Can Messianic Jews get body piercings and/or tattoos?

[pat34lee]

If you are saying that all baptists, evangelicals, including men such as Darby, Scofield, faculty at Dallas Th. Seminary, etc. that adhere to a dispensational viewpoint, are those who 'willfully' 'twist' the words of Scripture, then it's clear that you (henceforth on 'ignore') and I are unable to communicate meaningfully.

Do not hold men to be infallible. Every group and every person can be wrong and are wrong about some things in scripture. If not, we would only have one church and one understanding of scripture.

 

[pat34lee]

Thanks for your comments. Fact is, many Christians do have faith based tattoos and find them to be effective as conversation starters in witness situations.

Faith based tattoo, that's a new one. Kind of like faith based meth head or faith based child abuser.
There is nothing redeeming about tattoos. You do not honor God by doing something he said not to do.
http://www.av1611.org/tattoos/blood.html

 

[faroukfarouk]

Faith based tattoo, that's a new one.

Lots of Christians have them, whether a cross or Christian fish sign <><, on a wrist, etc.

 

[pat34lee]

Lots of Christians have them, whether a cross or Christian fish sign <><, on a wrist, etc.

"I didn't do it for me. I did it for God."
Saul tried that trick and lost his kingdom over it. Read 1 Samuel 15

 

[faroukfarouk]

"I didn't do it for me. I did it for God."
Saul tried that trick and lost his kingdom over it. Read 1 Samuel 15

So what is your point about Christians who in conscience are motivated to get a witness tattoo?

 

[pat34lee]

So what is your point about Christians who in conscience are motivated to get a witness tattoo?

To be blunt, they are wrong. Just as those who eat unclean meat and thank God for it. If your wife tells you that she hates green, will you go and paint your living room green and buy her a green car?

You do things for your spouse because you love them, not because they make you (at least hopefully you do). Even if the Old Testament laws were done away with, which they aren't, they are what God wants, and so we should want to do them.

 

[faroukfarouk]

To be blunt, they are wrong. Just as those who eat unclean meat and thank God for it. If your wife tells you that she hates green, will you go and paint your living room green and buy her a green car?

You do things for your spouse because you love them, not because they make you (at least hopefully you do). Even if the Old Testament laws were done away with, which they aren't, they are what God wants, and so we should want to do them.

Leviticus 19.27 says about not trimming the corners of one's beard. Do preachers shave? if they do, maybe they are backhandedly admitting that being in the land under the Old Testament law as Jews is one thing; and being in the church with the Gospel, as opposed to the law, as the rule, being another.

 

[pat34lee]

Leviticus 19.27 says about not trimming the corners of one's beard. Do preachers shave? if they do, maybe they are backhandedly admitting that being in the land under the Old Testament law as Jews is one thing; and being in the church with the Gospel, as opposed to the law, as the rule, being another.

The preachers in most churches don't think the commands in the old testament still stand. They are wrong, of course, as the commands of God are forever. Since he does not change, his word cannot change. All that changes is us.

 

[faroukfarouk]

The preachers in most churches don't think the commands in the old testament still stand. They are wrong, of course, as the commands of God are forever. Since he does not change, his word cannot change. All that changes is us.

So your argument is that men need to have bushy beards, as Old Testament Jews (Leviticus 19.27)?

 

[visionary]

 

[Lulav]

So what is your point about Christians who in conscience are motivated to get a witness tattoo?

Witness to what, that they don't give two hoots about what is right in G-ds eyes?

 

[pat34lee]

So your argument is that men need to have bushy beards, as Old Testament Jews (Leviticus 19.27)?

That is a command not to cut only part of the beard. (pagan style) You can cut the whole beard off or trim the length.

 

[faroukfarouk]

That is a command not to cut only part of the beard. (pagan style) You can cut the whole beard off or trim the length.

So what about Christians with moustaches?

 

[pat34lee]

So what about Christians with moustaches?

What about them? Or are you talking about Christian women?

Do not copy the customs of pagans. Deut. 12:30, Jer. 10:2

 

[faroukfarouk]

What about them? Or are you talking about Christian women?

Do not copy the customs of pagans. Deut. 12:30, Jer. 10:2

You mentioned about cutting only a part of the beard. Does that mean that Christians under grace, not law, can't have moustaches?

 

[pat34lee]

You mentioned about cutting only a part of the beard. Does that mean that Christians under grace, not law, can't have moustaches?

A goatee would be cutting that part of the beard. One haircut that is forbidden is that which leaves a circle in the back, which is a symbol of sun worshippers. Some old monks used to wear tonsures which are similarly forbidden.

 

[faroukfarouk]

A goatee would be cutting that part of the beard. One haircut that is forbidden is that which leaves a circle in the back, which is a symbol of sun worshippers. Some old monks used to wear tonsures which are similarly forbidden.

So you mean that people who have a goatee ought not to participate in the Lord's Supper as Christians, then? I'm just trying to figure how far you take supposed legal observances.

 

[pat34lee]

So you mean that people who have a goatee ought not to participate in the Lord's Supper as Christians, then? I'm just trying to figure how far you take supposed legal observances.

You ask if they ought not, but what you seem to want to know is who decides? I cannot decide for you or anyone else. It is a serious matter though, and I rarely participate in it for personal reasons.

1 Cor. 11:27-31
27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

Verse 30, people die from dishonoring his sacrifice.

 

[faroukfarouk]

You ask if they ought not, but what you seem to want to know is who decides? I cannot decide for you or anyone else. It is a serious matter though, and I rarely participate in it for personal reasons.

1 Cor. 11:27-31
27 Wherefore whosoever shall eat this bread, and drink this cup of the Lord, unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and blood of the Lord.
28 But let a man examine himself, and so let him eat of that bread, and drink of that cup.
29 For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh damnation to himself, not discerning the Lord's body.
30 For this cause many are weak and sickly among you, and many sleep.
31 For if we would judge ourselves, we should not be judged.

Verse 30, people die from dishonoring his sacrifice.

So this is about not wearing goatees, earrings, and other such matters?

 

[pat34lee]

So this is about not wearing goatees, earrings, and other such matters?

Earrings are another matter. The only prohibition I can think of regarding them is that we are to dress modestly. We are not to try to shock others by our appearance.

Why do you keep moving the bar?