3rd Temple coming soon..

[keras]

iamlamad said: Right now we are between the 5th and 6th seals.
This is absolutely correct, we know from Zechariah 1:11 and Zech 6:7, that the 4 horsemen have been released to 'range over the whole earth'.
In Matthew 23:35 Jesus talks about the blood of all those killed for their faith right from Abel and then the 5th seal applies to - 'all who have been slaughtered for God's Word and for the testimony they proclaimed'. Rev 6:9
Therefore the next prophesied event we can expect is the Sixth Seal, which is the Great Day of the wrath of Almighty God and the Lamb. Be aware and be prepared!

Re the Third Temple; Zechariah 8:9 clearly says that the Temple will be rebuilt and it doesn't refer to the 2nd Temple, as all of Zech 8 is end time prophecy, not as yet fulfilled.
Haggai 2:6-9 puts it all beautifully; Next event, the SixthSeal - the Lord will shake the earth and the nations. Then - the treasure of the nations will come to the holy Land and the splendour of the latter house [Temple] will surpass the splendour of the former. The second Temple did not 'surpass the splendour' of Solomon's temple.
The Lord says; In this place I will grant prosperity and peace
This is the promise we should all be looking forward to, living in the holy Land blessed by the Lord and being 'a light to the nations'. as God always intended His people to be. Jeremiah 31:27-28 & 38-39

 

[iamlamad]

Surely thou dost jest!
.

Jesting is something I just don't do. This is REAL.

LAMAD

 

[Bible2]

iamlamad said in post 959:

Jesus will come and catch His bride up, and take her to heaven.

Note that no scripture requires that believers will be raptured any higher than the clouds of the sky (the first heaven), to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus at his 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17). After that meeting, in which the church will be judged by Jesus (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27) and the obedient part of the church will be married to Jesus (Revelation 19:7, Matthew 25:1-13), the obedient part of the church will come back down from the sky (the first heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:15-21) and will reign on the earth with him for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). Then, after the 1,000 years and subsequent events are over (Revelation 20:7-15, Ezekiel chapters 38-39), the obedient part of the church will live on the new earth with God the Father and Jesus in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation chapters 21-22).

iamlamad said in post 959:

THAT is the Escape Luke is talking about.

Note that Luke 21:36 doesn't require a pre-tribulation rapture. For some in the church will escape all of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 by dying before it begins (Isaiah 57:1). And others in the church will escape all of it by being physically protected on the earth during it (Revelation 12:14-16, Psalms 91). Those who will escape it by dying before it begins will stand before the Lord in heaven (Philippians 1:21,23; 2 Corinthians 5:8). And those who will escape it by being miraculously protected on the earth during it will stand before the Lord in the sky at the rapture (1 Thessalonians 4:17), which won't occur until immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8; Revelation 19:7 to 20:6).

 

[keras]

Thank you Bible 2, your post #963 is 100% correct. None of this pretentious nonsense of 'flying' up to heaven - to do what? Strum harps? Get this, you rapturists; we are earth beings, God made angels to serve Him in heaven, but what we look forward to is actually heaven on earth. Rev 21:2
First, all of the holy Land must be cleared and cleansed of the ungodly filth that inhabits it now, then the Lord's people will travel to there, Ezekiel 20:34-38, the righteous ones will enter, Isaiah 35:8-10, they will build the Temple and eventually they will say: 'Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord'. Pray to be among them!

 

[Interplanner]

Wow, Keras,
you're a throwback to Judaism. We're all headed to a restored Judaism, is that it? Have you ever read the letter to Hebrews?

A decision about what kind of worship or temple we are involved with should not be based on making a "rapture" do the right thing, but on the deep currents running in Heb 8-10, Rom 3-4, Gal 3-4, 2 Cor 3-5, Acts 13's sermon, Eph 2-3.

 

[iamlamad]

Thank you Bible 2, your post #963 is 100% correct. None of this pretentious nonsense of 'flying' up to heaven - to do what? Strum harps? Get this, you rapturists; we are earth beings, God made angels to serve Him in heaven, but what we look forward to is actually heaven on earth. Rev 21:2
First, all of the holy Land must be cleared and cleansed of the ungodly filth that inhabits it now, then the Lord's people will travel to there, Ezekiel 20:34-38, the righteous ones will enter, Isaiah 35:8-10, they will build the Temple and eventually they will say: 'Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord'. Pray to be among them!

If you wish to stay behind, and it seems you do, then have at it! God will honor your desire. It is written that you FIND what you seek. But many believers actually BELIEVE John 14, and are seeking to "Live together with Him," as Paul wrote, and "So shall we every be with the Lord." Since Paul's rapture comes BEFORE the Day of the Lord, and as the TRIGGER for that day, we will be caught up and escorted to heaven about 7 years before Jesus comes on the white horse. WHERE IS JESUS during those 7 years? OF COURSE HE IS IN HEAVEN. He will hold the marriage IN HEAVEN. All who MISS the rapture of the Bride will miss the wedding, plain and simple. I want to be there. I would not miss it for the world. Apparently you have no desire to be a part of the Bride. Again, God will honor your wishes.

I guess you missed the verses that say once we are born again, we are citizens of heaven. I have a mansion up there waiting....built by angels. Again, I won't miss it for the world.

I guess in your mind, John 14 should read like this:


2 In my Father's house [in heaven] are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to [heaven to] prepare a place for you [in heaven].
3 And if I go [to heaven] and prepare a place for you [in heaven], I will come again [to the air], and receive you unto myself [in the air]; that where I am [going, to the earth], there [on the earth] ye may be also.

Is this really the intent of the author here? How silly it would be for Jesus to go to heaven to prepare places (abodes, mansions) for us, and then forget them and come to earth. Can you find one verse anywhere that shows us WHERE Jesus is during the 70th week of Daniel (Rev. chapter 8 through chapter 16) other than IN HEAVEN?.

No, the intent of the author is this:

2 In my Father's house [in heaven] are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to [heaven to] prepare a place for you [in heaven].
3 And if I go [to heaven] and prepare a place for you [in heaven], I will come again [to the air], and receive you unto myself [in the air]; that where I am [going, BACK TO HEAVEN], there [IN HEAVEN] ye may be also.

To prove this, WHERE is Jesus in chapter 19? First He is IN HEAVEN at the marriage and supper. Then, and ONLY then, does He get on the white horse and return. The bride will have been in heaven ever since Rev. 6.

Will the Bride "fly?" OF COURSE WE WILL! What has Jesus said in prophecy concerning flying?

[FONT=&quot]"I have given MY Word that this hour would be coming and now it is upon you. Come with ME, WE will take flight. Come into MY Heavenlies. We will fly together. [/FONT]"

"[FONT=&quot]If you want MY Truth and Life everlasting you must turn to ME. Surrender your life to ME fully. Give it into MY Capable Hands for safekeeping. This should be such a simple choice, but the world turns its back to ME. Soon I will leave the world to its choice, with MY bride in MY Loving Arms. We will be joined together in the sky and she will fly away with ME to safety and her lovely homes to heaven—where I have made a safe place for her. She will be unscathed by the troubles coming to the earth."


"[/FONT]The heavenlies open up, all will see. Few will go. It is sad, so few are ready. But, I must come. It is My hour, My destiny to claim My bride. I have waited for this hour. All is ready. My bride awaits. I come for those who are waiting and ready. It will be soon. The hour is now. Now is the hour. Many will be left. They will know it was ME. What a dark day for them. This is truth. I cannot wait forever on My people. Tell them this. My bride finds it worth waiting. She stands ready. I will come to receive her unto Myself. It will be glorious for both her and ME. We will fly as doves to their lattices. I will retrieve My bride and she will be ready for ME. They will divide Israel. You will see and you will come with ME before I pour out My wrath on the world. Pray for your loved ones like never before. The hour is closing in. I come to take my bride and I will put her in a safe place."


"I am coming soon. All is ready for ME to come. The time is drawing near. It is closing in. We will fly away soon. "


"My church is asleep—she sleeps, but My bride is alert. She is awake. She sees the hour. She knows her place. She is awake and ready. She will be moved to glory and fly into the skies just as My word promises. The enemy wants you to think this is all a fantasy. He is a liar—he is the father of lies. He comes to kill and steal. He is arrogant and ruthless."



"Daughter, write it down. Soon the day will come and it is coming fast when I touch down and pick up My bride to deliver her home safely. She will fly with Me home safely and I will bring her home to pamper her, to care for her, to love her, to be with her. We will be together and it will be so glorious. All is prepared for her. She will be received by an army of angels in the air and flown to safety. It will be a wonderful sight. I am anxious for this moment to greet her in the air. It will be a glorious sight. Many will be amazed and startled at this sight. She will be so beautiful. Angels will marvel at her beauty.

I am anxious for her to fly with me to heaven. The preparations have been made to receive her. As we fly to heaven together she will arrive to a beautiful Kingdom and she will see beautiful things. There will be much for her to do and see upon her arrival. She will be amazed at the sight. My people have no idea what wonders await them in their new homes. They will be startled at the sight. It will be a moment of awe and magnitude. I, Jesus will bring her into her new home across the threshold. Together we will explore her new habitation and she will see the wonder awaiting her. "

"[FONT=&quot]The time is closing in. The hour is closing in. Soon, we will fly away to our homes and reside together in bliss. My loved ones, I want you to see how lovely this world is and how you will be so happy. All is ready. Surrender your lives to Me in this hour so that I might take you with Me to your new homes, heavenly homes—to beauty unimaginable—where there is no mar or imperfection. You can see it."

[/FONT]I could find many many more, but you would not believe them either. These were from letters dictated to Susan Davis by Jesus Himself. They are EXACTLY what the Word of God tells us, if you would read without your preconceived glasses on. If you continue on as you believe now, YOU WILL BE LEFT BEHIND to face the beast. The ONLY WAY into heaven at that point will be to refuse the MARK and lose your head. your ONLY other choice will be to take the mark.[FONT=&quot]

LAMAD[/FONT]

 

[keras]

Yes iamlamad, what I look forward to is being with my Lord Jesus Christ. And where will He be? On earth, reigning from a rebuilt Jerusalem. Plenty of scripture supports that.

So is Susan Davis a prophet? Ezekiel 7:26 says there will be no more visions from prophets... All of what she says simply backs up her false pre-mill rapture beliefs.
Jesus went to heaven at His ascension, but He works spiritually on earth, Luke 13:32, proved by how He appears to many who seek Him, starting with Paul on the Damascus road.

Re; the 'many mansions in My Fathers house', heaven is NOT specified as to where that is. We know God owns everything - 'the cattle on a thousand hills' - all the world is His and we are told in Rev 21:3 that God will eventually dwell with mankind on earth.
Here are some prophesies that state how His righteous people will live all of the holy Land; Psalm 69:35, Amos 9:14, 2 Samuel 7:10, Isaiah 54:2-3, Ezekiel 36:10 & 33, Jeremiah 30:18, Isaiah 58:12

 

[Interplanner]

Keras, write a study guide of Hebrews before you go any further.

 

[keras]

Keras, write a study guide of Hebrews before you go any further.

IP, I am quite familiar with the book of Hebrews, as with all of the Bible. I quote from Hebrews frequently; Heb 12:26...once again I shall shake Heaven and earth... And Heb 10:26 26-27 If we persist in sin...there remains only a terrifying expectation of judgement, of a fierce fire that will consume God's enemies.
How do these fit in with your preterist beliefs?

Hebrews 12:5-12 tells us we can expect discipline, before we can 'reap the harvest of a peaceful life and share in His holiness'.
When and what is this discipline and where do we find this peaceful life?

 

[Bible2]

iamlamad said in post 966:

To prove this, WHERE is Jesus in chapter 19? First He is IN HEAVEN at the marriage and supper. Then, and ONLY then, does He get on the white horse and return.

In Revelation 19:14, the original Greek word (ouranos, G3772) translated as "heaven" can refer to the "sky" (Matthew 16:2-3, Luke 12:56), which will be the location of the literal clouds and air of 1 Thessalonians 4:17. Revelation 19:14 refers to the already immortally-resurrected (if dead) or changed (if alive) (1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53) and married obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7) descending with Jesus from the sky (the first heaven), where the church had been raptured to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus at his 2nd coming (1 Thessalonians 4:15-17).

iamlamad said in post 966:

First He is IN HEAVEN at the marriage and supper.

The 10-virgins parable (Matthew 25:1-13) shows that the marriage of the church to Jesus won't occur until his 2nd coming (Matthew 25:10), which Jesus had just finished saying won't occur until "immediately after the tribulation" (Matthew 24:29-31), just like Revelation 19:7 shows that the marriage won't occur until after the (never fulfilled) tribulation, shown in Revelation chapters 6 to 18. The parable's extra oil (Matthew 25:4,9b) could represent the continued good works of believers, by which they will be able to pass the judgment of the church by Jesus (Matthew 25:19-30, Romans 2:6-8) and enter the marriage of the church to Jesus at his 2nd coming (Matthew 25:10, Revelation 19:7-21).

The marriage supper (Revelation 19:9) won't have yet begun by the time of Revelation 19, which won't begin until after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (cf. Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8). For regarding the church, the marriage supper will be a literal feast in the earthly Jerusalem after the resurrection and marriage of the church at Jesus' 2nd coming (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-54). While the church will enjoy a feast "of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined" (Isaiah 25:6), the birds will feast on the corpses of the world's armies defeated at Jesus' 2nd coming (Revelation 19:17-21).

Also, regarding the 10-virgins parable, in Matthew 25:6 "midnight" could represent mid-tribulation, when the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) could be set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31). So when it says "at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh" (Matthew 25:6), this could mean that at the mid-tribulation point when the abomination of desolation is set up, the church will be given the knowledge of the date (as in the year, month, and day) of Jesus' 2nd coming. This date could be the 1,335th day after the abomination of desolation is set up (Daniel 12:11-12, cf. Revelation 16:15).

 

[Interplanner]

Keras,
you don't think with Hebrews, though. The promise never was about the land (ch 11). The worship system can't be returned to except in a delusion or deception (ch 8-10). The whole enterprise of the old covenant is a discarded model of the reality.

 

[iamlamad]

Yes iamlamad, what I look forward to is being with my Lord Jesus Christ. And where will He be? On earth, reigning from a rebuilt Jerusalem. Plenty of scripture supports that.

So is Susan Davis a prophet? Ezekiel 7:26 says there will be no more visions from prophets... All of what she says simply backs up her false pre-mill rapture beliefs.
Jesus went to heaven at His ascension, but He works spiritually on earth, Luke 13:32, proved by how He appears to many who seek Him, starting with Paul on the Damascus road.

Re; the 'many mansions in My Fathers house', heaven is NOT specified as to where that is. We know God owns everything - 'the cattle on a thousand hills' - all the world is His and we are told in Rev 21:3 that God will eventually dwell with mankind on earth.
Here are some prophesies that state how His righteous people will live all of the holy Land; Psalm 69:35, Amos 9:14, 2 Samuel 7:10, Isaiah 54:2-3, Ezekiel 36:10 & 33, Jeremiah 30:18, Isaiah 58:12

You have ignored too many scriptures. Will you live in Judea so you can flee with the Jews and find supernatural protection for the 3 1/2 years? If you live anywhere else, your chances of surviving the murderous onslaught of the Beast will be just about the same as a Jew living in Berlin in 1943.....just about ZERO. Did you not read the two verses that say God will give authority to the BEAST to Overcome the saints? What does that word mean to you? It means you will be CAUGHT, tortured, and forced to either take the mark or lose your head. In other words, YOU WILL NEVER MAKE IT to the Sheep and Goat judgment, and then (if you pass) into the Millennial Reign of Christ.

God's plan for you is to be ready and watching and be caught up into heaven BEFORE the Day of the Lord starts, to ESCAPE all these things. Yes, I agree, there are plenty of verses that support Jesus' millennial kingdom. But you are ignoring all the scriptures from here, now, to there, then. Your chances of getting there are just about ZERO.

AGain you are MISSED New Testement verses. the Gift of Prophecy is a very legitimate give for the New Testament church. Do you ignore the New Testament and hope to live under the Old? If so, you must read Hebrews. Yes, Susan would be in the office of a prophet. If you search "I am coming" "susan Davis" you will find her web site. I have found nothing in her prophecies that would give me one hint she is off in her prophecies. Jesus dictates letters to His body on earth, and she writes.

Yes, of course Jesus is the HEAD of the Body of Christ on earth, and certainly works with the body. I have not seen Him, but He has spoken to me on many occasions and I have heard His voice.

AGain you are missing the clear meaning of His word. He said, I GO TO PREPARE A PLACE for you. WHERE did He go? We have at least one dozen verses telling us He went to be at the right hand of the Father. WHERE is the Father? He is on His throne in heaven. Over the past 20 years or so, God has taken MANY to heaven, to see it. Many have SEEN the throne and SEEN the Father on the throne, but not clearly. They only see an outline due to the Glory cloud. One man saw Jesus walk right into the Father and the two become one. Then SAw Jesus walk right back out of the Father and they were two again. Many have seen the prepared tables in heaven, along the river of life as far as the eye can see, for the marriage supper of the Lamb. Some here think this marriage will take place somewhere else, but they are very wrong. It is going to be in heaven, and if people MISS the pretrib rapture, they will miss the wedding - unless they lose their head and arrive in heaven in their spirit. My guess is, then they will be guests at the wedding.

Many too have seen the mansions in heaven. Some have seen their OWN mansion. They are all finished and waiting for us. But sadly, many will not get there to see their mansion, for they will not believe in the rapture that will take them there. Others will not have a beautiful mansion, for they have not given anything to Jesus for building materials. They hold too tight to their money.

LAMAD

 

[iamlamad]

Keras,
you don't think with Hebrews, though. The promise never was about the land (ch 11). The worship system can't be returned to except in a delusion or deception (ch 8-10). The whole enterprise of the old covenant is a discarded model of the reality.

As Paul wrote, if there were not problems with the first covenant, then God would not have done a second covenant. The problem with the first: it was between God and them...and "them" would not keep their end of the covenant, but kept wandering after gods of wood and stone.

The New Covenant was different: it was a covenant between the Father and the Son, and the SON fulfilled His part. All we have to do is BELIEVE.

However, just as God allowed animal sacrifices in history, point forward in time to Jesus' sacrifice; in the future, God will again allow animal sacrifices pointing BACK in time to Jesus death on the cross. This will be a continual REMINDER of what God did for us.

LAMAD

 

[Interplanner]

In a place where God and the Lamb are the temple? I don't think so.

 

[iamlamad]

In a place where God and the Lamb are the temple? I don't think so.

You can disagree all you want. You are not disagreeing with me, but with God. Did you not read Ezekiel?

Ezekiel 44:11 Yet they shall be ministers in my sanctuary, having charge at the gates of the house, and ministering to the house: they shall slay the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people, and they shall stand before them to minister unto them.

Lamad

 

[Interplanner]

Who says that is either literal or future? A new temple has come. The letter of Hebrews has been written. You can't ignore revelation that supercedes.

 

[keras]

IP- say this is superseded;
Israel is not rejected
Leviticus 26:40-43 Even though the Israelites confess their iniquity, their own and that of their forefathers, I in My turn will oppose them while they live in the enemies land. If then, their stubborn spirit is broken and they accept their punishment in full, I shall remember My Covenant with the Patriarchs and I shall remember the Land. The Land, bereft of its rightful people will enjoy in full its Sabbaths, while it lies desolate. My people will pay their penalty in full because they spurned My statutes and judgements.
Leviticus 26:44-45 Yet, even while they live outside their Land, I will not have so rejected them as to bring them to an end and break My Covenant with them, because I am the Lord their God. I shall remember on their behalf, the Covenant that I made with their ancestors, whom I brought out of Egypt. I am Y’hovah.

Deuteronomy 30:1-5 When all these things have happened to you in the nations to which I have banished you, if you and your children turn back to the Lord and obey His commands with your heart and soul: Then the Lord, your God will restore your fortunes. In compassion for you, He will gather you again from the peoples, even from the ends of the earth. He will fetch you home, back to the land of your ancestors and you will occupy it once again. You will be more prosperous and numerous than your forefathers.
Deuteronomy 30:6-10 The Lord your God will circumcise your hearts, so that you will love Him and obey His commands, and then you will live. All the curses that you endured will be turned against your enemies, those who persecute you. He will make you more prosperous in all that you do, in your families and the produce of the Land. When you turn back to your God with all your heart, He will again rejoice over you and do you good.
Although there is a spiritual dimension to the end times, the fact remains; the holy Land is still there, the true Israelites, [be they descendants or grafted in] are in the world and just simple literal reading of Scripture confirms a soon to happen fulfilment of how they will travel to and live in all of that Land.

 

[Interplanner]

Yes, they would be restored if they repented, but the restoration is to God, not the land. See Isaiah 11 where the remnant theme starts and is validated so heavily by the NT.

The grafting in? That's Gentiles who are part of the new Israel. The "Israel" the "us" the "remnant" the "elect" in Rom 9-11 is transcultural. It is not on the ethnos level.

I'm sure that in terms of the conduct sought by the old covenant, God expressed some mercy and compassion like the Leviticus passage says for their failure. But then the new covenant happens and the proofs of it. If a Jewish person does not accept it, says Peter, they will be extirpated--disinherited.

the great act mercy you seem to be seeking in the restored land, is actually to be found in the offer of justification from sins to all nations in the mission of the Gospel. Because of the magnitude of that offer, there is really no point to the land promise. This is why Rom 3 bursts with "now the righteousness (the covenant reliability) of God is revealed...(in the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ)."

A 'spiritual dimension to the end times' huh? Sounds very feeble. There is no end times without the pouring of the Spirit, which is what happens in Acts 2 and is interp'd by the apostles as such. There is no OT "restoration" without the Spirit coming in power, whether there is anything about the land or not. That's what circumcises hearts, which makes real Israelites (Rom 2).

 

[ebedmelech]

The church is tho temple! Remember? We're "living stones" being "built up into a spiritual house"!

 

[keras]

The NT does not abrogate the OT. Say all you like that the Land has no significance, but it still remains, it is still viewed by most of the world as a special place. Hardly a day goes by without some mention of it in the news, it is obviously the flashpoint for another war.
The quotes I gave in #977 absolutely refer to the physical holy Land. God promised Abraham and his descendants that Land, He will honour that promise - just takes a little longer that we expected!
Re the Holy Spirit; Ezekiel 39:28-29 They will know that I am the Lord, [before the Return]....I bring them from their exile back to their homeland and I will pour My Spirit upon them. So many other prophesies confirm this physical homecoming of all the Israelites, where they will live in peace, 'displaying His Holiness through them' - v27.
I ask you and Ebed to seriously consider the truth and logical sensibility of what the prophets tell us will happen in the end times. Christ came to fulfil the prophesies about Him, so the OT was 100% correct about that, now what about all the rest, so far unfulfilled?