Christ our High Priest at Judgment Seat of Christ: 1844

[BobRyan]

In Matt 7 Christ says that it is not those who "say Lord Lord" that enter the kingdom of heaven - but it is those that "do the will of the Father" - and "By their fruits you shall know them".

The Courts of heaven open the books and review the Romans 2 and 2Cor 5:10 record - not because this will change the state of a saved or lost person - but to determine the state that is already there. This is not God "figuring it out" by the myriads and myriads mentioned in vs 9-10 of Daniel 7 are using the Matt 7 rule to see who is righteous and who is just pretending to be born-again.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[VictorC]

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.


And most Christians know about the "Judgment seat of Christ" and the fact that every single one of us will have our cases brought up there.

2 Cor 5
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

Romans 2 delineates the problem Jew and Gentile share alike, before the solution provided in the Gospel is given in the next chapter. Fetching a sound-bit is done in ignorance of the narrative penned by the inspired author.

As for your appeal to 2 Corinthians 5, you're repeating an error that was already mentioned to you, Bob. Did you miss how the SDA church defines the Investigative Judgment?

• Convened only after 1844, 'it is...in 1844...to perform the work of investigative judgment'
• Addresses only the 'professed people of God', and is not a general judgment
• Convened in absentia of the accused, 'they will not be present in person'
• The accused are judged according to the old covenant, 'The law of God is the standard'
• Adventist soteriology is dependent on this alleged judgment, 'their names will be blotted out of the book of life'

Where 2 Corinthians 5:10 mentions our appearance before the seat of Christ, you're ignoring the aspect of the IJ being convened in absentia of the accused. When you disregard v.5:5's guarantee of preparation via the Holy Spirit given to us, you misapply your church's soteriology to a passage that contains an assurance that this judgment does not support Ellen's claim of "names will be blotted out of the book of life".

You cannot make your case about 2Cor 5:10 and Romans 2:6-13 and Dan 7:9-22 by ignoring the texts.

You would need to show "in the texts" that they do not point to future judgment or that the future judgment pointed to excludes "evil deeds" when in fact Paul specifically states that the future judgment does include that subject.

In fact in Romans 2 Paul points to both succeeding cases and to failing cases in that future judgment - future to Romans 2, Future to 2Cor 5:10 and future to Daniel 7.

But as Daniel 7 tells us - it happens after the 1260 years of dark ages - but before the 2nd coming.

in Christ,

Bob

Bob, stop ignoring what the Biblical texts actually state. They do not depict an Investigative Judgment anywhere, and this extra-Biblical doctrine exists only to apologize for the fictitious dates that don't fit the terminus of the model you adhere to.

 

[VictorC]

As for Dan 7 -- page 2 of this thread has this.

Daniel 7 depicts a judgment of the beast powers, after which the saints of God are awarded large parcels of real estate that belonged to the beast powers. Those subjected to this judgment are the beasts.
Not the saints.
Do you really want us to believe the beast powers and the little horn are 'the professed people of God'?

Don't expect the ridiculous from us.
One more time:

• Convened only after 1844, 'it is...in 1844...to perform the work of investigative judgment'
• Addresses only the 'professed people of God', and is not a general judgment
• Convened in absentia of the accused, 'they will not be present in person'
• The accused are judged according to the old covenant, 'The law of God is the standard'
• Adventist soteriology is dependent on this alleged judgment, 'their names will be blotted out of the book of life'

This is what you need to provide a Biblical picture of within Scripture. Performing the exercise will demonstrate to yourself that it doesn't exist.

 

[BobRyan]

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.


And most Christians know about the "Judgment seat of Christ" and the fact that every single one of us will have our cases brought up there.

2 Cor 5
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

You cannot make your case about 2Cor 5:10 and Romans 2:6-13 and Dan 7:9-22 by ignoring the texts.

You would need to show "in the texts" that they do not point to future judgment or that the future judgment pointed to excludes "evil deeds" when in fact Paul specifically states that the future judgment does include that subject.

In fact in Romans 2 Paul points to both succeeding cases and to failing cases in that future judgment - future to Romans 2, Future to 2Cor 5:10 and future to Daniel 7.

But as Daniel 7 tells us - it happens after the 1260 years of dark ages - but before the 2nd coming.

As for Dan 7 -- page 2 of this thread has this.

=================================

Dan 7 - and the Judgment seat of Christ that is future to Romans 2.



9 “I kept looking
Until thrones were set up,
And the Ancient of Days took His seat;
His vesture was like white snow
And the hair of His head like pure wool.
His throne was ablaze with flames,
Its wheels were a burning fire.
10 “A river of fire was flowing
And coming out from before Him;
Thousands upon thousands were attending Him,
And myriads upon myriads were standing before Him;
The court sat,
And the books were opened.

11 Then I kept looking because of the sound of the boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was slain, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. 12 As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away, but an extension of life was granted to them for an appointed period of time.
The Son of Man Presented

13 “I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven
One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He came up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14 “And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations and men of every language
Might serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
Which will not pass away;
And His kingdom is one
Which will not be destroyed.

The Vision Interpreted

15 “As for me, Daniel, my spirit was distressed within me, and the visions in my mind kept alarming me. 16 I approached one of those who were standing by and began asking him the exact meaning of all this. So he told me and made known to me the interpretation of these things:

17 ‘These great beasts, which are four in number, are four kings who will arise from the earth. 18 But the saints of the Highest One will receive the kingdom and possess the kingdom forever, for all ages to come.’
19 “Then I desired to know the exact meaning of the fourth beast, which was different from all the others, exceedingly dreadful, with its teeth of iron and its claws of bronze, and which devoured, crushed and trampled down the remainder with its feet, 20 and the meaning of the ten horns that were on its head and the other horn which came up, and before which three of them fell, namely, that horn which had eyes and a mouth uttering great boasts and which was larger in appearance than its associates. 21 I kept looking, and that horn was waging war with the saints and overpowering them 22 until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was passed in favor of the saints of the Highest One, and the time arrived when the saints took possession of the kingdom.
.. 26 But the court will sit for judgment, and his dominion will be taken away, annihilated and destroyed forever. 27 Then the sovereignty, the dominion and the greatness of all the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be given to the people of the saints of the Highest One; His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all the dominions will serve and obey Him.’

Bob, stop ignoring what the Biblical texts actually state. They do not depict an Investigative Judgment anywhere,

I find your logic "illusive" since I am the one that is actually quoting the texts and you are dismissing them when not quoting me.

The "books were opened" Dan 7 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ and given an account for the deeds done in the body" 2Cor 5:10 -- this is a future judgment based on deeds - written in books -

Some do not like to summarize that as "investigative" -- I don't care if they use that name or not -- the point remains - it is deeds written in books, it is "the court sat and the books were opened" it is "Judgment passed in favor of the saints" -- it is "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account for the deeds done IN the body -- good or evil"

And then there is Romans 2:6-13 to be carefully ignored if you don't believe in being judged according to deeds in that future judgment.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

If you ignored the Bible and only read a few verses of it - you would still get the point it is so obvious --

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

 

[VictorC]

I find your logic "illusive" since I

am the one that is quoting the texts and you are dismissing them.

The "books were opened" Dan 7 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ and given an account for the deeds done in the body" 2Cor 5:10 -- this is a future judgment based on deeds - written in books -

Some do not like to summarize that as "investigative" -- I don't care if they use that name or not -- the point remains - it is deeds written in books, it is "the court sat and the books were opened" it is "Judgment passed in favor of the saints" -- it is "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account for the deeds done IN the body -- good or evil"

And then there is Romans 2:6-13 to be carefully ignored if you don't believe in being judged according to deeds in that future judgment.

in Christ,

Bob

I fail to see how repeating comments that have already been refuted answers anything that I posted. Vain repetition doesn't really contribute to a conversation. Perhaps you should ask yourself why it remains impossible after more than 160 years the SDA church cannot fit their peculiar doctrine in the Biblical narratives.

 

[VictorC]

If you ignored the Bible and only read a few verses of it - you would still get the point it is so obvious --

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

If you were more familiar with the epistle to the Romans, you would already know that the recipients of the Law aren't compliant with the Law: For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all. (Romans 11:32) Taking a sound bite is ignoring the immediate and long context of the narrative that you're apparently not cognizant of.

 

[from scratch]

In Matt 7 Christ says that it is not those who "say Lord Lord" that enter the kingdom of heaven - but it is those that "do the will of the Father" - and "By their fruits you shall know them".

The Courts of heaven open the books and review the Romans 2 and 2Cor 5:10 record - not because this will change the state of a saved or lost person - but to determine the state that is already there. This is not God "figuring it out" by the myriads and myriads mentioned in vs 9-10 of Daniel 7 are using the Matt 7 rule to see who is righteous and who is just pretending to be born-again.

in Christ,

Bob

What does John say about this will of the Father?

 

[from scratch]

I find your logic "illusive" since I am the one that is actually quoting the texts and you are dismissing them when not quoting me.

The "books were opened" Dan 7 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ and given an account for the deeds done in the body" 2Cor 5:10 -- this is a future judgment based on deeds - written in books -

Some do not like to summarize that as "investigative" -- I don't care if they use that name or not -- the point remains - it is deeds written in books, it is "the court sat and the books were opened" it is "Judgment passed in favor of the saints" -- it is "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account for the deeds done IN the body -- good or evil"

And then there is Romans 2:6-13 to be carefully ignored if you don't believe in being judged according to deeds in that future judgment.

in Christ,

Bob

No, I think you're reaching for straws to support your idea. Your real intent is to prove by any means Christians are obligated to the law. You even use Paul against himself in this endeavor. The reality is you crucify your supporter.

Your agenda is to impose the law on the Christian. The Apostles said no while you say yes.

 

[from scratch]

If you ignored the Bible and only read a few verses of it - you would still get the point it is so obvious --

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

Then Enoch, Job nor Abraham can be justified because the law came after Abraham. Therefore none of the preceding can be justified by it. They didn't have the law according to Moses whom you also deny.

 

[from scratch]

I fail to see how repeating comments that have already been refuted answers anything that I posted. Vain repetition doesn't really contribute to a conversation. Perhaps you should ask yourself why it remains impossible after more than 160 years the SDA church cannot fit their peculiar doctrine in the Biblical narratives.

The intent is to fluster and frustrate one into compliance by them thinking they haven't answered the question. This is achieved by ignoring those being talked with. There's really no conversation, just interrupted preaching.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The intent is to fluster and frustrate one into compliance by them thinking they haven't answered the question. This is achieved by ignoring those being talked with. There's really no conversation, just interrupted preaching.

A Pentecostal lady that I know has been confronted by a seventh day keeper insisting that she obeys only nine of the ten commandments and demanding to know why. It seems to be a common ploy. It may be something recommended in some book that seventh day keepers read and value.

 

[from scratch]

A Pentecostal lady that I know has been confronted by a seventh day keeper insisting that she obeys only nine of the ten commandments and demanding to know why. It seems to be a common ploy. It may be something recommended in some book that seventh day keepers read and value.

Its their standard opening ploy. They appear to condemn because most aren't prepared with an answer. The major reason is because most haven't read the Bible and certainly aren't taught the truth. When anyone responds to their John 14:15 verse with John 15:10 they then must deny the trinity doctrine. The lie then builds. An SDA then tried to prove through Heb 1 that Jesus was merely another prophet with various shenanigans including the structure of language. That is even denying Jesus is God. It gets worse.

They try to say Jesus could have sinned not realizing they're saying God can sin.

How anyone can say that is Christian doctrine is beyond me. (hint, hint) I hate PC speech requirements.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Its their standard opening ploy. They appear to condemn because most aren't prepared with an answer. The major reason is because most haven't read the Bible and certainly aren't taught the truth. When anyone responds to their John 14:15 verse with John 15:10 they then must deny the trinity doctrine. The lie then builds. An SDA then tried to prove through Heb 1 that Jesus was merely another prophet with various shenanigans including the structure of language. That is even denying Jesus is God. It gets worse.

They try to say Jesus could have sinned not realizing they're saying God can sin.

How anyone can say that is Christian doctrine is beyond me. (hint, hint) I hate PC speech requirements.

This thread's title is a very powerful testimony to a departure from the gospel. The idea that 1844 AD marks the year when Jesus started to judge individuals for the purpose of condemning some and saving others is not orthodox christianity. Therefore it is not a surprise to hear that some who demand seventh day keeping of others would also have reservations about the incarnation of God in the person of Jesus Christ. That is, after all, what First John chapter four warns is the mark of antichrist.

1 John 4:2-3 2 This is how you can know the Spirit of God: every spirit that acknowledges Jesus Christ come in the flesh be longs to God, 3 and every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus does not belong to God. This is the spirit of the antichrist that, as you heard, is to come, but in fact is already in the world.
​

 

[Keachian]

Its their standard opening ploy. They appear to condemn because most aren't prepared with an answer. The major reason is because most haven't read the Bible and certainly aren't taught the truth. When anyone responds to their John 14:15 verse with John 15:10 they then must deny the trinity doctrine. The lie then builds. An SDA then tried to prove through Heb 1 that Jesus was merely another prophet with various shenanigans including the structure of language. That is even denying Jesus is God. It gets worse.

They try to say Jesus could have sinned not realizing they're saying God can sin.

How anyone can say that is Christian doctrine is beyond me. (hint, hint) I hate PC speech requirements.

The classic adoptionist position of the SDA has been downplayed in recent years, first after EGW's passing and later as they engaged in an act of deception through the publication of Questions on Doctrine The question then obviously becomes; What is Seventh Day Adventism that rejects Ellen G White?

 

[whitebeaches]

Mod Hat On​

This thread has been moved from the General Theology Forum.​

Documentation of the thread move is here for staff only.​

Mod Hat Off​

 

[Keachian]

Heb 8:1 says that Christ sat down at the right hand of God to do his work as High Priest.

Heb 8:1 must be read in the context of Heb 1:1, 10:12. As opposed to the Aaronic priesthood who "stood daily at his service..." (10:11) Christ has "offered for all time a single sacrifice for sins." (10:12) This single sacrifice is not like that of the offering of the Old high priest, for if it were "he would have had to suffer repeatedly since the foundation of the world. But as it is, he has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself." (9:26) And so we find that Christ sat down because the crux of his work is complete all the Elect are justified before God.

Dan 12 says that He stands up - to mark the end of it.

I'm assuming you are referring to 12:1-3 here, why is this referring to 1844 and not the Second or indeed as the traditional understanding of the text has been the First advent of our Lord? And if you can show that it is referring to 1844 wouldn't that mean that you would ascribe to the view your Prophet has that Christ's intercession will cease?

As the OT says "He sits as priest and King" doing his work seated on his throne.

Yes, he has done his priestly work and so rules his People.

Paul says in Heb 4 "WE HAVE a High Priest" not "we HAD one".

I would agree with Paul here, I think if I push enough we will find that it is you that believes that this verse is not applicable at all points in time.

Thus Paul can say in 2Cor 5:10 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ" -- to given an account for the deeds done in the body - not just good ones - but also evil deeds.'

And so in Romans 2:13 "it is not the HEARERS of the law that are just before God but the DOERS of the law WILL BE Justified... on the day when according to my GOSPEL God WILL judge" - future to Romans 2 as well.

And then Paul goes on to say:
None is righteous, no, not one; no one understands; no one seeks for God. All have turned aside; together they have become worthless; no one does good, not even one.” “Their throat is an open grave; they use their tongues to deceive.” “The venom of asps is under their lips.” “Their mouth is full of curses and bitterness.” “Their feet are swift to shed blood; in their paths are ruin and misery, and the way of peace they have not known.” “There is no fear of God before their eyes.”

In the Lutheran understanding of Romans 1:1-3:20 is the bad news or Law, here is the good news:
But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it—the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

 

[BobRyan]

I fail to see how repeating comments that have already been refuted

It is unclear to me that you can refute these Bible texts without actually dealing with the details IN the texts.

The subject matter is "in the texts" -- simply sidestepping them does not refute them.

Hence this list ---

=================================================

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.


And most Christians know about the "Judgment seat of Christ" and the fact that every single one of us will have our cases brought up there.

2 Cor 5
10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may be recompensed for his deeds in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

You cannot make your case about 2Cor 5:10 and Romans 2:6-13 and Dan 7:9-22 by ignoring the texts.

You would need to show "in the texts" that they do not point to future judgment or that the future judgment pointed to excludes "evil deeds" when in fact Paul specifically states that the future judgment does include that subject.

In fact in Romans 2 Paul points to both succeeding cases and to failing cases in that future judgment - future to Romans 2, Future to 2Cor 5:10 and future to Daniel 7.

But as Daniel 7 tells us - it happens after the 1260 years of dark ages - but before the 2nd coming.

As for Dan 7 -- page 2 of this thread has this.

=================================

Dan 7 - and the Judgment seat of Christ that is future to Romans 2.



9 “I kept looking
Until thrones were set up,
And the Ancient of Days took His seat;
His vesture was like white snow
And the hair of His head like pure wool.
His throne was ablaze with flames,
Its wheels were a burning fire.
10 “A river of fire was flowing
And coming out from before Him;
Thousands upon thousands were attending Him,
And myriads upon myriads were standing before Him;
The court sat,
And the books were opened.

11 Then I kept looking because of the sound of the boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was slain, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. 12 As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away, but an extension of life was granted to them for an appointed period of time.
The Son of Man Presented

13 “I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven
One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He came up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14 “And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations and men of every language
Might serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
Which will not pass away;
And His kingdom is one
Which will not be destroyed.

The Vision Interpreted

15 “As for me, Daniel, my spirit was distressed within me, and the visions in my mind kept alarming me. 16 I approached one of those who were standing by and began asking him the exact meaning of all this. So he told me and made known to me the interpretation of these things:

17 ‘These great beasts, which are four in number, are four kings who will arise from the earth. 18 But the saints of the Highest One will receive the kingdom and possess the kingdom forever, for all ages to come.’
19 “Then I desired to know the exact meaning of the fourth beast, which was different from all the others, exceedingly dreadful, with its teeth of iron and its claws of bronze, and which devoured, crushed and trampled down the remainder with its feet, 20 and the meaning of the ten horns that were on its head and the other horn which came up, and before which three of them fell, namely, that horn which had eyes and a mouth uttering great boasts and which was larger in appearance than its associates. 21 I kept looking, and that horn was waging war with the saints and overpowering them 22 until the Ancient of Days came and judgment was passed in favor of the saints of the Highest One, and the time arrived when the saints took possession of the kingdom.
.. 26 But the court will sit for judgment, and his dominion will be taken away, annihilated and destroyed forever. 27 Then the sovereignty, the dominion and the greatness of all the kingdoms under the whole heaven will be given to the people of the saints of the Highest One; His kingdom will be an everlasting kingdom, and all the dominions will serve and obey Him.’

Bob, stop ignoring what the Biblical texts actually state. They do not depict an Investigative Judgment anywhere,

I find your logic "illusive" since I am the one that is actually quoting the texts and you are dismissing them when not quoting me.

The "books were opened" Dan 7 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ and given an account for the deeds done in the body" 2Cor 5:10 -- this is a future judgment based on deeds - written in books -

Some do not like to summarize that as "investigative" -- I don't care if they use that name or not -- the point remains - it is deeds written in books, it is "the court sat and the books were opened" it is "Judgment passed in favor of the saints" -- it is "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account for the deeds done IN the body -- good or evil"

And then there is Romans 2:6-13 to be carefully ignored if you don't believe in being judged according to deeds in that future judgment.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

If you ignored the Bible and only read a few verses of it - you would still get the point it is so obvious --

Romans 2
13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified. 14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves, 15 in that they show the work of the Law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness and their thoughts alternately accusing or else defending them, 16 on the day when, according to my GOSPEL, God will judge the secrets of men through Christ Jesus.

If you were more familiar with the epistle to the Romans, you would already know that the recipients of the Law aren't compliant with the Law: For God has committed them all to disobedience, that He might have mercy on all. (Romans 11:32) Taking a sound bite is ignoring the immediate and long context of the narrative that you're apparently not cognizant of.

Romans 8:6-8 points out the fact that only the lost are in a position of being unable to submit to the Law of God. Romans 6 makes the same point.

Rom 8
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.



Is it any wonder then these other Christian sources are so much in agreement with "what matters is keeping the COMMANDMENTS of GOD" 1Cor 7:19??

The "Baptist Confession of Faith"
The "Westminster Confession of Faith"
The Catholic Catechism
D.L. Moody
R.C Sproul
Andy Stanley
Thomas Watson
etc.

 

[Keachian]

I find your logic "illusive" since I am the one that is actually quoting the texts and you are dismissing them when not quoting me.

You're not treating the texts properly, you are conflating them to make it appear that your pet theology is there.

The "books were opened" Dan 7 "We must all stand before the judgment seat of Christ and given an account for the deeds done in the body" 2Cor 5:10 -- this is a future judgment based on deeds - written in books -

Since Dan 7 is talking about the judgment not of the deeds of the believer as in 2Cor 5:10 but of those that persecute the Elect, they are dealing with different things therefore to bring the two texts together in the way that you are is eisegesis.

Some do not like to summarize that as "investigative" -- I don't care if they use that name or not -- the point remains - it is deeds written in books, it is "the court sat and the books were opened" it is "Judgment passed in favor of the saints" -- it is "we must ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ to give an account for the deeds done IN the body -- good or evil"

You cannot shift from Dan 7:26 to 2 Cor 5:10 they are not addressing the same thing, you are doing injustice to the text.

And then there is Romans 2:6-13 to be carefully ignored if you don't believe in being judged according to deeds in that future judgment.

Why focus on Rom 2:6-13 when the apostle goes on to say that everyone falls short of this standard in 3:10-13 and then talks about the righteousness of God manifested apart from the law in 3:21ff again you do injustice to the text by not recognising what the purpose of the Apostle's writing is.