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Bible vs Quran

Discussion in 'Christianity and World Religion' started by shah, May 4, 2007.

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  1. shah

    shah New Member

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    Bible vs Quran
    Last 1500 years Last 1500 years
    New international version ............................................................................... vs ........................................................ Quran
    New American standard bible
    The message
    Amplified Bible
    New living translation
    King james version
    English standard version
    Contemporary English version
    New king james version
    21st century king james version
    American standard version
    Young’s literal translation
    Darby translation
    New life version
    Holman Christian standard bible
    New international reader’s version
    Wycliffe new testament
    Worldwide English (new testament)
    New international version- uk
    Today’s new international version
    ……..This version and that version……………………






    The Bible
    The bible that the Christians believe to be the word of god is partly true. the bible that the Christians follow today is not the Injil that we Muslims believe that Jesus received from Allah as it has many errors.
    If the Bible even had one mistake in it.It would not be the word of God
    Since all these different versions of Bibles on the earth today do not agree with each other - does this mean, that they are accusing each other of being "suspect of corruption"?

    The preface to one of the most accurately translated Bibles (Revised Standard Version) says on the second page, "Yet, the King James Version has grave defects." - That is definitely accusation of being "suspect of corruption."

    The Catholic Bible (based on the Latin Vulgate of the fourth century) has 73 books, while the Protestant Bible (one thousand years later) only has 66 books. One of them (or both?) is obviously corrupt. Which one? The new one (66 books)? Or the old one (73 books)?

    The scholars of the Old Testament state very clear in all of their works, they no longer have the original documents penned by any prophet, (peace be upon them all). So the scholars of Old Testament claim they do not have the exact texts and they also state clearly there many are different versions. Does this mean they are accusing the Old Testament of being "suspect and it should not be accepted as authentic testimony"?

    Scholars of New Testament state without doubt, they do not possess the actual texts of any of Jesus' (peace be upon him) companions - and no one has ever claimed to have anything written by Jesus or even anything recited by him. Does this not indicate "suspect and it should not be accepted as authentic testimony"?

    How can you say that today’s Bible is from God, if it has old version then, new version, and then this version and that version from man himself after every some years.
    If today’s Bible from man himself containing some of the original teachings or words of God.
    Should we follow it?

    In our daily life we insist on pure and quality products but on the other hand the thing on which your whole life and hereafter is based, you are ready to compromise. How can u do this to you.

    The Quran
    The Quran has no version it is one and only, it is still in its original (Arabic) language
    : We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption). 015.009

    Quran Challanges Readers
    “And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed From time to time to Our Servant, then produce a Surrah Like thereunto; And call your witnesses or helpers (If there are any) besides Allah, If your (doubts) are true. But if ye cannot –And of a surely you cannot. Then fear the Fire whose fuel is Men and Stones – Which is prepared for those who reject Faith.”
    (Al-Qur’an 2:23-24)

    "If the Mankind and the Jinns were together to produce the like of this Qur'an, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they helped one another."
    (Qur'an 17:88)

    “They are on (true) guidance, from their Lord, and it is these who will prosper.”

    “As to those who reject Faith, it is the same to them whether thou warn them or do not warn them; they will not believe.”

    “Allah hath set a seal on their hearts and on their hearing, and on their eyes is a veil; great is the penalty they (incur).



    Ever since the Qur'an was revealed, fourteen centuries ago, no one has been able to produce a single chapter like the chapters of the Qur'an in their beauty, eloquence, splendor, wise legislation, true information, true prophecy, and other perfect attributes.

    Also, note that the smallest chapter in the Qur'an (Chapter 108) is only ten words, yet no one has ever been able to meet this challenge, then or today. Some of the disbelieving Arabs who were enemies of the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) tried to meet this challenge to prove that Muhammad (PBUH) was not a true prophet, but they failed to do so.

    Thus, the Qur’an is the main source of the Islamic faith and is of a completely Divine origin. It contains guidance for all mankind. And since the message of the Qur’an is for all times, it is relevant to all ages.

    It is not a usual thing. It never ever happened in history of mankind.
    No man on the face of earth could claim that I give u the document which will not change a bit after 100 years, or 500 years, or 1000 years, or even after 1500 years and, moreover everyone in the whole world is allowed to read it, or everyone has fully right to have it.
    It Is crystal clear Quran is protected by God


    Conclusion: Both the Bible and the Quran have come to us by way of Almighty God, then through His angel Gabriel and then to the prophets, peace be upon them. However, when the next step comes into play (that of the human beings faithfully transmitting it on to others and future generations) we find out that Allah has only perserved His Last and Final Revelation for all times. And He certainly did not need the humans to do that.

    You know the Old Testament and the New Testament but know you should follow the final testament which is the holy Quran.
    ur views plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
     
  2. yourfriend58

    yourfriend58 New Member

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    I totally agree that we should follow the final divine book : the Holy Qoran .
     
  3. Arthra

    Arthra Baha'i

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    Shah wrote:

    The Bible
    The bible that the Christians believe to be the word of god is partly true. the bible that the Christians follow today is not the Injil that we Muslims believe that Jesus received from Allah as it has many errors.
    If the Bible even had one mistake in it.It would not be the word of God
    Since all these different versions of Bibles on the earth today do not agree with each other - does this mean, that they are accusing each other of being "suspect of corruption"?

    My reply:

    You know my friend, I noticed that when you write you do not always capitalize Bible and God. I think out of respect you could do that as a gesture of respect because many believe the Bible is inspired by God and if you want dialogue respect is a good place to start even if you may not agree....

    To me the various versions of the Bible are attempts to translate the Hebrew and Koine Greek for people today who do not know these ancient languages and who are unfamiliar with the way of life and history of the Bible.

    You do know that there are also now many versions and translations of the Qur'an for English speaking people because they do not know the nuances of Arabic or understand the language.

    Now Shah you made an interesting statement:

    "If the Bible even had one mistake in it.It would not be the word of God"

    I do not know but suspect that anyone with some historical knowledge might claim there were "mistakes" made in the Bible using what modern scholars have discovered or concluded..and there are some people with some knowledge of modern science that could claim the Bible is not that scientific, but I would suggest the Bible is not a history text or a scientific text, but it's primary message is spiritual and a record over a thousand years or so of Divine Revelation.

    On another thread I posted that the Gospel I believe contains the teachings of Jesus and that when the Qur'an mentions the Gospel in appealing to People of the Book or Christians it means the Gospel of Jesus, the good News of His teachings... True, interpretations and doctrines of various churches vary but I would suggest the Gospel of Jesus is contained in the Gospels available to us. God in His mercy would not permit I think that the Gospel would be lost to humanity.

    In friendship,

    - Art

    :wave:
     
  4. shah

    shah New Member

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    viewsssssss plzzzzzzzzzz
     
  5. arunma

    arunma Flaming Calvinist

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    In other words, you guys are complaining that the Bible has been transcribed meticulously and translated according to the most advanced scholarship, whereas the Quran exists only in one line of manuscripts that is likely controlled by an Islamic state. Not a very convincing argument, if you ask me.
     
  6. Rut

    Rut All creation points to the almighty Creator.

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    Quote:
    "The Quran
    The Quran has no version it is one and only, it is still in its original (Arabic) language"

    Is that fair for the people that want to learn about God`s word? Special when the Muslims say that the Bible is corrupt and quran say that we shall go to the Tawrat, Zaboor and Injeel.In old time was that same thing for the Bible Was only allowed to be written in Latin.The general people must then trust on priest what is said in the Bible.
    My thought are that God want us all to understand and read his word.If that was so wrong to translate his word (the Bible) he should tell us that.
     
  7. Rut

    Rut All creation points to the almighty Creator.

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    I think I have find a good website that talk about the Bible and Quran.One of the thing the website say is


    "B. VERSES SHOWING THAT TRUE CHRISTIANS WERE LIVING DURING THE PERIOD BETWEEN JESUS AND MUHAMMAD
    B1. The Table (Al-Ma'ida) 5:113-114, 10 AH.

    "Then will God say, `O Jesus son of Mary! Recount my favor to you... Behold! I taught you the Book and Wisdom, the Torah and the Gospel... "And behold! I inspired the disciples (al-hawariyun) to have faith in Me and My apostle (Jesus). They said (to Jesus), `We have faith and (you must) bear witness that we are Muslims (submitted ones)."
    B2. The Family of `Imran (Ali `Imran) 3:52-53, 2-3 AH.
    "When Jesus found unbelief on their part he said, `Who will be my helpers to (the work of) God?' The disciples said, `We are God's helpers. We believe in God and (you must) bear witness that we are Muslims (submitted ones). "`Our Lord we believe in what You have revealed and we follow the apostle (Jesus).'"
    B3. The Battle Array (Al-Saff) 61:14, 3 AH.
    "O ye who believe! Be ye helpers of God: as said Jesus the son of Mary to the disciples, `Who will be my helpers for God?' The Disciples said, `We are God's helpers!' Then a portion of the Children of Israel believed, and a portion disbelieved: but We gave power to those who believed against their enemies, and they became the ones that prevailed."
    B4. Iron (Al-Hadid) 57:26-27, from 8 AH.

    "And We sent Noah and Abraham, and established in their descendants prophecy and the Book: and some of them are rightly guided, but many are rebellious. "Then We sent after them our apostles and We sent Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him compassion and mercy; and monasticism, they invented it. We did not command it...yet We bestowed on those among them who believed, their due reward, but many of them are rebellious." cp. 5:85.
    We learn from this verse that although monasticism is not of God, there were true believers among these followers of Jesus who received their "due reward" (in heaven).
    Historically, monasticism started in the 4th century, although certain men, such as Paul of Thebes, lived a separate life as hermits in the third century. St. Anthony of Egypt was the first to organize even a loose group in 305 AD, and in the Sinai, too, monasticism began about the same time.
    B5. The Cave (Al-Kahf) 18:10,25, Meccan.

    "Behold, the youths betook themselves to the Cave. They said, `Our Lord! Bestow on us mercy from Yourself, and dispose of our affair for us in the right way'... " So they stayed in their Cave three hundred years, and (some) add nine (more)..."
    Yusuf Ali, in several notes to his translation of the Qur'an, refers this to 7 young Christian men of Ephesus who, while fleeing from persecution, hid in a cave and did not wake up for 300 yrs. He discusses various dates which terminate between 440 and 450 AD, and says that the Khalifa Wathiq (842-846 AD) sent an expedition to examine and identify the locality. Hamidullah mentions this possibility, but thinks that the passage refers to a time well before Christianity. However, Toufiq Al-Hakim in his play Ahel Al-Kahf describes them clearly as Christians.
    B6. The Zodiacal Signs (Al-Buruj) 85:4-9, Early Meccan.
    "Woe to the makers of the pit (of fire), fire supplied with fuel, Behold, they sat over against the (fire), and they witnessed (all) that they were doing against the believers. And they ill-treated them for no other reason than that they believed in God..."
    Hamidullah, in the notes to his translation, refers this to a Jewish King of Yemen, Dhou Nuwas, who during the 6th century persecuted the Christians, burning alive those who didn't want to become Jews. The Khalifa Omar built a large Mosque in Yemen to honor these Christians. Yusuf Ali also mentions it as one of three possible explanations.
    The first three references clearly refer to Jesus' followers as being "inspired" by God to follow the Messiah [B1], choosing to be "God's helpers" [B2.B3], and "becoming the ones who prevailed" [B3]. In addition some true believers remained even when monasticism was practiced [B4] starting in the 4th century in Egypt.
    If references [B5] and [B6] were understood by Muhammad and the people of Mecca in their historical context to refer to Christians, then these are Quranic attestations that there were true Christians, acceptable to God, in Ephesus (Modern Turkey) in 450 AD; and in Yemen in the 6th Century when these Christian Martyrs were burned alive. Admittedly the verses say nothing about the doctrines of these Christians. But true believers in groups as far apart as Turkey and Yemen would surely have left copies of their scriptures and writings -- some of which would have come down to us. If their scriptures had been different from the Torah and the Gospel which we know today, then we would certainly have found their traces."
     
  8. Bookofknowledge

    Bookofknowledge Senior Veteran

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    Based on my limited understanding & knowledge.

    If you have (Tawrat, Zaboor and Injeel) then by all mean go to the tawrat, Zaboor and Injeel but if you have portions of it then I would like to recommend to ponder that God always sent His Messenger one after another untill He sealed the Prophethood to keep people on the Right Path.
     
  9. LoveAlways

    LoveAlways Regular Member

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    Christianity spread through Europe, where peoples living in relative close proximity still spoke a variety of languages. What was the alternative besides translating the Hebrew and Greek?

    And why do you have a oneness icon?
     
  10. LoveAlways

    LoveAlways Regular Member

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    I would agree.

    I have many versions of the Bible. I like them all for different reasons. The KJV uses the word fleshpots. The NRSV uses pots of meat. I'd like to know how those minor differences invalidate anything.
     
    Rut likes this.
  11. français

    français Atheist/CA-Bloc Québécois/US-Democrat

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    shah - i really don't think this is a contest of whos religion is better. you have your beliefs, and i have mine.

    but might i ask - what is "Oneness?" like can you tell me a little more about your religion?
     
  12. Raul7

    Raul7 Regular Member

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    Nothing wrong with translating the Word of God to help spread it's guidance, but it is wrong to change the words of God upon hearing the Revelation and then decieveing everyone into think this infact the word of God as a means of making money.

    Can ye (o ye men of Faith) entertain the hope that they [Christians and Jews] will believe in you? Seeing that a group of them heard the Word of Allah (Revelation), and perverted it knowingly after they understood it. (Qur'an 2:75)

    For example, why would God forbid the Jews and the Muslims to eat the meat of the swine and yet this law does not apply to Christians?
     
  13. godlovesmebest

    godlovesmebest New Member

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    For example, why would God forbid the Jews and the Muslims to eat the meat of the swine and yet this law does not apply to Christians?.......................

    why aren't we allowed to eat all foods?
     
  14. français

    français Atheist/CA-Bloc Québécois/US-Democrat

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    great question!!

    from a Christian perspective, we look at the Torah and Torah Laws as simply a guide. like it's a good way to live a good, happy, healthy, just life. but it's not your way for salvation. it's merely just something you can follow.
     
  15. godlovesmebest

    godlovesmebest New Member

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    Did Muslims get stoning from the old testament laws? I am wondering if jews still practice it today.

    FOXNEWS.COM HOME > WORLD > IRAQ

    Video Surfaces Showing Kurdish Girl Stoned to Death for Relationship With Iraqi Sunni Boy
     
  16. Rut

    Rut All creation points to the almighty Creator.

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    The law of not eat svine belongs to the laws that Moses got and that was a sort of pact between Israeli and God
    When Jesus come to the earth he took these laws away
    he come to fullfill them.
    Matthew 5:
    17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them

    The early christians was unsure about things that they have follow before.You can see that in Act 15:1 - 2 and the answer is in verse 28 - 29

    Another thing that I remember when I thought about the answer.Why took you that as a example because muslims tells me that Mohammed (peace upon him) come to chance things.That every new prophets that God sending chance things that other prophets told before.

    I haven`t yet seen that people that have copy the scripture have chance anything.They can have interpret the Bible and telling people what they think it`s mean what it say in the Bible.
     
  17. shah

    shah New Member

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    In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful!


    My dear brother, I m here not to win any kind of religion race. I just want to say that our minds need to be exposed to light of truth. We r human(crown of creations) we have power to think, then why? we can not think about unthinkable things.
    This is age of science and information. 2000 pages of new information r being uploaded on internet after every single minute. Every day we learn something new. But But But …………………………..have u learn anything new about God, you do know not before?..............it means I know how many stares are in the sky…….i know how many trees are on the face of earth…….. I know how many kind of fishes are in see…….. I know how many tigers are alive in jungles and how many in zoo. ……but….but……..but I don’t know about my lord how create me……and if really I do not known then all my information is nuisance for me………………………………………

    Question comes in my mind. How God must be look like? What qualities a true God must have?. What should be definition of “God” ? .
    ……………………………………..then my religion answer to me.


    Sura 112 Al-Ikhlas (Sincerity)

    1
    Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
    2
    Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
    3
    He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
    4
    And there is none like unto Him.



    "He is Allah, the one and only God," means that He is "the Eternal and the Absolute," and that, "He begot none nor was He begotten," and that "there is none comparable to Him." But the Qur'an states it all in detail for more emphasis and clarification.

    "The Eternal, the Absolute" means the supplicated Lord without whose permission nothing is decided. Allah is the One Lord. He is One in His Divinity and all the other beings are but His servants. To Him and Him alone are addressed all supplications. He and only He decides everything independently. No one decides with Him. And since He is the one and only God this quality is already His.

    "He begot none, nor was He begotten," means that the reality of Allah is deep-rooted, permanent and everlasting. No changeable circumstances ever affect it. Its quality is absolute perfection at all times. Birth is descent and multiplication and implies a developed being after incompleteness or nothingness. It requires espousal which is based on similarity of being and structure. All this is utterly impossible in the case of Allah. So the quality of "One" includes the renouncement of a father and a son.

    "There is none comparable to Him" means that no one resembles Him in anything or is equivalent to Him in any respect, either in the reality of being, or in the fact that He is the only effective power, or in any of His qualities or attribute. This is implied in the statement of his being "One" made in the first verse, but it is repeated thus to confirm and elaborate on that fact. It is a renunciation of the two-god belief which implies that Allah is the God of Good while Evil has its god who, as the belief goes - is in opposition to Allah, spoils His good deeds and propagates evil on earth. The most well-known two-god belief was that of the Persians, who believed in a god of light and a god of darkness. This belief was known to the people in the south of the Arabian Peninsula, where the Persians once had a state and exercised sovereignty

    A common human logical mind says “Yes” a God must be like that………….


    Not like us having a family
     
  18. godlovesmebest

    godlovesmebest New Member

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    Question comes in my mind. How God must be look like? What qualities a true God must have?. What should be definition of “God” ? .


    The same qualities as Jesus had?

    Hebrews 1:3 Who being the brightness of the glory, and the impress of His subsistence, bearing up also the all things by the saying of His might--through Himself having made a cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the greatness in the highest,

    Psalms 110:1 A Psalm of David. The affirmation of the LORD to my Lord: `Sit at My right hand, Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.'
     
  19. seed757

    seed757 fanatically balanced/radically compassionate

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    From:http://www.parvez-video.com/islam/reformation/truth_about_islam/index.asp
     
  20. LoveAlways

    LoveAlways Regular Member

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    And it's even more clear than that. Jesus came out and said that what we put into our bodies is not as important as what's in our hearts. I believe Torah law does not apply to Christians at all because we're under a new convent, and because we're not Jews, but some rules, like dietary laws, Jesus made a special point about. I guess the old idea that you could rightfully eat your way into Heaven really bothered him.

    There's nothing wrong with a Christian wanting to follow the Torah laws. But it's a choice.
     
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