antichrists, false christs, The Antichrist

[Douggg]

"The" Antichrist has to be the King of Israel, the promised great anointed King. Except he won't be the one God chose to be that King. God sent Jesus to be that King. No-one has filled "the" Antichrist prophecy yet.

The many antichrists were them who were against Christ. But none of them were "the" Antichrist because none of them were the King of Israel, the promised maschiach, in lieu of Jesus.

Jehovah's witnesses are antichrists, as an example. But they are not "the" Antichrist because none of them were/are the King of Israel, the promised mashiach, in lieu of Jesus.

antichrists - them who went out from Christianty to deny Father and Son, and deny that Jesus is God come in the flesh. Jehovah's witnesses for example. Christians who leave Christianity to become muslims as another example.

false christs - them who claimed or were thought to be the promised mashiach if in Judaism, or apart from Judaism claim to be Jesus himself, or claim to be the Savior to mankind in some respect. Simon bar Kochba, for example. Jose Miranda, as another example.

The Antichrist - a false christ, who will be the King of Israel, king mashiach, descended from David, in lieu of Jesus the one God sent to be the King. No-one has fulfilled that prophecy yet.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

The Antichrist - a false christ, who will be the King of Israel, king mashiach, descended from David, in lieu of Jesus the one God sent to be the King. No-one has fulfilled that prophecy yet.

Ok Doug, which one of these 4 verses about antichrist says he is one man yet to come in the future? Because these verses are the only ones that mention antichrist specifically ( so don't try to stray from these verses until you confirm it there, otherwise your just speculating, and trying to make something out of nothing)

1. 1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
   
2. 1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
   
3. 1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
   
4. 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

 

[Interplanner]

And I notice you know Simon bar Kochba, but not the 3 in the 60s. Given that they were leading an intended fight for freedom and contacting foreign powers for help, I don't know why they wouldn't be "kings."

 

[Douggg]

Ok Doug, which one of these 4 verses about antichrist says he is one man yet to come in the future? Because these verses are the only ones that mention antichrist specifically ( so don't try to stray from these verses until you confirm it there, otherwise your just speculating, and trying to make something out of nothing)

1. 1 John 2:18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.
2. 1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
3. 1 John 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
4. 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.

None of those verses. It doesn't have to say Antichrist in the verses to be speaking about the Antichrist.
"Anti" just means in lieu of and/or against. The verses in the Gospels of Jesus speaking to Nicodemus, the singular Antichrist is the "another" coming in "his" own name, 'him" they will accept.... as mashiach King of Israel, David's descendant. Jesus came in his Father's name, meaning the one God sent to be their King mashiach, Son of David. That is the only documented source that they would have heard that Antichrist shall come.

That "the" Antichrist is a single person is verified in Isaiah 14 when he finds himself in hell, and God in his disdain for him casts him out of the grave likening to the abominable branch. Off course Jesus is the righteous branch.

Isaiah14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.



Jeremiah 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.


Jesus is the righteous branch that God chose to be the King of Israel. The Antichrist is the abominable branch that the Jews will receive as their king instead - for a short time. The Antichrist has to be that abominable branch King of Israel.

 

[Douggg]

And I notice you know Simon bar Kochba, but not the 3 in the 60s. Given that they were leading an intended fight for freedom and contacting foreign powers for help, I don't know why they wouldn't be "kings."

Okay, list the other three. They were false christs, but not "the" Antichrist. Keep in mind, when Jesus in Acts 1 was questioned by the disciples "are you now going to restore the Kingdom to Israel", he told them it was not for them to know the times nor seasons.

I think in Judaism, they claim to list about 15 "failed", to use their term, mashiach's.

 

[St Phoebe]

In Jesus' day there were lots of antichrist like you said that denied the father and the son and till this day there are many, so anyone or any religious system that denies the father and the son is antichrists - all of them

There has been a number of people that has been exalted to the status of being the Saviors of this world for example, the Popes are seen as christ on earth in their own books, in eastern religions Sai baba was also seen as a saviour of the world. Recently another deceased person was also referred to as Christ and there are many more around the globe that is exalted but are infact false christs

With regard to Antichrist - in 2 Thessalonians 2, it seems that the day of Christs coming shall not come unless the Antichrist is revealed. This person which is referred to as Son of perdition which was also the name that was referred to Judas who betrayed Jesus - the person might not necessarily be a jew -most Jews did not accept Christ -, (He came to His own and they received Him not) possibly a christian that turned away (a falling away first) thus betraying Jesus Christ like Judas therefore the name son of perdition or antichrist even. This person will exalt himself and take the place of God to many even worshipped as God. Now it also says that something is withholding that this antichrist be revealed and that there is currently someone letting,'he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way, possibly the pope in my opinion will loose this letting position. and then shall that Wicked be revealed. You have said before that this person must be a Jew in order for the Jews to believe that He is the Messiah but here it says that because they receive not the love of the truth, God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie. The women in revelation are described in my opinion as the papacy the seven mountains on which the women sits, the seven mountains on which vatican city sits, their royal attire - purple and scarlet colour, decked with gold and precious stones and pearls - the dresscode of the papacy, tiara and all. Anyway, this Jesus that the Muslims are expecting, he will be the one king that will continue a short while and according to them turn the world to Islam and then the beast which is the eight king will arise, at this point there would be one false world religion/worship system and then the ten kings which will give their power and strenght unto the beast. This false world religion will be destroyed at the battle of Armageddon also Gog and Magog of Ezekiel I think (after the second coming of Christ) not before. God will fight for spiritual jews, he is a jew which is one inwardly. All Abrahamic religions (Jews, Muslims and Christians) will play parts in the final end time scenes thus i am not fitting muslim prophecies to fit biblical prophecies.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

None of those verses. It doesn't have to say Antichrist in the verses to be speaking about the Antichrist.
"Anti" just means in lieu of and/or against. The verses in the Gospels of Jesus speaking to Nicodemus, the singular Antichrist is the "another" coming in "his" own name, 'him" they will accept.... as mashiach King of Israel, David's descendant. Jesus came in his Father's name, meaning the one God sent to be their King mashiach, Son of David. That is the only documented source that they would have heard that Antichrist shall come.

That "the" Antichrist is a single person is verified in Isaiah 14 when he finds himself in hell, and God in his disdain for him casts him out of the grave likening to the abominable branch. Off course Jesus is the righteous branch.

Isaiah14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.



Jeremiah 23:5 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.


Jesus is the righteous branch that God chose to be the King of Israel. The Antichrist is the abominable branch that the Jews will receive as their king instead - for a short time. The Antichrist has to be that abominable branch King of Israel.

Ok, so you have zip with the scriptures I quoted concerning the coming of antichrist (spirit)

Now to your second assumption concerning "another coming in his own name".

Jesus was referring to men accepting their own, as those of the world also receive their own.

John 5:41-43

King James Version (KJV)

41 I receive not honour from men.
42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive."


Jesus was not talking about a coming antichrist here, but rather carnally minded men receiving their own kind. Just as it is written "no man" receives Gods spiritual testimony."



So that point is a fail as well. Lets look at your next verse in Isaiah.



Isaiah14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.


This message is twofold, the Lord is not only talking to the king of Babylon "the man", but also the spirit working in the man (Lucifer). Also notice the last part of that verse speaks of many "the seed of evil doers" or children of their father the devil. (wicked generation)



This twofold message is shown time and time again about the "spirit" working in mankind. A good example of this same message would be with Jesus calling Peter Satan.


Matthew 16:23
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

We know Peter is not Satan, nor is Satan physically Peter. But we do see the connection between the "spirit" of Satan speaking through the man Peter.

Also evil men are cast out as branches too, not just the king of Babylon, or Lucifer.

John 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

So once again, you have nothing to support that future coming single man Antichrist doctrine.

 

[Douggg]

Hi Phoebe, the Antichrist has to be a Jew to be promised great king of Israel - "the" mashiach.

Back when coming out of Egypt, God foresaw the day when the children of Israel would of their own desire want a king like the surrounding nations - instead of God being their king ruling from heaven through the prophets. It was not God's idea for them to have such a king, but he went along with it because out of that lineage would come "the" messiah, and eventually God will be that King of Israel again, but ruling from here on earth as Jesus returned.

So back in Deuteronomy he told them that their king had to be from their own people - which means that the king(s) cannot be gentiles.

14 When thou art come unto the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me;
15 Thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom the Lord thy God shall choose: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother.

The first of their kings was Saul, who God had Samuel the prophet anoint - showing that he was the person of the people who God choose to be that king they wanted like the surrounding nations.

In Revelation 13, we read of the false prophet. Mostly likely when the Jews receive the Antichrist as their King of Israel mashiach, descended from David, the false prophet will be the one (like Samuel and successive prophets anointed the Kings) who will anoint the Antichrist as King of Israel.

Messiah actually means anointed.

So the Antichrist has to be a Jew and also give some reason for the Jews to believe is is descended from King David.

 

[Interplanner]

That list would be handy if it mentioned any from the 1st century.

I don't know what Jesus' telling his own disciples 'it was not for them to know the times or seasons' has to do with radicals/fundamentalists in Judaism at the time claiming to be Messiahs.

Besides Judas the Galilean's sons, and Barrabbas (insurrection), etc., Theudas (also put in the category of a 'messiah' with Judas by Gamaliel to be ignored, Acts 5), there were Simon bar Giora, Phineas, and finally John of Gischala trying to lead Israel as "kings."

Again, I thought we were talking about those who claimed to be king, and who were destructive characters actually. Whether they denied Jesus of Nazareth as Christ is either apparent or deliberate.

 

[Douggg]

Ok, so you have zip with the scriptures I quoted concerning the coming of antichrist (spirit)

I was not addressing the spirit of antichrist. But "the" Antichrist, the King of Israel, mashiach, in lieu of Jesus being the one God sent to be their king.

Now to your second assumption concerning "another coming in his own name".

Jesus was referring to men accepting their own, as those of the world also receive their own.

Actually, that is not correct. Above his head, on the cross, Pilate had a sign placed saying... "Jesus of Nazreth, King of the Jews". What crucify your king? Jesus was clearly rejected by the Jews as their King mashiach, just as he told Nicodemus, because he came in the name of God, which they would not accept that he was God come in the flesh.

John 5:41-43

King James Version (KJV)

41 I receive not honour from men.
42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive."


Jesus was not talking about a coming antichrist here, but rather carnally minded men receiving their own kind. Just as it is written "no man" receives Gods spiritual testimony."

No, actually he was speaking about the Antichrist, because his crucifixion and why they had him put to death is that they rejected him as King, receiving him not. The another (not others) coming in his own they would receive as their King mashiach is in reference to the Antichrist.

So that point is a fail as well. Lets look at your next verse in Isaiah.

Isaiah14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
20 Thou shalt not be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land, and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.

This message is twofold, the Lord is not only talking to the king of Babylon "the man", but also the spirit working in the man (Lucifer). Also notice the last part of that verse speaks of many "the seed of evil doers" or children of their father the devil. (wicked generation)

The king of Babylon is a code name of course, but "the man" is the Antichrist, the abominable branch. When he is brought back to life, he will not die a physical death again to join them in burial, but will be cast alive into the lake of fire at Jesus's return. Them who follow evildoers will not be remembered in any thing other than contempt and disgrace.

 

[Douggg]

That list would be handy if it mentioned any from the 1st century.

I don't know what Jesus' telling his own disciples 'it was not for them to know the times or seasons' has to do with radicals/fundamentalists in Judaism at the time claiming to be Messiahs.

to restore the Kingdom to Israel. In other words to have Kings again. The false christs never became King of Israel because the Kingdom of Israel was not restored in the days of the apostles.

Besides Judas the Galilean's sons, and Barrabbas (insurrection), etc., Theudas (also put in the category of a 'messiah' with Judas by Gamaliel to be ignored, Acts 5), there were Simon bar Giora, Phineas, and finally John of Gischala trying to lead Israel as "kings."

Again, I thought we were talking about those who claimed to be king, and who were destructive characters actually. Whether they denied Jesus of Nazareth as Christ is either apparent or deliberate.

They can claim desire anything, but the Jews had not received them as their King. John of Gischala wanted to be ruler of Jerusalem btw, mayor a person could say, not King of Israel. They were false christs. They never made it to the King of Israel stage. Remember the Pharisees were thinking if Jesus was anointed as King, not only just as King but that special "the" King messiah, what would the Romans do? They used that as an excuse to kill him.

They have to be anointed to even be a King of Israel. The false prophet will likely be the one who anoints the Antichrist as King of Israel.

Inter, why don't you just look up on the internet - Dates of Kings of Israel?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

The king of Babylon is a code name of course, but "the man" is the Antichrist, the abominable branch.

Your making alot of assumptions Doug, like "the man" is the Antichrist (when scripture clearly says antichrist is a spirit who works in many.

And the king of Babylon is not a code name as you say, but rather it was to whom the Lord was speaking the parable to as scripture plainly shows....

Isaiah 14:4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!

A whole doctrine of a coming man called "Antichrist" is built on nothing more than assumptions, speculations, and a lack of understanding into what the Spirit is truly saying in the scriptures.

 

[Douggg]

Your making alot of assumptions Doug, like "the man" is the Antichrist (when scripture clearly says antichrist is a spirit who works in many.

And the king of Babylon is not a code name as you say, but rather it was to whom the Lord was speaking the parable to as scripture plainly shows....

Isaiah 14:4 That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased!

A whole doctrine of a coming man called "Antichrist" is built on nothing more than assumptions, speculations, and a lack of understanding into what the Spirit is truly saying in the scriptures.

Likewise, in Ezekiel 28:12-17, is to the King of Tyrus. Who do you think these verses are talking about?

12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.


Who are those verses talking about?

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Likewise, in Ezekiel 28:12-17, is to the King of Tyrus. Who do you think these verses are talking about?

12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord God; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.


Who are those verses talking about?

It's the same thing as I showed you with the king of Babylon being spoken of as Lucifer, and Peter being called Satan. The message is twofold. The Lord is speaking not only to the man, but also the spirit who entered into man (Adam is man in Hebrew) in the garden of God. The devil was the serpent figure in the garden, and was never perfect as man (Adam) was before iniquity entered into Adam.

Same thing here with the king of Egypt. Ezekiel 29:3 Speak, and say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, Pharaoh king of Egypt, the great dragon that lieth in the midst of his rivers, which hath said, My river is mine own, and I have made it for myself.

Satan is also symbolized as the great red dragon, but that does make Pharaoh Satan.

All these things are symbolism's of those who would be made in the likeness of their father the Devil. (the lusts and desires of their father they will do)

They are a seed of evil doers, sons of belial, wicked generation, generations of vipers, serpents, etc (because they all have the same spirit working in them)

The spirit of antichrist is a lying spirit (opposite of the Spirit of Truth). Now here's a symbolism of how one single lying spirit can work in many false prophets.

1 Kings 22:22 And the Lord said unto him, Wherewith? And he said, I will go forth, and I will be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets. And he said, Thou shalt persuade him, and prevail also: go forth, and do so.

Satan (father of lies) works in all his false prophets by his single spirit of a lie working in many.

It's the same way God speaks through all his holy prophets and Saints, by One Spirit. (Spirit of Truth)

So though we be many, we are made into one Body united by One Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

So just think the opposite of that when trying to figure out the unholy triune (Dragon, beast, false prophet spirit) which empowers, and works in many evil doers.

 

[Interplanner]

That same principle of symbolism is important to remember all through OT visions

 

[St Phoebe]

Hi Doug

God remembers the covenant that he has made with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, his covenant with the Jews and they have rejected Him over and over. He send the prophets over and over to show them their wrongs like the parable that Jesus told of the landowner, eventually He sent His Son and they killed Him this was the 70 week prophecy that Daniel spoke of that was determined upon Gods people the Jews. 27 AD, Jesus baptized, you know Messiah anointed one, And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself, Jesus crucified in 31 AD and And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week right up till 34 AD when Stephen gave that long sermon to them and they stoned him. The message went to the Gentiles. Now God will keep His covenant and save the remnant that was true and has not defiled themselves 144 000 but this end time scenes are not about the Jews for as in Rev the whole world will follow after the beast 9not just the Jews). In the old covenant God has set the standard - 14 When thou art come unto the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me;
15 Thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom the Lord thy God shall choose: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother. Jesus in His day has reached out to the gentiles because He was rejected by His own people. Whoever believe on His name shall be saved, Gentiles and Jews but the end time battle and prophecies are not about the Jews only, it is about Gods people - spiritual Jews. Do you think that God would have reached out to all to at the end of time make it only about the Jews? The bible says peace, peace then sudden destruction. The nations will come together, Jews, Muslims & Christians following the beast then shall Jesus come for His people. Jesus is the descendent from David, the King of the Jews like how you said but they did not accept Him. God will send them a delusion to believe a lie for the truth is not in them. They will accept the stranger and not the true shepherd. The antichrist might not be a Jew.

 

[Bible2]

Douggg said in post 10:

Jesus was clearly rejected by the Jews as their King mashiach, just as he told Nicodemus, because he came in the name of God, which they would not accept that he was God come in the flesh.

Are you thinking of John 5:43? If so, note that it wasn't addressed to Nicodemus. Also, note that nothing requires that John 5:43b refers to the Antichrist, instead of to an ultra-Orthodox Jewish false "Messiah" whom the Antichrist will "cut" a 7-year peace treaty with (Daniel 9:26a,27a), after the Antichrist defeats him and his followers (Daniel 11:22-23a).

Anyone who receives the Antichrist can never be saved (Revelation 14:9-11), whereas there will be Jews who will be saved after the time of the Antichrist, at Jesus' 2nd coming (Romans 11:26, Zechariah 12:10-14). Therefore, not all Jews will receive the Antichrist. They could survive his reign by hiding from him. And those in Jerusalem could be protected from him by the two witnesses (Revelation 11:3,5).

*******

Douggg said in post 13:

Likewise, in Ezekiel 28:12-17, is to the King of Tyrus. Who do you think these verses are talking about?

If Ezekiel 28:2 has application to future events, because of its similarity to the never-fulfilled 2 Thessalonians 2:4, then the prince of Tyre could be the future human ruler commonly called the Antichrist (Daniel 11:36, Revelation 13:5-18). If that's the case, then the king of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:12) could be Lucifer/Satan (the dragon), who will empower the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") (Revelation 13:4, Revelation 12:9; 2 Thessalonians 2:9). Lucifer, before his fall and man's fall, could have been placed as a covering cherub over Eden (Ezekiel 28:13-15).

There's a curious correlation between the prince and the king of Tyre on the one hand (Ezekiel 28), and the use of the name Hiram in the mystical teachings of a worldwide secret society which teaches Gnostic Luciferianism at its highest degree of initiation. For Hiram was the name of the human king of Tyre at the time of the building of King Solomon's temple (1 Kings 5). Also, Hiram was the name of another person from Tyre, the human master workman who helped Solomon build the temple (1 Kings 7:13-14). If the king and the prince of Tyre addressed in Ezekiel 28 are Lucifer and the Antichrist, then the name Hiram would be a perfect code name (not the actual name) for both of them, a name by which their identity within the Gnostic Luciferian teachings of the worldwide secret society could be kept secret from all but its highest-level initiates. Just as the human workman named Hiram built a temple to God in which all the world was to worship (1 Kings 8:41-43), so the Antichrist will bring the world into the worship of Lucifer (Revelation 13:4), when the Antichrist gains power over the earth (Revelation 13:7).

The Antichrist's future Luciferian rule over the earth could be pictured by the most common, publicly known symbol for the worldwide secret society, in which a drafting/measuring compass, an instrument shaped like the two legs of an "A" (as in "Antichrist"), is sometimes shown standing on top of a globe of the earth. And beneath, as in support of the "A" is a drafting/measuring square, an instrument shaped like an "L" (as in "Lucifer"). Also, found within the "L" is the letter "G", which could ultimately stand for the (false) "Gnosis" (knowledge) of Gnosticism (cf. the original Greek of 1 Timothy 6:20b), which the secret society (mistakenly) thinks can be found in Lucifer. The Antichrist will teach the ancient Gnostic lie that YHWH God is evil (Revelation 13:6, Daniel 11:36), and the ancient Gnostic lie that Christ isn't in the flesh (1 John 4:3). The Antichrist will also deny that Jesus is the Christ (1 John 2:22).

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Ultimately, the power behind the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) will be Lucifer/Satan (the dragon) (Revelation 13:4, Revelation 12:9; 2 Thessalonians 2:9), just as the controllers of the unsaved world have always been (and are still currently) Lucifer and his fallen angels (Ephesians 6:12, Ephesians 2:2-3). And there could also be a secret cabal of human world leaders in big business, finance, intelligence agencies, federal law enforcement, politics, the media/entertainment, the military, and religion, who know this fact, and so have secretly become worshippers of Lucifer in order to obtain from him all of the world's power, wealth, and pleasures that they can (cf. Matthew 4:9).

These Luciferians could have been working secretly together for some time (including through a worldwide secret society which teaches Gnostic Luciferianism at its highest degree of initiation) to prepare the way politically, economically, culturally, militarily, and religiously for a single Luciferian human world leader (the Antichrist) to take hegemony over the whole earth (Revelation 13:7b) and, along with his miracle-working False Prophet, to deceive the world into the open worship of Lucifer and the Antichrist (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 19:20). God will let them succeed in this, but for less than 4 years (Revelation 13:5b, Daniel 12:11-12), before Jesus Christ returns from heaven and defeats them completely (Revelation 19:20 to 20:3). Jesus will then set up his own, 1,000-year, physical kingdom on the earth with the bodily resurrected church (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 66:3-4, Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:8-21).

 

[Bible2]

St Phoebe said in post 16:

The antichrist might not be a Jew.

The Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") definitely won't be a religious Jew. For during his future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-18), the Antichrist won't support Judaism in its past and current form, insofar as Judaism worships YHWH (Deuteronomy 6:4-5), whereas the Antichrist will utterly revile YHWH (Daniel 11:36, Revelation 13:5). And Judaism rejects Lucifer/Satan as being evil (Zechariah 3:2, Isaiah 14:12), whereas the Antichrist will bring the world into the worship of Lucifer/Satan (the dragon) (Revelation 13:4, Revelation 12:9). And Judaism forbids the worship of any images (Leviticus 26:1), whereas the Antichrist will have an image made of himself to be worshipped (Revelation 13:15).

Regarding the idea of the Antichrist being Jewish by blood, both his parents could be Arabs (if his mother wasn't impregnated by Satan). But from some long-ago ancestor, the Antichrist could also have some Jewish blood in him, from the tribe of Dan (Genesis 49:17), which could be the reason that the tribe of Dan isn't included in the 12 tribes of the 144,000 (Revelation 7:4-8; there, "Joseph" stands for Ephraim: Numbers 1:32, Psalms 78:67, Ezekiel 37:16b,19).

The Antichrist could have grown up as a Druze Arab, in Lebanon, in the modern city of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4). So he could at first present himself to the world as being of the (quasi-Islamic) Druze religion, which is waiting for the 2nd coming of a God-man named "Hakim". The Antichrist's last name could be "Hakim", and he could at first present himself to the Druze people as the fulfillment of the 2nd coming of this God-man. In this way, he could get the Druze to support him without question during an initial rise to power among the Arabs. The Druze Arabs could be the numerically "small people" of Daniel 11:23. The Antichrist could make them his completely-devoted bodyguard, and buy them many key positions of power within a future United Arab States (which the Antichrist could become the leader of in the first stage of his world takeover), and employ the Druze as loyal spies and assassins at every level of his United Arab government and military.

The Druze religion is very secretive. What it teaches to its higher-level initiates isn't even taught to its lower-level initiates. What it could teach to its higher-level initiates could basically be Gnosticism mixed in with the Hakim God-man idea. The Antichrist himself, while outwardly a Druze, could inwardly be a Gnostic Luciferian. He could be a highest-level initiate of a worldwide secret society which ultimately teaches Gnostic Luciferianism, but keeps this a secret even from its own members who haven't been initiated into its highest level.

 

[St Phoebe]

Antichrist being an Arab/muslim does make sense. Gods son of promise to Abraham was Isaac, son of slavery - Ishmael - Hagar Sarahs slave son. Can son of slavery and son of perdition possibly mean the same thing??? God's covenant started with Abraham and God also makes Himself known as the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. The muslims however believes that Abraham was commanded by God to sacrifice Ishmael his son and not Isaac. Antichrist some Jewish blood yes from Abraham. The Antichrist will speak words against the most High. Satan from the beginning spoke words against God thus changing what the bible says and satan/dragon will give his power and authority to the beast/antichrist. They say YHWH reversed and compressed in Arabic is Allah also for muslims 6 is a holy number therefore the 6th day of the week is their holy day as humans was created on the 6th day and the Quran is also 6 and the name Allah is also interpreted as 6 and their prophet Muhammed also means 6 . 666, the number of the beast. As we are trying to figure out endtime prophecy, can I say things like this on this forum???

 

[Douggg]

And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself, Jesus crucified in 31 AD and And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week right up till 34 AD when Stephen gave that long sermon to them and they stoned him.

What does Stephen death have to do with the claim that Jesus confirmed the covenant for 7 years? Jesus is not the prince who shall come. And is not the one who confirms the covenant for 7 years.

Jesus arrived in Jerusalem that last passover week, riding a donkey, hailed as King messiah; then 4 days later was crucified.

Now God will keep His covenant and save the remnant that was true and has not defiled themselves 144 000 but this end time scenes are not about the Jews for as in Rev the whole world will follow after the beast 9not just the Jews).

When the Antichrist reaches the Antichrist-beast stage, he will have already been rejected by the Jews as their King mashiach. As the Antichrist-beast he will not be the King of Israel anymore.

In the old covenant God has set the standard - 14 When thou art come unto the land which the Lord thy God giveth thee, and shalt possess it, and shalt dwell therein, and shalt say, I will set a king over me, like as all the nations that are about me;
15 Thou shalt in any wise set him king over thee, whom the Lord thy God shall choose: one from among thy brethren shalt thou set king over thee: thou mayest not set a stranger over thee, which is not thy brother. Jesus in His day has reached out to the gentiles because He was rejected by His own people. Whoever believe on His name shall be saved, Gentiles and Jews but the end time battle and prophecies are not about the Jews only, it is about Gods people - spiritual Jews.

No such thing as spiritual Jews. Nor spiritual Gentiles.

Do you think that God would have reached out to all to at the end of time make it only about the Jews? The bible says peace, peace then sudden destruction.

The problem is that you have a limited knowledge of Judaism and what they believe regarding the messiah. The messiah in Judaism is supposed to bring about global peace, as well as leading Israel into the messianic age of peace and tranquility. So it will be the entire world thinking they have peace, peace.

From Judaism 101.com. This is what the Jews (Judaism) themselves say (in quotes).

"The term "mashiach" literally means "the anointed one," and refers to the ancient practice of anointing kings with oil when they took the throne. The mashiach is the one who will be anointed as king in the End of Days."

The nations will come together, Jews, Muslims & Christians following the beast then shall Jesus come for His people. Jesus is the descendent from David, the King of the Jews like how you said but they did not accept Him. God will send them a delusion to believe a lie for the truth is not in them. They will accept the stranger and not the true shepherd. The antichrist might not be a Jew.

What made Jesus a Jew was his mother Mary was a Jew. There is no possible way that the Jews will accept a gentile as being the promised mashiach. Go to any Judaism or Jewish site and they will tell you that.

This is from Judaism about what they believe regarding the mashiach. They have biblical basis for their belief. The Antichrist will meet these requirements.

"The mashiach will be a great political leader descended from King David (Jeremiah 23:5). The mashiach is often referred to as "mashiach ben David" (mashiach, son of David). He will be well-versed in Jewish law, and observant of its commandments (Isaiah 11:2-5). He will be a charismatic leader, inspiring others to follow his example. He will be a great military leader, who will win battles for Israel. He will be a great judge, who makes righteous decisions (Jeremiah 33:15). But above all, he will be a human being, not a god, demi-god or other supernatural being. "

So going by what the Jews say above, let's profile the Antichrist.

a political leader - the Antichrist comes on the scene as the little horn surfacing in the EU, as a political leader, Daniel 7.

son of David - the Antichrist has to be a Jew and descended from King David

well versed in Jewish law and torah observant - the Antichrist's religion will be Judaism.

great military leader - the little horn in Daniel prepares for battle in Daniel 8 and heads to Israel in great strength, Daniel 8 - with the intent to stave of Gog/Magog.

The Antichrist will arrive in Israel as the Prince who shall come and be embraced by the Jews as their moshiach - which they say "The mashiach is the one who will be anointed as king in the End of Days."

The Jews believe that Gog/Magog takes place in the end of days, which they also believe we are in those. After Gog/Magog, they believe the mashiach will appear and lead them into the messianic age of peace and harmony, not just for them but globally. The Antichrist will fulfill that expectation they have.

After about 3 1/2 years the Antichrist betrays them and shows his true self as the man of sin, and claims to be God. The Jews will be mortified and will reject him as being their King, and all other levels.

After showing himself to be the man of sin, the Antichrist then becomes the Antichrist-beast which him in Revelation.