investigative journalism and they were not prosecuted. Why this one?

Have they been criminally charged for making the tapes?

 

[PapaZoom]

Breaking the law as a way to dare the courts to do their job and then breaking them again when they start to do their job isn't exactly the most brilliant strategy to stay out of jail. It is consistent with someone who has fallen for their own [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], though. Things rarely tend to end well for people who lose perspective like that.

We shall see.

 

[PapaZoom]

Which makes them the devil incarnate and everything they do is pure evil?

No not everything. But they are an evil enterprise and the evil they do isn't mitigated by any good they might do.

 

[PapaZoom]

Innocent until proven guilty and all that still matters to some people. Granted a witch-hunt might be more entertaining, especially when you're really positive that the target must be doing something wrong, somehow, some way.

They are doing something wrong. They kill millions of unborn humans every years for profit.

 

[PapaZoom]

And groups like the CMP can break the and get caught for it. Guess which one of these "can" actually happened and which one is just a hypothetical that didn't?

We shall see how this fleshes out. It ain't over till the fat lady sings.

 

[PapaZoom]

Well, I can see why Daleiden's tactics don't bother you.

Congrats on that!

 

[Belk]

No not everything. But they are an evil enterprise and the evil they do isn't mitigated by any good they might do.

So it is in fact possible that they are not lying about selling body parts and cooking the books?

 

[Mayzoo]

No not everything. But they are an evil enterprise and the evil they do isn't mitigated by any good they might do.

According to you, CMP's good far outweighs the sin they partook in, but the opposite is not true for PP. Why is that?

CMP has effectively not accomplished anything "good" they set out to do (prove illegal activity) yet.

PP has accomplished a lot of verifiable good.

CMP receives only credit/accolades and no sanctions from you. PP receives only disdain from you.

 

[PapaZoom]

By giving simplistic arguments. That you find their actions deplorable, even evil, does not imply that they are dishonest in everything they do.



Yes I do disagree. First off simply they receive money for women's health services not abortion. Secondly "ripping the limbs off" is, to my knowledge, not part of a normal abortion procedure and even if it was making sure that you have all the tissue so that it does not turn septic and kill the mother strikes me as a good idea.

Suction Abortion: Used during the first three months of pregnancy - A suction tube (27 times stronger than a home vacuum cleaner) is inserted into the womb. The powerful suction tears the baby apart limb from limb and sucks it from the womb along with the placenta. The baby's remains are deposited into an attached waste bottle.

Dilation and Curettage (D&C): Used at the end of the third month of pregnancy (approximately 12 weeks) - The cervix is dialated, ring forceps are inserted into the womb and the baby is extracted piece by piece. Then a curette (a sharp knife in a loop shape) is inserted and used to scrape away any of the baby or the placenta that remains. Profuse bleeding follows.

Dilation and Extraction (D&E): Used after 13 weeks - The cervix is dialated and the unborn child is dismembered with plier-like forceps. Force is needed to pull the baby apart. The instrument is used to seize a leg or other part of the body and then, with a twisting motion, tear it from the baby's body. The baby's spine is snapped and the skull crushed. After the baby parts are removed, they are reassembled outside the womb to be sure all are removed. Frequently baby parts are left inside the mother's womb. This can cause serious complications and sometimes death.

The other procedures are just as horrible. So yes, they rip limbs off.

 

[PapaZoom]

So it is in fact possible that they are not lying about selling body parts and cooking the books?

anything is possible but not probable

 

[Belk]

Suction Abortion: Used during the first three months of pregnancy - A suction tube (27 times stronger than a home vacuum cleaner) is inserted into the womb. The powerful suction tears the baby apart limb from limb and sucks it from the womb along with the placenta. The baby's remains are deposited into an attached waste bottle.

Dilation and Curettage (D&C): Used at the end of the third month of pregnancy (approximately 12 weeks) - The cervix is dialated, ring forceps are inserted into the womb and the baby is extracted piece by piece. Then a curette (a sharp knife in a loop shape) is inserted and used to scrape away any of the baby or the placenta that remains. Profuse bleeding follows.

Dilation and Extraction (D&E): Used after 13 weeks - The cervix is dialated and the unborn child is dismembered with plier-like forceps. Force is needed to pull the baby apart. The instrument is used to seize a leg or other part of the body and then, with a twisting motion, tear it from the baby's body. The baby's spine is snapped and the skull crushed. After the baby parts are removed, they are reassembled outside the womb to be sure all are removed. Frequently baby parts are left inside the mother's womb. This can cause serious complications and sometimes death.

The other procedures are just as horrible. So yes, they rip limbs off.

Would you be so good as to post your source?

 

[PapaZoom]

According to you, CMP's good far outweighs the sin they partook in, but the opposite is not true for PP. Why is that?

CMP has effectively not accomplished anything "good" they set out to do (prove illegal activity) yet.

PP has accomplished a lot of verifiable good.

CMP receives only credit/accolades and no sanctions from you. PP receives only disdain from you.

CMP doesn't kill unborn humans for profit - PP does

 

[PapaZoom]

Would you be so good as to post your source?

What difference does that make? Are you saying that these descriptions are untrue? Why in the world would you need to piece the fetus back together to make sure you got all the pieces if the fetus hadn't been ripped apart in the first place?!

 

[PapaZoom]

Abortion isn't like having an hangnail removed. It's brutal. http://www.all.org/learn/abortion/methods/

http://abortioninstruments.com/new_index.html#instruments

 

[Belk]

What difference does that make? Are you saying that these descriptions are untrue? Why in the world would you need to piece the fetus back together to make sure you got all the pieces if the fetus hadn't been ripped apart in the first place?!

Because I wish to examine the veracity of their claims.

 

[Belk]

Abortion isn't like having an hangnail removed. It's brutal. http://www.all.org/learn/abortion/methods/

http://abortioninstruments.com/new_index.html#instruments

So is hip surgery. Yet I still had one.

 

[PapaZoom]

Would you be so good as to post your source?

Read this paper. If you're still not convinced that fetal limbs are ripped from the living human fetus, there's no point.
http://www.aaplog.org/position-and-papers/educational-letter-regarding-dismemberment-abortion-bans/

by
Donna J. Harrison
Executive Director
American Association of Pro-Life Obstetricians and Gynecologists

 

[PapaZoom]

So is hip surgery. Yet I still had one.

please...that's sick

 

[Mayzoo]

CMP doesn't kill unborn humans for profit - PP does

They lie, commit fraud, and break numerous laws for profit. They sin against God and man.

Comparing and ranking their sin by PPs sin is not scriptural. Their sin stands on its own and it is not mitigated or aggravated by anything PP does.

Their sin is theirs alone. No one can make their sin "go away" by screaming "but someone else did worse".

 

[PapaZoom]

Because I wish to examine the veracity of their claims.

Well if you still deny the evidence I provided, that will be telling.