Discussion Can you lose your salvation ? -and all the variance of topic is leads to

[Job8]

no one has said anything to deny this verse what so ever .. but we are saved for a purpose and it is to serve god obediently in righteousness and bear fruit

Correct. And that is precisely what verse 10 says -- saved unto good works. If there is no fruit, then there is no genuine faith, nor genuine salvation. By their fruits ye shall know them. But those good works do not save. They simply confirm that salvation is real.

 

[Alithis]

I do not believe we can lose our salvation ... I think that phrase is a misnomer. Saying "We can lose our salvation" is like saying "We can undo Christ's sacrifice." Either Christ was crucified for (partially) such a purpose, or He was not. Arguably, every person who has been allowed to draw breath on this earth after Christ's resurrection, is part of "salvation". I would say it was something that went into effect in it's current manner, the moment Christ triumphed over death. Technically, history could have ended right then and there, but it hasn't, it has continued, and we arguably all fall under the umbrella of "salvation" perhaps, the testimony being that we are here, now.

However, I do believe that not every person's name is written in the Book of Life, and that a person whose name *is* written there, can have their name removed, and thus, not attain eternal life in the Kingdom of God. This isn't the same as "salvation", in my opinion. Salvation is what allows you to exist and offers you an opportunity to be in that Book.

when a thread gets long it can begin to circles back on itself .. so yup . we have more or less covered the concept of losing faith ..which loses salvation because salvation at present is grasped by faith ..but when the lord returns then we will receive it in the present actual . thus if we lose faith and cast it off to walk in sin because its 'too hard' we cast of that which by faith we grasped .. and we lose what we had a firm hold on.

 

[Alithis]

Correct. And that is precisely what verse 10 says -- saved unto good works. If there is no fruit, then there is no genuine faith, nor genuine salvation. By their fruits ye shall know them. But those good works do not save. They simply confirm that salvation is real.

totally .. and such fruits can only come forth by obedience -the fruit of the holy spirit then causs us to bring froth fruit .. the fruits of love peace joy obedience ar not OUR fruits they are the fruit of the holy Spirit ..OUR fruit is to propagate that which we have become .. just as adam and eve were told in the flesh to be fruitful..it did not speak of works they did ..but of multiplying themselves ..
just so - in the spirit we are to multiply..
go -heal the sick preach the gospel drive out demons raise the dead baptise in his name and make MORE disciples - souls for the kingdom of God - is the fruit .

 

[Si_monfaith]

not if you walk in disobedience to it .to come to the conclusion your want ..you have to ignore so much scripture .it is not the biblical conclusion ,it is what you 'want " ..but why ? is there a particular sin you desire to continue doing so that you can have both sin and be saved ?
you can't have it both ways .

Adam & eve were nude. But now nudity is sin. Why? Not becz it is sin in itself but becz man believes that it is sin. Now why he believes so? Becz he is under law. But Jesus set us free from law by his death. So why talk about sin?

 

[Si_monfaith]

There is no such thing as sin as without law sin is dead-rom7:8.

 

[Si_monfaith]

The problem is that the New Testament is filled with warnings, from the parables of Christ, to the teachings of Peter, Paul, and the others. People say that because the exact words "losing your salvation" is not found in scripture, that all is well. Being spit out of the mouth of God certainly must mean something else, right?

But what should concern us is that we, for the most part, do not care if we make our God sick, as long as we get into Heaven. We do not want to fight against sin in our lives, or love like Christ loved, for we think it is a battle that cannot be won, so why waste the effort? So let's eat, drink and be merry and wait for the rapture bus.

Why watch against the wiles of the devil, if in the end, we get the keys to our mansion regardless? Sure, I think most would agree in theory that it would be nice to actually obey God but that is the extent of it. Heck, it would be acceptable to our God If we wanted to walk in full obedience, or even to cry out to Him like Paul did.... as wretched men..... because we too want to obey Him in all things.

But let's be honest here. The sad truth here is that the masses that fill our churches every Sunday do not really care about becoming living sacrifices, nor being taught by the grace they say they love as to HOW to possess our vessels in sanctification and honor. Truth? I think we all know so.

In our lifetimes, we have seen an amazing thing. We have seen the devil infiltrate our very churches, churches that have turned grace into lasciviousness, or at least tried to, and it is that very mindset that plagued the Laodecians. Let's remember what God told them.

I would rather you stone cold to me rather than be entrenched in a lifeless Christianity that encourages you that going through the motions is fine with Me, all because of grace.

We have fallen for a lie from the pit, and soon we will all see it. Unfortunately, not all will want to change, or bow the knee to him in ALL things. We are entering the valley of decision, and here, there is no middle ground. Either He reigns, or we continue to, and salvation.... OUR salvation..... Is at stake.

Lest we forget, what proves that our one time prayer actually worked is the fact we continue to follow Him, to walk in the light as He is in the light, and thus to endure to the end. And if we find walking the walk too hard, should it not actually bother us? Should we not be found on our knees in tears seeking real grace, grace to change us, free us, and use us so that our lives do not bring dishonor to Him any longer?

The subject of OSAS brings out the arguments aplenty as to why we cannot lose our salvation. But truthfully, that question is not THE question that we need to answer. The subject that should be at the forefront of our minds is why the grace we all claim we love is not teaching us how to live godly lives. Sadly, few are found asking such questions at present, for the path of least resistance, promising eternity but with no requirement to give up ones pearls, or to hate one's old nature, has anethesthesized us into a walk of total lukewarmness, and we think nothing of it.it is time to awake.

With all my heart, I do believe the times really are changing though, and many who now resist the pull of the Spirit, including His warnings and chastenings, will soon weep deep tears of shame and repentance. Praise God, it is not too late, and they will find that there is power in grace that we have heretofore been totally blinded to. God has promised to "cause us" to walk obediently. We are about to discover that this is no exaggeration. But the first step is to want it. It is the hardest of all the steps back to pleasing our Father, for satan knows that if the sleeping giant is reawakened, all bets are off.

A new day is dawning, and not a moment too soon. The church is down, but not out, and soon, men that once reviled our shallowness, worldliness, and abject hypocrisy, will instead exclaim "Look! That which bore only briars and thorns has become once again like the garden of Eden."

I can't wait. How about you?

Blessings,

Gideon

Warnings are for those Christians who trust the moral law(ml) & still violate. They r not for those who trust his blood alone for salvation.

 

[Si_monfaith]

The problem is that the New Testament is filled with warnings, from the parables of Christ, to the teachings of Peter, Paul, and the others. People say that because the exact words "losing your salvation" is not found in scripture, that all is well. Being spit out of the mouth of God certainly must mean something else, right?

But what should concern us is that we, for the most part, do not care if we make our God sick, as long as we get into Heaven. We do not want to fight against sin in our lives, or love like Christ loved, for we think it is a battle that cannot be won, so why waste the effort? So let's eat, drink and be merry and wait for the rapture bus.

Why watch against the wiles of the devil, if in the end, we get the keys to our mansion regardless? Sure, I think most would agree in theory that it would be nice to actually obey God but that is the extent of it. Heck, it would be acceptable to our God If we wanted to walk in full obedience, or even to cry out to Him like Paul did.... as wretched men..... because we too want to obey Him in all things.

But let's be honest here. The sad truth here is that the masses that fill our churches every Sunday do not really care about becoming living sacrifices, nor being taught by the grace they say they love as to HOW to possess our vessels in sanctification and honor. Truth? I think we all know so.

In our lifetimes, we have seen an amazing thing. We have seen the devil infiltrate our very churches, churches that have turned grace into lasciviousness, or at least tried to, and it is that very mindset that plagued the Laodecians. Let's remember what God told them.

I would rather you stone cold to me rather than be entrenched in a lifeless Christianity that encourages you that going through the motions is fine with Me, all because of grace.

We have fallen for a lie from the pit, and soon we will all see it. Unfortunately, not all will want to change, or bow the knee to him in ALL things. We are entering the valley of decision, and here, there is no middle ground. Either He reigns, or we continue to, and salvation.... OUR salvation..... Is at stake.

Lest we forget, what proves that our one time prayer actually worked is the fact we continue to follow Him, to walk in the light as He is in the light, and thus to endure to the end. And if we find walking the walk too hard, should it not actually bother us? Should we not be found on our knees in tears seeking real grace, grace to change us, free us, and use us so that our lives do not bring dishonor to Him any longer?

The subject of OSAS brings out the arguments aplenty as to why we cannot lose our salvation. But truthfully, that question is not THE question that we need to answer. The subject that should be at the forefront of our minds is why the grace we all claim we love is not teaching us how to live godly lives. Sadly, few are found asking such questions at present, for the path of least resistance, promising eternity but with no requirement to give up ones pearls, or to hate one's old nature, has anethesthesized us into a walk of total lukewarmness, and we think nothing of it.it is time to awake.

With all my heart, I do believe the times really are changing though, and many who now resist the pull of the Spirit, including His warnings and chastenings, will soon weep deep tears of shame and repentance. Praise God, it is not too late, and they will find that there is power in grace that we have heretofore been totally blinded to. God has promised to "cause us" to walk obediently. We are about to discover that this is no exaggeration. But the first step is to want it. It is the hardest of all the steps back to pleasing our Father, for satan knows that if the sleeping giant is reawakened, all bets are off.

A new day is dawning, and not a moment too soon. The church is down, but not out, and soon, men that once reviled our shallowness, worldliness, and abject hypocrisy, will instead exclaim "Look! That which bore only briars and thorns has become once again like the garden of Eden."

I can't wait. How about you?

Blessings,

Gideon

Warnings are for those Christians who trust the moral law(ml) & still violate it. They r not for those who trust his blood alone for salvation.