Creation is finished; God schedules a tee time.

[chaoschristian]

Inspire by this thread in General Theology.

Particular post in question:

Good point, but a straight forward reading of Genesis suggests that God created all creatures fully formed as He planned, not to have them evolve (yes, you can use the word) into something completely different (in which case God's original plan for creation would be unfulfilled and is in contradiction to Genesis 2:1-2 that clearly states He finished His creation - this means that He finished His creation plan for the snake as well).

Here is my question: does scripture convey that God finished Creation and as such it is complete?

I am very much interested in hearing from everyone, but most especially those who hold this in the affirmative.

Note that I'm not at interested in the original thread's goings on about snakes. I am interested in exploring this aspect of what scripture teaches us about God's relationship with Creation.

 

[WithAllIAm]

I guess the phrase "Thus the heavens and Earth were finished, and all the host of them. And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had made; and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it He had rested from all His work which God created and made." (Genesis 2:13) is rather clear to me.

I personally believe that the passage makes it clear that God's work of creation finished at the end of the sixth day, when God completed all He had set out to do.

When we say that something or some task is "finished," what do we mean? The term "finished" generally means that the task or work has been brought to the desired final state or 100% completed.

This, of course, is denied by evolution, which in effect claims that the same processes that God used to create life is still going on today. How, then, could God's creation of the universe be brought to an end if it is always on-going?

IMHO, I believe that the same definition can be brought to this chapter too. Although I don't have an Old Testament Dictionary and can't be certain of that. The next phrase, "and all the host of them" (or the whole universe in other translations, or "in all their vast array") seems to back this assertion up and suggests that the whole universe was brought to its final desired state or end - speaking of all creation, including the stars just as much as the trees and other animals.

I am personally unsure as to how the evolutionist can combine evolutionary theory with Genesis without contradicting this passage.

 

[rmwilliamsll]

God continues to create new souls.
plus He creates the new heart in Christians.

creation has not ceased, perhaps it is more providence than supernatural creation however.

 

[WithAllIAm]

God continues to create new souls.
plus He creates the new heart in Christians. creation has not ceased, perhaps it is more providence than supernatural creation however.

God is not actively involved in the production or creation of new human beings as He was in the beginning. I actually question if God really "shapes" people as it seems to be chance gene combinations more than anything. I'm still trying to make up my mind on the issue presently.

As for God creating a new heart in Christians, this is different to the work that God originally planned in the beginning - which He finished then. Now, because of our sins, He works on reconcliation and a part of that is making us "born-again."

 

[jereth]

Creation is finished; God schedules a tee time

And on the Seventh Day God rested from his work of creation, and went to the golf course for a round of 18.

 

[shernren]

I am personally unsure as to how the evolutionist can combine evolutionary theory with Genesis without contradicting this passage.

I admire the way you worded this question. I personally believe that the Genesis creation account is focused on explaining the world phenomenologically, only referencing its completedness. There is hardly more detail than "God said let there be X. And there was X!" In any case, young-earth creationism admits that for a period during creation, creation was incomplete - even if that period was only a few days long. Whereas for evolution that period of incompleteness was many billions of years long. That in itself is the bulk of debate but both neo-creationism and evolutionism agree that at the end of God's period of creation, creation was complete and ready for the inhabitance of man, which was indeed one of the main purposes of creation anyway.

Besides, just because God has rested from creation doesn't mean He's taking things easy.

And this was why the Jews were persecuting Jesus, because he was doing these things on the Sabbath. But Jesus answered them, "My Father is working until now, and I am working." This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God. So Jesus said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of his own accord, but only what he sees the Father doing. For whatever the Father does, that the Son does likewise.
(John 5:16-19 ESV)

 

[theFijian]

Lord, create a new heart in me.

-The Psalmist

 

[Mallon]

God is not actively involved in the production or creation of new human beings as He was in the beginning. I actually question if God really "shapes" people as it seems to be chance gene combinations more than anything. I'm still trying to make up my mind on the issue presently.

Psalm 139:13: "For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb."
Sounds like He's still at it to me!

 

[chaoschristian]

This thread is also connected to this thread.

Specifically the concept of panentheism and a response to the charge that TEs are pantheists.

While I realize that certain among us have their reservations about the Wiki, I nevertheless provide these two references as a starting point:

WIKI on panentheism.

WIKI on pantheism.

Personally, I was a little struck by the fact that with regards to Creation theology, I may very well be Eastern Orthodox (the evangelical-catholic-oriental-weslyan-quaker?).

But more importantly, and more to the point, is this question I have for those who do not support the concept of panentheism, or the idea that God actively sustains Creation: 'If God withdrawals his presence, then what becomes of Creation?'

 

[Willtor]

That's really interesting. I had only ever heard of Panentheism in the sense that the world was part of God, and I hadn't heard it used in this way.

 

[Assyrian]

There are a few key verbs used to describe God work of creation in Genesis. There is the word create itself, bara, then there is asah, to make, used more often than bara. Finally there is yatsar used in Genesis 2 to describe God forming Adam and the animals. The question is, did God actually finish all his creating, making and forming, as the YEC literalist interpretation claims?

Psalm 102:18 Let this be recorded for a generation to come, so that a people yet to be created (bara) may praise the LORD:
Isaiah 41:19 I will put in the wilderness the cedar, the acacia, the myrtle, and the olive. I will set in the desert the cypress, the plane and the pine together,
20 that they may see and know, may consider and understand together, that the hand of the LORD has done this, the Holy One of Israel has created (bara) it.
Isaiah 43:1 But now thus says the LORD, he who created (bara)you, O Jacob, he who formed (yatsar) you, O Israel: "Fear not, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name, you are mine...
7 everyone who is called by my name, whom I created (bara) for my glory, whom I formed (yatsar) and made (asah)."
Isaiah 54:16 Behold, I have created (bara) the smith who blows the fire of coals and produces a weapon for its purpose. I have also created (bara) the ravager to destroy;
Amos 4:13 For behold, he who forms (yatsar) the mountains and creates (bara) the wind, and declares to man what is his thought, who makes the morning darkness, and treads on the heights of the earth-- the LORD, the God of hosts, is his name!

It sounds like Jesus was right and his Father never did stop working.