Colo. baker faces 're-education' training

Chrystal-J

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Denver, Colo., Apr 29, 2016 / 12:08 am (CNA/EWTN News).- The lawyers of the bakery owner who made headlines for declining to make a wedding cake for a same-sex wedding is “evaluating all legal options” to preserve the man’s First Amendment rights after the state’s highest court declined to take the case.
[...]
On April 25 the Colorado Supreme Court declined to review an earlier decision from the Colorado Civil Rights Commission requiring Jack Phillips and his staff at Masterpiece Cakeshop to undergo re-education training and file quarterly compliance reports for two years.

“Jack, who has happily served people of all backgrounds for years, simply exercised the long-cherished American freedom to decline to use his artistic talents to promote a message and event with which he disagrees, and that freedom shouldn’t be placed in jeopardy for anyone,” Tedesco continued.

Link: http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/n...after-state-court-refuses-to-take-case-28967/
 

MikeK

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Re education... sounds very sinister.

It does, that's why the headline writer selected that phrasing. He's gotta do something to get you to click on the article, and less sensasionalist language just isn't going to cut it.
 
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It does, that's why the headline writer selected that phrasing. He's gotta do something to get you to click on the article, and less sensasionalist language just isn't going to cut it.
Only re-education training is exactly what it is, so there's nothing sensationalist about it.
 
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MikeK

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Only re-education training is exactly what it is, so there's nothing sensationalist about it.

When a drunk driver gets mandated alcohol counseling, that's "re-education training"?
 
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It does, that's why the headline writer selected that phrasing. He's gotta do something to get you to click on the article, and less sensasionalist language just isn't going to cut it.

"Re-education" is used both in the text of the article itself as well releases from the Alliance Defending Freedom. The actual phrase used in court orders seems to be "comprehensive staff training" which has the exact same meaning, if perhaps a slightly less negative cultural connotation.

I see nothing in any report about the event which makes the phrase "re-education" appropriate. It may not be the phrase that those who support the ruling would use, but why should they be the ones that set the language? Should we refrain from calling an unborn child a "baby" or say that abortion is "murder" simply because those who are pro-abortion do not use that language? The language is, after all, accurate; it simply is inconvenient to those who would support an evil. Compromising on the use of language not because it is inaccurate, but because it is not what your opponents would prefer, is the first step to losing any cultural war.
 
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MikeK

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MoonlessNight

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My point exactly. This is the language of a political action committee.

And? Why should the official language be universal in all discussions of the matter? "Re-education" differs from what was used in the official document, but it isn't inaccurate.

The usual legal phrase for drunk driving is "Driving Under the Influence" or "Driving While Intoxicated." When someone is convicted for the behavior, it is usually a conviction for a charge under one of those names. Both of the phrases sound better than "drunk driving." And yet is common to talk about people getting convicted for "drunk driving" when it happens. Do you object to that practice?
 
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grandvizier1006

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Wait, does the article actually say? And why does the owner of a business need to be "trained" or "re-educated"? All because he wouldn't give a gay couple a wedding cake?
 
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MikeK

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And? Why should the official language be universal in all discussions of the matter? "Re-education" differs from what was used in the official document, but it isn't inaccurate.

The usual legal phrase for drunk driving is "Driving Under the Influence" or "Driving While Intoxicated." When someone is convicted for the behavior, it is usually a conviction for a charge under one of those names. Both of the phrases sound better than "drunk driving." And yet is common to talk about people getting convicted for "drunk driving" when it happens. Do you object to that practice?

"Drunk driving" isn't used in place of DUI or DWI in a transparent attempt to emotionally manipulate readers or draw the mind to Stalinist practices.
 
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MoonlessNight

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"Drunk driving" isn't used in place of DUI or DWI in a transparent attempt to emotionally manipulate readers or draw the mind to Stalinist practices.

"Emotional Manipulation" is what "rhetorical ability" is called (more specifically, use of pathos) by people who don't like the result of the manipulation.

There was a conversation on these forums that I had with someone else where it was claimed that the pro-life movement should stop referring to "unborn babies" because the term was a form of "emotional manipulation." At the same time talking about attempts of the government to "control the bodies of women" was not considered to be "emotional manipulation."

There is nothing wrong with emotional language if it is accurate. It is a normal part of human speech and most people who talk to others are aware of this. But it makes a handy scapegoat to complain about when someone is not willing to complain about the message itself. It sounds like a neutral standard that everyone agrees to, but in practice no one agrees to the standard of "no emotional manipulation," nor should they.
 
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Four Angels Standing

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It sounds like tyranny.
That's because it is tyranny.
And gay marriage wasn't even legal at the time all this started.

He should sue those who are assaulting his civil rights. Starting with the gay men, and moving on up through the ranks. The Constitution of the United States and State Constitutions are to protect the people from this kind of tyranny.

And Mr. Jack Phillips should not lose money by not making wedding cakes either. He can legally define the cakes his shop will create for customers by posting displays of the cakes available for order. Toppers that feature the traditional bride and groom is all he needs to do. And no one can force him to change that.
This isn't to say a gay couple can't order that and then change the toppers when they're in private. But that's on them, not him.

This is Orwellian what's happening to this poor man. And all it does is to serve to encourage the ultra-leftists to pursue the same kind of religious persecution against others once this so called success story makes headlines over and over.

God help us.
 
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Chrystal-J

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That's because it is tyranny.
This is Orwellian what's happening to this poor man. And all it does is to serve to encourage the ultra-leftists to pursue the same kind of religious persecution against others once this so called success story makes headlines over and over.

God help us.

Agreed.
 
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CNN 2015 = Living in fear: Egypt's gay community

Twitchy 2016:Bryan Adams, back from Egypt concert, cancels Mississippi show due to ‘discriminatory’ law


Washington Post 2014:Here are the 10 countries where homosexuality may be punished by death

___*edited

*edited. The former PayPal link here was to show the countries PayPal operates in world wide. And so as to demonstrate the hypocrisy PP promotes about themselves when they boycott North Carolina while claiming they are inclusive and support gay rights.
When PayPal operates in countries that prosecute gays, even to the point of execution, PayPal is not demonstrating consistency in their claim of gay civil rights support. Else they'd stop doing any kind of business in countries that imprison and/or kill gays. And of course Transsexuals.
 
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WarriorAngel

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Denver, Colo., Apr 29, 2016 / 12:08 am (CNA/EWTN News).- The lawyers of the bakery owner who made headlines for declining to make a wedding cake for a same-sex wedding is “evaluating all legal options” to preserve the man’s First Amendment rights after the state’s highest court declined to take the case.
[...]
On April 25 the Colorado Supreme Court declined to review an earlier decision from the Colorado Civil Rights Commission requiring Jack Phillips and his staff at Masterpiece Cakeshop to undergo re-education training and file quarterly compliance reports for two years.

“Jack, who has happily served people of all backgrounds for years, simply exercised the long-cherished American freedom to decline to use his artistic talents to promote a message and event with which he disagrees, and that freedom shouldn’t be placed in jeopardy for anyone,” Tedesco continued.

Link: http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/n...after-state-court-refuses-to-take-case-28967/
Well if his helpers accidentally peed in the cake mix....

:D
:p

It's the most inane thing to take ppl to court and refuse to allow them a conscience on their God given rights.

Anyone remember the Declaration of Independence...
The alleged excuse we werent a Christian nation at the start with hopes to remain so?

Yeah - rights endowed by the CREATOR...!
 
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MikeK

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"Emotional Manipulation" is what "rhetorical ability" is called (more specifically, use of pathos) by people who don't like the result of the manipulation.

There was a conversation on these forums that I had with someone else where it was claimed that the pro-life movement should stop referring to "unborn babies" because the term was a form of "emotional manipulation." At the same time talking about attempts of the government to "control the bodies of women" was not considered to be "emotional manipulation."

That person's opinion is is rediculous as those who think that the emotional manipulation in the OP is okay. It has nothing to do with the "result" of the manipulation.
 
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Four Angels Standing

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I think one day very soon we'll find we're a Marxist style nation.
You have indications of the movement already showing its head when proponents of such a thing call Christian's religion a privilege, when racists invent the bigoted slur to marginalize the Caucasian by stating their existence in America is a matter of, white privilege. When healthy men and women are told they have to identify themselves as non-Transgender by adopting the artificial term, Cisgender.

There are atheist websites that take real historic references our forefathers made concerning God and the Christian faith and claim they're Internet meme's or false quotes when they're not.

Meanwhile, anti-Christian activists condemn Christian business owners for holding to their values and refusing to approve gay marriage that God calls an abomination, while remaining completely mute when Muslim bakery owners refuse to make gay wedding cakes, when bakeries owned by gays are recorded refusing to create Christian traditional man/woman wedding cakes and even invoke their reasoning as retaliation against straight Christian bakers and the faith itself.

You have a major financial entity claiming they're not going to open a satellite office in a southern American state due to the democratic process creating a law that protects the majority of residents from exploitation and possible assault, while doing business in countries that prosecute capital punishment laws against members of the same community that financial entity claims to champion in America.
You have washed up no longer top ten musicians boycotting that same southern American state while invoking protest against a law passed through the democratic process and that protects the majority of state residents from exploitation and possible assault . And yet that same washed up no longer top ten musician played a concert in a middle eastern nation wherein their dictatorial processes jail the same community of people that musician claims to champion through their boycott of that American state.

It's all smoke and mirrors. It's claimed to be one thing but it is truly beneath the surface not at all what it pretends to be.
Ironic isn't it?

There's a movement afoot in America intent on targeting Christians and their faith and repealing the first amendment protections guaranteed that community and its members. While other religions that behave the same way are given a pass for exercising their same religious rights against deviant immoral behaviors.

And then the anti-Christian bigots who champion that kind of discrimination claim the community they target with purpose are delusional, and are just upset because they're finding that in America the homosexual transsexual activists are letting them know that their Christian faith is a privilege! Not a right! And it is time that privilege be rescinded.

And in order to deliver that message at every opportunity, those homosexual transsexual anti-Christian activists and their allies will assume a Christian religious title so they can gain entry into churches, communities, and deliver that message and forewarning to the Christians they despise.
Then they chuckle when the observant who see behind their facade recognize this as yet another escalation in the battle that is that of spiritual warfare. Because those homosexual transsexual anti-Christian activists and their allies are the pawns on the front line of a demonic force determined to turn the Christian faith and the right, not privilege to practice , but the Constitutionally protected inalienable right to affirm Christian faith, into a community of the past.
One that is exterminated, or goes into hiding like what is seen now in middle eastern countries.
Their agenda is to bring Hell to earth. And the only way they can accomplish that is if the teaching that identifies Hell and its agents is eliminated.

It is all foretold. And you'll know those that are the one's I refer to when they laugh even at that.

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WarriorAngel

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That person's opinion is is rediculous as those who think that the emotional manipulation in the OP is okay. It has nothing to do with the "result" of the manipulation.
Jesus started it.
He was an emotional manipulator from way back.
 
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