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avoiding kissing and holding hands altogether...

Discussion in 'Singles (only*)' started by GQ Chris, Jul 9, 2009.

  1. Thomas1984

    Thomas1984 *Expect the Unexpected*

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    :D

    Come on Chris, you can't just strike a match and watch the thread burn...
     
  2. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    The latter is a reason why many atheists I know want to have one woman and stick with her.

    But as far as it goes, I know numerous men whose first sexual experience was a one night stand/etc. It is actually easier to get then a relationship often.

    JM
    (I have had woman offer one night stands to me, I think.)
     
  3. overit

    overit Veteran

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    Actually, from experience this isn't always true....:p Wait...nevermind...you said for "the first time"...I take that back, you're right lol
     
  4. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    By the way, I am not one who is suggesting that anyone is naive/etc. Don't go with a lack of knowledge.

    I am just saying that Christ said that if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out.

    If kissing and holding hands before marriage cause you to sin, don't do them.

    I plan on kissing and holding hands before marriage, but I consider not doing doing it.

    JM
     
  5. Luther073082

    Luther073082 κύριε ἐλέησον χριστὲ ἐλέησον

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    I think at some point I predicted (although my intention was more comedic) that soon people would be advocating for no holding hands before marriage.

    Now for a serious prediction.

    In 10 to 15 years, especially with how well computers work, there will be a small group of evangelicals advocating that you don't even see your husband or wife in person until the altar. Clearly this will make them more pure then those lazy christians who like to see the person they are marrying before they say "I do". And way more pure then those perverts that might actually touch their SO's. And clearly it would keep them from becomming like those sexual deviants that might actually kiss their SO's before marriage.

    And then in about 30 to maybe 45 years, there will be another group advocating that you shouldn't be able to even view pictures of them covered from head to toe like a muslim woman. Either that or they will advocate that you shouldn't be able to hear their voice.

    By the end of my life there will be groups of Christian evangelicals out there advocate that everyone marry by resume with no contact or communication with the person until they reach the altar and say "I do". And they will consider those men & women who might actually hold hands before marriage to be little better then prostitutes.

    This is how this one upsmanship in "purity" is going. And its frighteningly ridiculous.
     
  6. Mikeb85

    Mikeb85 Guest

    While I certainly agree with not doing some things before marriage, having absolutely no physical contact (ie. no kissing/holding hands) could certainly lead to some, well, issues on the wedding night...

    One thing to keep in mind as well, is that in past generations, there was no long process of dating as there is today. They never had to suppress their sexuality, so no physical contact prior to marriage may have worked in that setting. However in today's world, with most couples dating a year or more before marriage, it's a much tougher proposition...
     
  7. Luther073082

    Luther073082 κύριε ἐλέησον χριστὲ ἐλέησον

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    In the past though, marriages often carried a sense of a business deal in some form or another.

    Marie Antoinette's brother (King of Austria at the time) traveled to France to try to convince his brother in law (King of France, Louis XVI) to have sex with his sister. (Marie Anotinette). Because a marriage was not secure until sexual intercourse happened. And until the marriage was secure, good diplomatic relations between the two states was also not secure.

    And even at that time they didn't have rules against them holding hands prior to their wedding.

    We can't treat marriage in the same way they did in the past because the entire point behind marriage is different.
     
  8. Blank123

    Blank123 Legend

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    care to share? for some reason i've got the distinct feeling you just said that to see how people would react :p
     
  9. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    This is a different conversation. I don't think that Chris was saying that for purity reasons holding hands/kissing was bad.

    He was saying that for himself (And maybe for others here) holding hands and kissing was bad.

    And I agree, for some people that is temptation.

    Sure it is hard, but sometimes we need to do a lot to stay away from temptation. Which is how Christ directs us. I will say something that some will find even harder... some people should not watch violent movies or play violent video games.

    JM
     
  10. Blank123

    Blank123 Legend

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    very likely but i still wanna hear (or see) him explain what the point of this thread was :D
     
  11. Luther073082

    Luther073082 κύριε ἐλέησον χριστὲ ἐλέησον

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    If holding hands alone makes a person want to have sex, or violent movies or video games makes you want to commit acts of violence. Then said person should report immediatly to a mental ward as soon as possible.
     
  12. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    I think that environment and what we take in plays a lot more of a role then people give it credit for.

    I am not once to say that violent movies, or sexist music, or kissing, or short skirts causes any sin. But some people are weak while others are strong and for some people things tempt or lead them towards sin.

    I like violent video games myself.

    If you don't think that our surroundings effect us then you are blind. This is a very logical and understood effect.

    Now it is true, we can't put ourselves in a monastery or on a mountain top because then we don't do no good. And most of us should be able to survive a lot of temptation, with God's help. And obvious some people have extra strengths (low sex drive/etc).

    But that still doesn't change the fact that they are temptations. And that the culture/temptations/society that we live in does influence us. You can often see that those who intake certain ideas/cultures/etc start showing the same type of responses.

    JM
     
  13. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    Little kids are especially weak, I am really against little kids playing violent video games (I know that they will play violent games with themselves, that is a male thing to do! But adults think of much worse things... see GTA/etc).

    I do see it effect them. And I actually see effects on adults as well. Even if they have enough social conditioning to not go out and murder prostitutes, doesn't mean that it doesn't change their behaviour and attitudes. And there are a lot more people who would murder or rape or whatever if they thought they could get away with it. I am always horrified with talking to someone who I thought was a decent person who than expresses these thoughts.

    And I worry even about asexuals kissing/being physical intimate with people they don't intend to marry or who aren't good for them because just because you are strong against the physical components doesn't mean you should be seeking temptation out and also doesn't mean you are strong against the emotional components.

    JM
     
  14. Sunset2009

    Sunset2009 Guest

    Yes, my Windmill love. This is true. However, it's still going from 0 physical contact with this particular person, to full on sex the next hour. I really don't think it'd be anymore of a problem to do that with someone you have an emotional bond with/are vulnerable with already. I mean, you DID marry them. I'm talking from experience here. :cool: And it wasn't traumatizing. (Not sex. I'm a good girl.)

    Ew.

    :|
    Uhm.
    Yeah, no. :|

    :|
    :doh:
    :|:|:|:|:|
     
  15. latteda

    latteda You're not my nemesis

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    Unless a person has somehow believed that sex is dirty and shameful, I tend to lean towards it not being that difficult to go from 0-100 in one night. Just sayin'.

    I guess I don't really think that's a valid reason to be physically involved. Besides, there's no law that says a couple has to go all the way on their wedding night. I certainly want to, but if a couple is ok with not doing it, then that is ok if it's right for them. A month seems very long though unless there are certain physical roadblocks to getting there...to me that would indicate an unhealthy view of married sex.

    However, I am all for a couple being physically affectionate if it doesn't cause major problems. For me personally, it would cause more problems to *not* kiss and hold hands, but who am I to say that another couple should hold the same standards as me? The important thing is that the couple is on the same page on the issue.
     
    * kittie * likes this.
  16. Quoth

    Quoth Guest

    My last girlfriend was the "no kissing on the lips until we're married" type. She also told me (quite seriously) that she would probably spend the honeymoon hiding in the bathroom crying to herself.

    This is why I will never date a woman with those views ever again.
     
    Supplanter likes this.
  17. deepgreen11

    deepgreen11 Veteran

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    Reminds me of the movie "Uncle Buck" with John Candy...the kids are in the car and Tia is kissing her boyfriend across the street and her little brother Miles goes "That's a pretty stupid thing to do during flu season!"

    If people really are that tempted--fine, don't do it.

    But for the sake of "being pure" just to "be pure", I think people ought to really look at that and say "What is best for us as a couple? What is best for us as workers of the Gospel?"

    How attracted do you think people are to the Gospel when they hear of Christians saying "Hey, I'm not even going to flutter my eyelashes at my SO because I'm trying to be pure." Is that real? Is that authentic? Or are the people who do this just burning the rope at both ends? I'd be really creeped out if someone said that this was "the right way". In fact, not in regards to PDA, but in regard to being by ourselves, if someone I was dating could not even cuddle with me without feeling "dirty", I would be very wary of him. I would wonder about his brain and if he was some kind of hypersexual person. I'd wonder if he had a hormone imbalance. Or I'd wonder why he was trying so hard to "be pure" and not just let go and be with me on his own terms. In fact, that's what would bother me the most. It's kind of like the Pharisees--they'd put on airs for everyone to see. God seemed to imply that their worship really wasn't authentic--it was a show. I'm sorry, but I don't want my relationships to be a show for others to declare how they deal with me. I'd not advocating the "heavy, supersexual" stuff, but simply saying, the reason behind saying "no physical affection" would really matter to me.
     
  18. LogosRhema

    LogosRhema Awake

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    I literally laughed... Love it!

    I don't care for idealism of this or that, if it tempts you, then leave. Easy enough. To each his own... bothersome imo.
     
  19. JonMiller

    JonMiller Senior Veteran

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    Yeah, I am fine with not doing some stuff until engagement, and not other stuff until the wedding night (like sex). And it is true that wedding night doesn't have to have sex (although I think it would be very romantic, and the romantic part of me really wants to lose my virginity my wedding night).

    But it is important to me that my wife isn't one of those people you occasionally see Christians become who feels that sex is dirty or wrong or what have you. Or that has other psychological problems with it.

    Those would need to be dealt with, preferably before the marriage. And if she didn't want to kiss until the wedding, I would need to be sure she didn't have those issues.

    Sex is a beautiful thing, given to us by God. We need to not abuse it, but also not to demonize it.

    JM
     
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  20. LogosRhema

    LogosRhema Awake

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    Dang bro, still a virgin, major props to ya!:thumbsup: