3 reasons the American Revolution was a mistake

[stamperben]

Interesting thoughts here. Although I find all three reasons credible, for the sake of discussion I'd want participants here to focus on the 3rd reason:

America would have a better system of government if we'd stuck with Britain

Honestly, I think earlier abolition alone is enough to make the case against the revolution, and it combined with less-horrible treatment of American Indians is more than enough. But it's worth taking a second to praise a less important but still significant consequence of the US sticking with Britain: we would've, in all likelihood, become a parliamentary democracy rather than a presidential one.​

Some compelling ideas in there, it might make for an interesting discussion on this the 238th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence.
Link is here at VOX

Of course if anyone wishes to take on the first two reasons, have at it. Have a happy and safe 4th of July!

 

[Armoured]

Because it was base treason by opportunists and oath breakers against their legitimate sovereign government.

 

[Maren]

Interesting thoughts here. Although I find all three reasons credible, for the sake of discussion I'd want participants here to focus on the 3rd reason:

America would have a better system of government if we'd stuck with Britain

Honestly, I think earlier abolition alone is enough to make the case against the revolution, and it combined with less-horrible treatment of American Indians is more than enough. But it's worth taking a second to praise a less important but still significant consequence of the US sticking with Britain: we would've, in all likelihood, become a parliamentary democracy rather than a presidential one.​

Some compelling ideas in there, it might make for an interesting discussion on this the 238th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence.
Link is here at VOX

Of course if anyone wishes to take on the first two reasons, have at it. Have a happy and safe 4th of July!

I think the author is kidding himself, he seems largely to try and look at only what the optimal outcome might have been. As he points out, a far higher percentage of Native Canadians lost their lives compared Native Americans -- that was obviously not better. Nor did Mexico do better, even if they did call those Native Americans "citizens" -- they still had a similar war with them.

What I think he misses is how the United States largely kept the European wars from being fought in the America's -- though we did still have pieces of it with the Mexican-American and Spanish-American wars. Instead, you are far more likely to have much of the United States still under Mexican rule -- or possibly there would be a nation of "Tejas" that would have broken off of Mexico but never absorbed by Britain (who likely would have had no interest in absorbing colonies that were legally part of Spain/Mexico).

Perhaps slavery would have ended sooner, or perhaps that would have sparked a different revolution with Virginia and other southern states leading, rather than Massachusetts and different founding fathers. It might have just ended with a different "United States" where slavery was legal everywhere, where slavery would have lasted much longer, and ended with just as bad, or worse, racial problems.

Last, you have to wonder if even the Parliamentary style of government would have had the same momentum. We saw that type of government largely fail in France about that time and, without America's success with a democratic-republic, it likely would have changed the way governments were viewed.

Last, particularly if the "US" had been split into areas originally owned by France and Spain, would WW1 or WW2 ended up the same? Granted, without a US world history could have been much different, to the point that Franz Ferdinand and Hitler never became the cause for war. OTOH, without a country the size of the US that had close ties to Britain, either or both wars could have ended far differently.

I think there are too many variables to predict what might have happened if the US had never rebelled. I don't think it is at all clear that things would have been better.

 

[NightHawkeye]

I think there are too many variables to predict what might have happened if the US had never rebelled. I don't think it is at all clear that things would have been better.

The closest we can get is to look at how English colonies around the world fared. Overall, it's not clear that any fared better than the US did though some certainly have excelled in specific areas.

The wild card with that sort of simplistic assessment though is whether British colonies would have matured as they did without the US leading the way. I tend to think not, but maybe that's just me.

 

[Maren]

The closest we can get is to look at how English colonies around the world fared. Overall, it's not clear that any fared better than the US did though some certainly have excelled in specific areas.

The wild card with that sort of simplistic assessment though is whether British colonies would have matured as they did without the US leading the way. I tend to think not, but maybe that's just me.

As I pointed out in my post, I tend to agree that the other colonies would not have fared as well without the US. It is also worth pointing out that the other (non-North American) British Colonies also had major issues with their native populations -- with South Africa sticking out as an exceptionally poor example.

 

[Oafman]

I always knew you guys would eventually realise what a mistake you made.

You angered God when you overthrew a Monarch whom He had appointed. The terrorists who organised your revolution decided they knew more than God about appointing rulers, and as a consequence you now have the Antichrist in charge.

It's not too late to come back under our wing. Us Brits do not hold grudges. Simply end your sedition, submit to the will of the Monarch, and help us in our ongoing war against the smelly leftwing French. And all will be forgiven.

 

[Armoured]

I always knew you guys would eventually realise what a mistake you made.

You angered God when you overthrew a Monarch whom He had appointed. The terrorists who organised your revolution decided they knew more than God about appointing rulers, and as a consequence you now have the Antichrist in charge.

It's not too late to come back under our wing. Us Brits do not hold grudges. Simply end your sedition, submit to the will of the Monarch, and help us in our ongoing war against the smelly leftwing French. And all will be forgiven.

As a citizen of the Commonwealth, I cannot allow such an offer be made without Washington being exhumed and retroactively hanged, drawn and quartered, as his treason against God and his country demands.

 

[Oafman]

As a citizen of the Commonwealth, I cannot allow such an offer be made without Washington being exhumed and retroactively hanged, drawn and quartered, as his treason against God and his country demands.

Sure. We could send a quarter to each corner of the Empire, to serve as a warning to any potential rabble-rousers.

 

[ChristsSoldier115]

 

[Armoured]

Sure. We could send a quarter to each corner of the Empire, to serve as a warning to any potential rabble-rousers.

Sounds good. And a fifth quarter be displayed on London Bridge, as tradition demands.

 

[Oafman]

That's funny.

And it reminded me of the date. Happy 4th of July to all uppity colonials!

 

[Jan Volkes]

The closest we can get is to look at how English colonies around the world fared. Overall, it's not clear that any fared better than the US did though some certainly have excelled in specific areas.

The wild card with that sort of simplistic assessment though is whether British colonies would have matured as they did without the US leading the way. I tend to think not, but maybe that's just me.

Which colonies were these?

 

[outsidethecamp]

That's funny.

And it reminded me of the date. Happy 4th of July to all uppity colonials!

“You have no right to ask, or expect that she will at once profess unbounded love to that Union from which for four years she tried to escape at the cost of her best blood and all her treasure. Nor can you believe her to be so unutterably hypocritical, so base, as to declare that the flag of the Union has already surpassed in her heart the place which has so long been sacred to the ‘Southern Cross.’ ”
General Wade Hampton

 

[Maren]

Having reread the OP, and to try and turn discussion back, at least a bit, toward what he wanted, while I don't think it would have helped if the US had not revolted, I do think the US would benefit from a Parliamentary style government today.

I find our current system to often bogs down; how often have we heard the term "do nothing Congress". We have the party out of power trying to block what the party in power is trying to do. We've seen one party attempt to pass something, and despite the other party previously trying to pass it, that party is now trying to block it because they don't want the other side to "get credit."

Instead, I see an advantage in letting one party run the government, at least until they no longer have the confidence of the people. In this way they have no excuse for not doing what they said they would and, if things go wrong, they would be seen as responsible for it.

I do disagree with the author, I do think Wyoming should have equal representation in the Senate to a large state, like California. This was devised, and is, a protection for the smaller states, so their needs are not overruled or ignored by states with more population.

 

[Gadarene]

Erm...lol, seriously.

"British Empire" spring to anyone's mind? Yeah, that period of British history was totes amaze for non-white subjects of our colonies.

 

[TerranceL]

What a stupid article. Kiddo who wrote needs to take a entry level history course.

I have a friend who lived most of her life in India, she told me once about the leftovers from the British rule, signs on buildings that read, "No dogs, no Indians allowed".

 

[Armoured]

What a stupid article. Kiddo who wrote needs to take a entry level history course.

I have a friend who lived most of her life in India, she told me once about the leftovers from the British rule, signs on buildings that read, "No dogs, no Indians allowed".

Whereas the US has always been a paragon of racial equality.

 

[TerranceL]

Whereas the US has always been a paragon of racial equality.

You'd have to be daft to believe that's what I was saying.

I'm pointing out how little knowledge the author has of the empire he is comparing to the US.

 

[Armoured]

You'd have to be daft to believe that's what I was saying.

I'm pointing out how little knowledge the author has of the empire he is comparing to the US.

There's a word for people who criticise others of behaviour they themselves are guilty of.

 

[nightflight]

I always knew you guys would eventually realise what a mistake you made.

You angered God when you overthrew a Monarch whom He had appointed. The terrorists who organised your revolution decided they knew more than God about appointing rulers, and as a consequence you now have the Antichrist in charge.

It's not too late to come back under our wing. Us Brits do not hold grudges. Simply end your sedition, submit to the will of the Monarch, and help us in our ongoing war against the smelly leftwing French. And all will be forgiven.

Okay, but leave the cooking to us.